Quote from: Armchair Gamer on January 11, 2023, 01:20:38 PM
   I like this, because I think D&D has long been a broad tent holding together numerous different playstyles, if not altogether different hobbies, and breaking up the Leviathan might allow for people to find things that better suit their specific needs.

This would be ideal.

Quote from: Armchair Gamer on January 11, 2023, 01:20:38 PM
  It's already near certain that C&C, Pathfinder, Basic Fantasy, and ACKS will survive in some form, among others, and Kobold will probably be able to latch on to a lot of the audience that 5E specifically serves. If one doesn't worship at the altar of the Brand, this shouldn't cause too much disruption--and really, given WotC's track record with their IP, how many people want their specific stuff anyway?

I suspect a lot. Like really a lot.

The outrage is working against them now, but people are fanatically loyal to their fave RPG IP in RPG land.

Fanatically. It is beyond all reason.

That is why I really hope that the WotC suits are so tone deaf that they stay the course and do not waver!

If WotC pivots anytime in the next 5 years, they can turn back the dial the same way they did pivoting from 4e to 5e.

It would be fun to see WotC who is having financial troubles try to sue everyone that didn't scrub content sufficiently enough.
I would not be surprised to hear a few months from now that some big wigs were forced to resign over this but they kept it quiet.

Quote from: Ruprecht on January 11, 2023, 02:17:20 PM
It would be fun to see WotC who is having financial troubles try to sue everyone that didn't scrub content sufficiently enough.
I would not be surprised to hear a few months from now that some big wigs were forced to resign over this but they kept it quiet.

"WotC" may be having financial problems, but Hasbro still has deep legal pockets.

Live stream with Ryan Dancey explaining the history of OGL 1.0a

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Vz9ogq7JTg

Quote from: DocJones on January 11, 2023, 03:35:36 PM
Live stream with Ryan Dancey explaining the history of OGL 1.0a

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Vz9ogq7JTg

It was very good, well worth catching.

Quote from: Bruwulf on January 11, 2023, 03:27:41 PM

Quote from: Ruprecht on January 11, 2023, 02:17:20 PM
It would be fun to see WotC who is having financial troubles try to sue everyone that didn't scrub content sufficiently enough.
I would not be surprised to hear a few months from now that some big wigs were forced to resign over this but they kept it quiet.

"WotC" may be having financial problems, but Hasbro still has deep legal pockets.

Corret, it's a question of how much are they willing to sink on this and how sure is it they'll end up losing in court plus all the negative press this will garner their life brand.

Quote from: S'mon on January 11, 2023, 07:02:35 PM

Quote from: DocJones on January 11, 2023, 03:35:36 PM
Live stream with Ryan Dancey explaining the history of OGL 1.0a

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Vz9ogq7JTg&t=1s

It was very good, well worth catching.

Dancey says something really interesting at 1:37.45 in:

Lucasfilm has a perpetual license to the game mechanics of the WotC Star Wars RPG.

Theoretically then, they could release an OGL based on the d20 star wars game mechanics that they own, and wotc couldn't do a thing about it...

Am I missing something?

Quote from: Jaeger on January 11, 2023, 07:49:11 PM

Quote from: S'mon on January 11, 2023, 07:02:35 PM

Quote from: DocJones on January 11, 2023, 03:35:36 PM
Live stream with Ryan Dancey explaining the history of OGL 1.0a

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Vz9ogq7JTg&t=1s

It was very good, well worth catching.

Dancey says something really interesting at 1:37.45 in:

Lucasfilm has a perpetual license to the game mechanics of the WotC Star Wars RPG.

Theoretically then, they could release an OGL based on the d20 star wars game mechanics that they own, and wotc couldn't do a thing about it...

Am I missing something?

It's a theoretical possibility...but consider who owns Lucasfilm now.

I don't believe WotC can cancel their OGL 1.0a license as a matter of contract law.   Estoppel based on their published statements would prevent them from asserting it is revocable.

