Quote from: RPGPundit on August 09, 2024, 09:59:53 AM

Quote from: Rob Necronomicon on August 08, 2024, 08:07:33 PMI admire Jim's stance on anti-censorship within the gaming sphere.

Has any of his latest products been subject to censorship from Drivthru, does anyone know (I'm not referring to any of the zak stuff)?

Ta'

I specifically talk about that in the video.

I saw you mentioned that... But didn't you say that you 'thought' (if I remember correctly?). What I'm wondering if there is any official word from Raagi about the latest LoTFP material. I know he mentioned that Black Knight (or whatever it's called) would be a problem as it's 'racially fucked' apparently.

But I'm interested to know if Drivethru has suddenly got even more draconian with their censorship recently.

Quote from: Rob Necronomicon on August 09, 2024, 01:46:34 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on August 09, 2024, 09:59:53 AM

Quote from: Rob Necronomicon on August 08, 2024, 08:07:33 PMI admire Jim's stance on anti-censorship within the gaming sphere.

Has any of his latest products been subject to censorship from Drivthru, does anyone know (I'm not referring to any of the zak stuff)?

Ta'

I specifically talk about that in the video.

I saw you mentioned that... But didn't you say that you 'thought' (if I remember correctly?). What I'm wondering if there is any official word from Raagi about the latest LoTFP material. I know he mentioned that Black Knight (or whatever it's called) would be a problem as it's 'racially fucked' apparently.

But I'm interested to know if Drivethru has suddenly got even more draconian with their censorship recently.

Yes. Raggi publicly stated his annoyance at the fact that Drivethru has an "Adult" restricted category and yet somehow a number of his latest books were rejected completely, making him question what the "Adult" category is even for.

AAAAYYYYY!!! Pundit. Merls. Zak. Everybody the Commies killed is back from the outer planes!!!

Quote from: RPGPundit on August 10, 2024, 01:21:10 AM

Quote from: Rob Necronomicon on August 09, 2024, 01:46:34 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on August 09, 2024, 09:59:53 AM

Quote from: Rob Necronomicon on August 08, 2024, 08:07:33 PMI admire Jim's stance on anti-censorship within the gaming sphere.

Has any of his latest products been subject to censorship from Drivthru, does anyone know (I'm not referring to any of the zak stuff)?

Ta'

I specifically talk about that in the video.

I saw you mentioned that... But didn't you say that you 'thought' (if I remember correctly?). What I'm wondering if there is any official word from Raagi about the latest LoTFP material. I know he mentioned that Black Knight (or whatever it's called) would be a problem as it's 'racially fucked' apparently.

But I'm interested to know if Drivethru has suddenly got even more draconian with their censorship recently.

Yes. Raggi publicly stated his annoyance at the fact that Drivethru has an "Adult" restricted category and yet somehow a number of his latest books were rejected completely, making him question what the "Adult" category is even for.

Right... So they have changed their policy then. Despite having a so-called 'adult' section. I mean, we saw the writing on the wall with 'Wight Power' and now they seem to be even more censorious. This is the problem with monopolies (or near monopolies).

Hopefully, he can sell the pdfs from his own site and fuck the middleman.
 

Zak S is a talented writer, but he's burned so many bridges with both sides of the political divide that I don't see any "comeback" occurring.

But who knows? Maybe he'll launch something great on Gamefound instead of Kickstarter and ride a new wave of popularity. Or not.

We will see.

Quote from: Spinachcat on August 10, 2024, 06:51:52 PMZak S is a talented writer, but he's burned so many bridges with both sides of the political divide that I don't see any "comeback" occurring.

But who knows? Maybe he'll launch something great on Gamefound instead of Kickstarter and ride a new wave of popularity. Or not.

We will see.

Well, in my video I explain where Zak is starting his comeback.

This is one reason we really need to support indie creators like Raggi and places that sell alternative material like the Red Room.

Fair play to you, Pundit for releasing your Pundit Presents stuff on their site.

I doubt anyone can ever compete with Drivethru but it would be great if indie authors could at least sell their stuff at alternative places. I don't want to buy products that are censored for politically correct man-babies, personally.

Quote from: Rob Necronomicon on August 11, 2024, 11:50:16 AMThis is one reason we really need to support indie creators like Raggi and places that sell alternative material like the Red Room.

Fair play to you, Pundit for releasing your Pundit Presents stuff on their site.

I doubt anyone can ever compete with Drivethru but it would be great if indie authors could at least sell their stuff at alternative places. I don't want to buy products that are censored for politically correct man-babies, personally.

Hear, hear! As someone who'd never buy the degeneracy found in some of those adult products I fully support their right to peddle their smutt.

Quote from: GeekyBugle on August 11, 2024, 12:07:37 PM

Quote from: Rob Necronomicon on August 11, 2024, 11:50:16 AMThis is one reason we really need to support indie creators like Raggi and places that sell alternative material like the Red Room.

Fair play to you, Pundit for releasing your Pundit Presents stuff on their site.

