All druids get two cantrips, too. Land Druids have one more. (Or was it two more? Not sure about the number without looking it up.) The Ranger and the Paladin do not.

And except for Bard, all casters use the same method of spell preparation, keeping slots and spells prepared separate. It was first introduced in the 3.5 Spirit Shaman class.

Quote from: Omega;700472Seems fairly balanced. Im sure some may grouse about not being able to cast.

Grouse isn't one of the wild-shape options available.

Damn. No "I hide flawlessly as a mouse and call lightning"



I like shape change, but I am not fond of casting spells while in a different form.

Quote from: Votan;700443I thought Elven chain was 2e; in 1E they gave casting in armor as an example in the dual class section (as an example of terrible, terrible rule placement).

Elven chain is in 1e Unearthed Arcana, and, I believe, the DMG somewhere too (as an even more restricted option).

I forgot that cantrips are your at-will spells and most full spellcasting classes get 2 with the option to get 1-2 more. 5e cantrips are comparable to other Dnd 1st level spells in most cases.

@Bill, that's only possible at 20th level unless it gets changed or there is some feat not shown yet.

Quote from: Marleycat;700610I forgot that cantrips are your at-will spells and most full spellcasting classes get 2 with the option to get 1-2 more. 5e cantrips are comparable to other Dnd 1st level spells in most cases.

@Bill, that's only possible at 20th level unless it gets changed or there is some feat not shown yet.

I figure at level 20 its ok to cast spells while 'in microbe form hiding in  the enemies lungs'

Its only at lower leves than 20 I don't like casting in animal form.

Quote from: Imp;700604Elven chain is in 1e Unearthed Arcana, and, I believe, the DMG somewhere too (as an even more restricted option).

'Half Elven' chain emerged in one of my dnd games.

An elven warrior was literally cut in half by a Mariliths blade barrier.

He was eventually raised from the dead by a wish spell the party had been hoarding for emergencies.

When the elf took stock of his equipment, his eleven chain armor was in two pieces. he went to the only armorsmith in the are, a human, to get it repaired.

The human smith lacked the skill to make elven chain, so he knit the eleven chain back together with links of lowly human chain mail.

Voila!!!

The legend of the 'Half Elven' Chain Mail was born.

Bards, Clerics and Druids in 5e get a few cantrips.
Rangers and Paladins do not.
Mages have no mention of cantrips in their description, but have cantrips listed in the mage spell list.

Cantrips are "at will"

Quote from: Marleycat;700461It was. Only played 1e 3-4 times. 2e is my old school Dnd.

Fair enough.  :-)

1E was heavy on the atmosphere but had some . . . complex and unclear . . . rules here and there.

Quote from: Bill;700588Damn. No "I hide flawlessly as a mouse and call lightning"



I like shape change, but I am not fond of casting spells while in a different form.

Well in Next at least they dont get that till very late in the game. Level 20 I believe. Even with the new HP boosts and faster recovery rate its still going to be a push to hit high levels.

Quote from: One Horse Town;700560Grouse isn't one of the wild-shape options available.

Give em time. It will make a good counter for the Triceratops Im sure.

Quote from: mhensley;699874I dislike that somewhere along the line the druid became all about being a shapeshifter and less about being a priest of nature.

I hate that somewhere along the way the Druid became all about being a priest of nature and less about being an educated poet and arbiter of laws.

Quote from: James Gillen;699970I've always associated Druids more with human sacrifice, but hey.

JG

Caesarian propoganda

Quote from: TristramEvans;700843I hate that somewhere along the way the Druid became all about being a priest of nature and less about being an educated poet and arbiter of laws.

Probably started around the same time they stopped stacking stones and started becoming adventurers.

D&D druids oft come across as a sort of counterpart to the classical Greek dryad/nymph nature spirit.

What was the current popular idea of druids around the time D&D was written? Where did Gygax and co get the idea?

I think Shapechanger should be a class of its own.

A Druid could get limited shapechanging along with various nature priest kinda stuff, but shapechanging shouldn't be what it's all about. Basically I think a druid should be a variant priest. But then I liked 2e's take, with lots of different kinds of priests tailored to their gods and religions - a priest of the God of Plants would have some stuff in common with a priest of the God of Agriculture but there'd be important differences, frex.

If one has to take a "nuschool" approach, I'd say divide the Druid into three:
1) Shapechanger Druid*
2) Summoner Druid**
3) General Nature Druid***

*=main ability: shapechanging. Little else, spellcasting no better than Ranger/Paladin
**=main ability: summoning animals to fight for him. Other spell ability limited.
***=various spells having to do with plants, elements, weather, etc. No shapechanging or summoning

But that's really too nuschool for me. I think.

I don't mind Next's "shapechanger vs spell user" divide mind.

I'm fairly aware they're NEVAH EVAH going to return to the way of doing things of my fave ed, 2ed.

Quote from: TristramEvans;700852Caesarian propoganda

Agreed.

Quote from: Omega;700856D&D druids oft come across as a sort of counterpart to the classical Greek dryad/nymph nature spirit.

Yep.

Back in AD&D this was extra strong, what with Druids having immunity to the Charm ability of such beings, and generally speaking their languages (wich they still did in 3e).

In the fun pseudo-OSR game Mazes & Minotaurs, the core classes include Dryad
The Dryad basically being an all-female nature-oriented spellcaster class with fun powers.

Quote from: TristramEvans;700843I hate that somewhere along the way the Druid became all about being a priest of nature and less about being an educated poet and arbiter of laws.

Haha yes.

The D&D Druid has more in common with Odin than Oghma. Well as in, the D&D Druids make more sense as Norse sorcerers than Celtic priests. Allthough shapechanging was a thing in both mythologies. But the whole "change into a bird to scout, then change into a different kinda bird to attack, etc" thing is very Norse. Well actually I think we stole it from the Finnish-Ugric-talking groups close by - Saami or Finns most likely. Odin being very similar to Sibirian and pre-Christian Finnish-Ugric shaman figures. By wich I mean very similar.