For twenty plus years they have been promoting this license as permanent.  See archive of their OGL FAQ from August 2021 .  The FAQ has since been removed.

QuoteA: An Open Game is a game that can be freely copied, modified, and distributed, and a system for ensuring that material, once distributed as an Open Game will remain permanently Open.

Also pretending they hadn't considered the license applied to all sorts of other medium is clearly false per their own FAQ

QuoteQ: Is Open Gaming restricted to just RPGs?

A: No, not at all. Most Open Game Licenses are content-neutral. You could use them to distribute a board game, a card game, a miniatures game, or any other kind of content you are interested in.

Quote from: Jaeger on January 11, 2023, 07:49:11 PM

Quote from: S'mon on January 11, 2023, 07:02:35 PM

Quote from: DocJones on January 11, 2023, 03:35:36 PM
Live stream with Ryan Dancey explaining the history of OGL 1.0a

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Vz9ogq7JTg&t=1s

It was very good, well worth catching.

Dancey says something really interesting at 1:37.45 in:

Lucasfilm has a perpetual license to the game mechanics of the WotC Star Wars RPG.

Theoretically then, they could release an OGL based on the d20 star wars game mechanics that they own, and wotc couldn't do a thing about it...

Am I missing something?

Yeah, but why would Disney care one way or the other? They probably don't even know they own the license, since it's EA that makes SW video games now (and they haven't used the d20 SW rules since KOTOR2, which is what, 15 years ago?)

Beyond that, the d20 SW rules are not really like the D&D 3.x rules other than the basic mechanics, which are probably not copyrightable to begin with.  There's no D&D spells, no D&D classes ( I guess the Noble is akin to the Aristocrat and Scoundrel the Rogue), the skills are different, no D&D monsters.

Quote from: DocJones on January 11, 2023, 08:00:09 PM
I don't believe WotC can cancel their OGL 1.0a license as a matter of contract law.   Estoppel based on their published statements would prevent them from asserting it is revocable.

For twenty plus years they have been promoting this license as permanent.  See archive of their OGL FAQ from August 2021 .  The FAQ has since been removed.

QuoteA: An Open Game is a game that can be freely copied, modified, and distributed, and a system for ensuring that material, once distributed as an Open Game will remain permanently Open.

Also pretending they hadn't considered the license applied to all sorts of other medium is clearly false per their own FAQ

QuoteQ: Is Open Gaming restricted to just RPGs?

A: No, not at all. Most Open Game Licenses are content-neutral. You could use them to distribute a board game, a card game, a miniatures game, or any other kind of content you are interested in.

WOTC isn't a single person, or even a continuous group of people. There are new people in charge and they have decided otherwise. And they have an army of lawyers to use if they choose to.

Hell, even in the TSR days they unleashed their lawyers (and Sean Reynolds) on people and Hasbo is probably 100x as big.

Looks like Paizo are working on making a new RPG open license?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_xXTR2HOxjs

Deleted, it was old news.

Quote from: danskmacabre on January 11, 2023, 09:25:06 PM
Looks like Paizo are working on making a new RPG open license?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_xXTR2HOxjs

I need to find another source for this besides listening to Tenkar scream through his nostrils for ten minutes like an MS patient with his nuts in a vise.

People've been pointing a lot at the 25% cut and the 'we own your stuff for free' part, but not as much on the whole 'we can cut you off for any reason or no reason' part.  Now picture with me: You are the owner of a major RPG production company.  You have dozens of books using the OGL, scores of employees.  One day, JK Rowling calls you.  She wants your company to make the only Harry Potter licensed RPG in the world.  You accept.

Three hours later, approximately 14,000 tweets, 95% from bots, have been @ to Wizards of the Coast about how your company is literally murdering trans people.  By the end of the day, your OGL has been revoked due to your being 'on the wrong side of history, also yikes', according to their press release.

Your company is now out of business and all of your employees are out of work.