...and that threadcrapping is a sign of a healthy libido?

Christ on a bike. Slow day, is it?

Quote from: Drew...and that threadcrapping is a sign of a healthy libido?

Christ on a bike. Slow day, is it?

What else would JimBob do but run about telling everyone how they're allowed to post?

I'm excited to have a new set of rules. I always enjoy having a new system to play with, especialy a vast game with a wide audience.

But... I am aprehensive about the specifics I've heard so far. I'm not looking forward to seeing the fight / rest cycle smoothed out, un-exhaustable wizards or backstab-able constructs. Those things are "fun" but it's low-grade-always-on-fun instead of the hours of boredom punctuated by moments of excitement that I love from older games, older movies etc....

Also I don't like 25th level spells. Nine levels & Neo-platonism 4evar!

I plead to God and all things holy that i never ever see any kind of healing as an 'At Will' power. If that day comes, i'm out. I can see a Cleric having something along the lines of CLW x3 an encounter, but any more than that and you might as well asume everyone is fully healed between each encounter and that would suck mightily.

I voted for undecided. I can't make up my mind, from the limited info at hand, whether or not I'll like this game. Part of me hopes it rocks whereas another part hopes it bombs. Nonetheless I'm quite happy with the games I currently GM.

TOO LATE! Everyone is already healed at the end of every encounter. Wand of lesser vigor: 550hp for 750 gp. It's a level 1 spell so it's easy for divine casters or anyone with use magic device.

Also the Dragon Shaman and Clerics from Complete Champion can gradualy heal 50% hp at will.

Quote from: Malleus ArianorumTOO LATE! Everyone is already healed at the end of every encounter. Wand of lesser vigor: 550hp for 750 gp. It's a level 1 spell so it's easy for divine casters or anyone with use magic device.

Also the Dragon Shaman and Clerics from Complete Champion can gradualy heal 50% hp at will.

Yeah, i ignore the Dragon Shaman. I understand the thought behind making things more immediate with at will, per encounter stuff, so that you don't get a couple of fully-tooled up fights followed by rest or being scared of the next encounter, but i'd rather it was tackled by making actual death a tad harder to achieve than with constant 're-boots'. That way, you can heroically press on when you are out of resources and put your faith in the Gods rather than have an endless supply of powers and spells that re-invigorate you. Make death harder to achieve, lower healing and resurrection magic and up heroic 'in the face of the odds' kind of stuff. How to do that mechanically, i'm not sure, but i guess it could be done, just not with this edition by the sounds of it.

Hmm,

Although I like the sound of some of the ideas released so far, it's too early for any kind of decision, really. While faster play and lower prep time sound great, they could just be marketing spiel, and "faster play" is extremely relative anyway; one man's "fast" is another's "glacially slow".

Oh, "Hi!", by the way, first post here.

cheers!
Colin

Quote from: Colin ChapmanHmm,

Although I like the sound of some of the ideas released so far, it's too early for any kind of decision, really. While faster play and lower prep time sound great, they could just be marketing spiel, and "faster play" is extremely relative anyway; one man's "fast" is another's "glacially slow".

Oh, "Hi!", by the way, first post here.

cheers!
Colin

Hi Colin, you magnificent bastard!  How're things?

Of course, I'm still undecided.  As a personal mark of what I want, I'd love it if that lower prep time and fast play bits were a reality that still left enough crunch to make it all non-handwavey.  Really, for me, the more it feels like a MMORPG (too-easy healing, ridiculous, meaningless death) or a wargame (too many modifiers, special rules, conditionals), that'd be the wrong direction for me, most like.  Make no mistake, I'm sure Wizards will put out the best product they can.  But I don't know yet if that'll be the best product for me.