I doubt anyone can ever compete with Drivethru but it would be great if indie authors could at least sell their stuff at alternative places. I don't want to buy products that are censored for politically correct man-babies, personally.

Hear, hear! As someone who'd never buy the degeneracy found in some of those adult products I fully support their right to peddle their smutt.

Same here, mate. There's a lot of shit out there that would turn my stomach (that or I'd die laughing at), but I support their right to sell it. I think Raggi using the term 'adult category' is a bit misleading because it conjures up smutty and seedy shit in RPGs.

I prefer the term 'mature' as that deals with more Horror and violence, etc.

Zak S is a classic example of the principle that an asshole is still an asshole regardless of where they stand on the controversies du jour.

Quote from: Rob Necronomicon on August 10, 2024, 01:45:23 PMRight... So they have changed their policy then. Despite having a so-called 'adult' section. I mean, we saw the writing on the wall with 'Wight Power' and now they seem to be even more censorious. This is the problem with monopolies (or near monopolies).

Hopefully, he can sell the pdfs from his own site and fuck the middleman.

I remember the bru-ha-ha over the Tokyo Black line releasing a book called "Tournament of Rapists".  People were talking boycotting DriveThru, and Fred Hicks was loudly joining the call, and indy publishers were giving their sob stories about how if you boycotted DriveThru then it'd cut their supplemental income of dozens of pennies, and finally DriveThru pulled it, and everyone felt safe again.

Except for two things: first, it was about -fighting- an evil group of rapists (an idea which is hardly unique to this book), and secondly, only two copies were sold before the public outrage.  So yeah, everybody was upset about something they hadn't even read.  Which... is pretty typical for literature in general honestly, so yay that RPGs are getting the same treatment?

I'm not saying Tokyo Black is a good game line ("let's play D&D mechanics to do stories about Modern Day Japanese Hentai" seems like it'd take a very particular gaming group to play with), but I will say that the same people upset about ToR were the same people who gave White Wolf a pass for all the rape stuff in Exalted (Exalted: Infernals has child gang rape to justify "birthing" said Infernals, and there's a lot of rape art in the Scroll of Swallowed Darkness).  And you can still buy those PDFs just fine on DriveThru.

So the lessons to game developers is "don't put naughty words in your title" and "you -can- depict rape in your game art if people like your game".

Quote from: Habitual Gamer on August 15, 2024, 01:36:25 PMI remember the bru-ha-ha over the Tokyo Black line releasing a book called "Tournament of Rapists".  People were talking boycotting DriveThru, and Fred Hicks was loudly joining the call, and indy publishers were giving their sob stories about how if you boycotted DriveThru then it'd cut their supplemental income of dozens of pennies, and finally DriveThru pulled it, and everyone felt safe again.

Except for two things: first, it was about -fighting- an evil group of rapists (an idea which is hardly unique to this book), and secondly, only two copies were sold before the public outrage.  So yeah, everybody was upset about something they hadn't even read.  Which... is pretty typical for literature in general honestly, so yay that RPGs are getting the same treatment?

This has always been a thing, but it seems to be getting more common. Someone posts outrage on Twitter or Youtube or wherever, and people who had never heard of or seen the book before join in. I think the thing to do is that when people complain about a book without having read it, to hold them especially to erroneous claims about it.

If Fred Hicks is crying about your game then you've probably got something interesting at the very least.

DT do seem to be getting more censorious, however. It can even take just one person to boohoo on the internet (as JhKim pointed out) and the shit hits the fan. Unfortunately they have a near monopoly so you've got to bend the knee to some degree if you're a professional (or aim to be one).

That said, if they reject your material you can just sell it on your own site, or on an alternative platform just advertise the shit out of it on social media, and in any of the other pdfs you sell. So people will know that the product exists. Not a perfect solution but it beats having your products and art sanitized, imo.

But all this 'should be' a moot point because Drivethru technically has a section for mature material. Of course, it's not working as it should, sadly.

Quote from: Rob Necronomicon on August 16, 2024, 08:43:04 PMBut all this 'should be' a moot point because Drivethru technically has a section for mature material. Of course, it's not working as it should, sadly.

I'll believe DTRPG truly cares about sensitive topics when they pull some of the stuff White Wolf/Onyx Path put out.  Not that I'll agree with it even then, but at least I'll think their intentions are honest (albeit wrong).  Until then it's just favoritism masked as social awareness. 

Quote from: Habitual Gamer on August 20, 2024, 04:43:07 PM

Quote from: Rob Necronomicon on August 16, 2024, 08:43:04 PMBut all this 'should be' a moot point because Drivethru technically has a section for mature material. Of course, it's not working as it should, sadly.

I'll believe DTRPG truly cares about sensitive topics when they pull some of the stuff White Wolf/Onyx Path put out.  Not that I'll agree with it even then, but at least I'll think their intentions are honest (albeit wrong).  Until then it's just favoritism masked as social awareness. 

100%!! I said this a while ago too. DT let a lot of the Vamp Black Dog stuff through (and other gnarly stuff). But no way would they ever go near WW because of their influence and cash generated for DT.

Some 'companies' are more 'equal' than others it seems.