Pattern Takes You Anywhere, Logrus ... makes a Pizza?

[Panjumanju]

When one my PCs who just essayed the Logrus expected it to grant him something, just like Amberites who transverse the pattern get to go anywhere...anywhere-anywhere through magical barriers or what-have-you.

They expect something comparable with the Pattern, but as far as I can tell from the source text, the Logrus just grants you temporary insanity.

So, I said, and it worked very well for the game, that the Logrus could reach out into anywhere-anywhere and bring you something. Rather than you going somewhere, something was coming to you. It worked out very well.

Who has run into this circumstance in their game? What are some other solutions to this problem that people have put forward?

//Panjumanju

[daniel_ream]

There's a sample size of exactly one, but Merlin got Frakir because he forgot he had it on his wrist when he essayed the Logrus.  When he came out the other end, Frakir was alive and sentient.

So you could allow your PCs to take something with them and have it come out the other end empowered.  In keeping with the theme of the Logrus, I would not allow them to define its abilities (or at least, not let them define all its abilities).

[Rel Fexive]

The Logrus should not be predictable. Neither should it be the same as Pattern, in order to keep things interesting.

[Panjumanju]

The Logrus should not be predictable. Neither should it be the same as Pattern, in order to keep things interesting.

I'm more interested in keeping this balanced. Already players complain that Logrus is too expensive (because of Shapeshifting) and not as powerful (whatever "poweful" means) as the Pattern.

Would you have the Logrus do some random thing each time it is essayed? That's a not a bad idea, just...unpredictable? I suppose that's in keeping with theme.

//Panjumanju

[daniel_ream]

I'm more interested in keeping this balanced.

That's probably going to be a fool's errand.  ADRPG isn't balanced, at all, and trying to make it so is fighting one of the core conceits of the game.

[finarvyn]

If an item becomes sentient it becomes more of an ally than an item. Nothing says that the item has to continue to support or befriend the person who brought it onto the Pattern or Logrus.

[Werekoala]

Sentient pizza...

?

[Rel Fexive]

I'm more interested in keeping this balanced. Already players complain that Logrus is too expensive (because of Shapeshifting) and not as powerful (whatever "poweful" means) as the Pattern.

Would you have the Logrus do some random thing each time it is essayed? That's a not a bad idea, just...unpredictable? I suppose that's in keeping with theme.

//Panjumanju

To be honest, I don't see the Logrus as something you would ever want to assay more than once, so whatever it does do once you complete it should be balanced against the terrible risk of even going anywhere near it.  It's not as cute and cuddly as the Pattern.

[AshenHaze]

Could be remembering this incorrectly, I thought Suhuy told Merlin to bring the cord that became  Frakir with him.  I assumed that a mystical artifact came w/ Logrus.  Mandor had his metal balls, Merlin Frakir so on.

[Norbert G. Matausch]

The Logrus should not be predictable. Neither should it be the same as Pattern, in order to keep things interesting.

I've never seen it this way. Next time we start a new campaign, I'll make the Logrus a bit more random. Looking forward to seeing the results of that experiment.

Thanks!

[weilide]

Could be remembering this incorrectly, I thought Suhuy told Merlin to bring the cord that became  Frakir with him.  I assumed that a mystical artifact came w/ Logrus.  Mandor had his metal balls, Merlin Frakir so on.

Isn't it that Suhuy berates him for not bringing something more useful like a sword or chalice?

[Panjumanju]

Isn't it that Suhuy berates him for not bringing something more useful like a sword or chalice?

I seem to remember something along those lines. Does anyone have a quote?

Can we infer from this some standardisation when it comes to the Logrus or is the Logrus all "I don't have to comform to your norms, man!"?

//Panjumanju

[daniel_ream]

I've been meaning to dredge up this post from the Days Before the Internet, but the thing to remember about the Amber Chronicles is that they're all told by provably unreliable narrators, with agendas, and in a very sparse literary style that deliberately leaves a lot to the imagination.  It's very hard to say anything conclusively positive about the events of the Chronicles, and about the most you can say in a negative sense is that the narrator(s) never explicitly say that such a thing happens or is possible.

There's so little about the Logrus in the Amber Chronicles that you can basically define it any way you want.

[RPGPundit]

I think the Logrus grants that you won't have to fucking go through it ever again to use its power.

But if you want to be more creative than that, I think that part of what might cause the insanity is that the Logrus grants visions; wild crazy visions of shit that may not be, or may not be YET, in that insanity there can be secrets and wisdom or value eventually...

RPGPundit

[greylond]

I seem to remember in one of the later books one of the members of the Courts of Chaos mentions using the Logrus to reach out into Shadow to snag what he wants and bring it to him. Sorta the opposite of the Pattern. The Pattern allows one Transport to a Shadow of His Desire and the Logrus brings One's Desire to Him. Kinda Sorta...