OK, from my point of view: I'm an RC D&D/1st ed AD&D man, and 3.X isn't my thing. I think 3.X was hamstrung by two mutually exclusive needs:

- The need to be recognisably D&D to the old guard.
- The need to genuinely update the system to attract gamers who've drifted away to more modern systems, and to avoid accusations of simply putting out a new edition just to bilk the fans out of money (let's face it: AD&D2 was a rewrite of AD&D1 with a tiny number of tweaks, and that's incredibly lame).

For me, 3.X is a game trying to appeal to two different audiences and ending up leaving neither satisfied. There's no reason for characteristic scores to be written down in the 3-18 range since you only ever use the bonuses anyway, except in a very few cases - they've just retained that because having stats from 3 to 18 is the Old School way. Similarly with Vancian magic - 1st level wizards have always been totally useless, and that really should have been fixed with 3.0 - but wasn't. (See my "burned on the outside, raw in the middle" thread for more of my thoughts on that.)

Now, however, it looks like they've conceded that they've lost the hardcore old schoolers - C&C and OSRIC cater to them perfectly happily - and are tackling sacred cows like Vancian magic and whatnot in order to appeal to the new audience. As such, I'm optimistic about 4th edition - even though the game that currently calls itself "D&D" probably won't resemble older editions anymore, a) there's C&C out there to cater to the old guard, and b) I still have my 1st edition books too, so that's fine.

Quote from: J ArcaneI am not hopeful, based on what little I've heard, whether it's press releases that read like they're tagging bullet points of 3.x hater posts, anti-Western fantasy snark in TBO9S, all the wrong people praising SWSAGA, or even the choice of Mike Mearls as a lead designer with way too much time invested in following the minority voices on Internet forums.

What I am seeing gives strong indication that they've fallen squarely into the forum trap that afflicts so many vidgames, especially MMOs, catering to the whims of the small group of vocal whiners who populate the Internet forums, while forgetting entirely about the silent and satisfied majority of players.  

And that's just damn sad.  I'd really hate for RPGs to go the way of hex-and-counter wargames, and if D&D of all things has fallen straight for aiming at the Internet hardcore, then that is exactly what will happen.

I voted 'undecided' but I share a lot of J's concerns here, even though I am a Mearls fanboy and even though I like both 9 Swords and Star Wars Saga.  Everything I hear indicates that Wizard's may be shutting the door on the casual Bob the Fighter player and also on strategic level thinking.  I want regular guys who don't eat this shit up 24/7 like I do at my game table.  And I want party's to cheese it because they're out of spells, to return to the dungeon another day.  And I wonder if the 20 level megadungeon makes no sense, mechanically, in a game where resources are allocated per encounter.

Quote from: One Horse TownHi Colin, you magnificent bastard!  How're things?

Hey mate!

Not too bad, cheers, though Rosie is keeping me busy; the joys of a hyperactive goblin-like baby. Happy to see Secrets of the Surface World out for HEX, and Faery's Tale Deluxe getting out there. Busy chipping away at a section of Mysteries of the Hollow Earth and another project.

Hearty congrats on the ENnie, by the way! That makes both of us now; maybe we should start a club or something?

cheers!
Colin

I have a feeling that those that liked Star War Saga Edition are going to like 4ed. From the way it sounds, 4E is going to be a fantasy version of Saga edition but a more robust and full featured version.

I say two thumbs up. :win: :win:

Quote from: Colin ChapmanHey mate!

Not too bad, cheers, though Rosie is keeping me busy; the joys of a hyperactive goblin-like baby. Happy to see Secrets of the Surface World out for HEX, and Faery's Tale Deluxe getting out there. Busy chipping away at a section of Mysteries of the Hollow Earth and another project.

Hearty congrats on the ENnie, by the way! That makes both of us now; maybe we should start a club or something?

cheers!
Colin

Groovy! Yeah, there's suddenly a lot of writers involved in projects winning ENnies this year! There should be a tie pin or something.

HEX is still on my list of stuff to get when i can afford it. Sad thing is, the list is getting bigger the whole time!