Quote from: dungeonmonkey on August 25, 2024, 05:38:41 PMIt was like someone looked at Appendix N and said, "You know what's missing? Leisure Suit Larry." The demographic for that kind of product has got to be awfully limited.

Venger's particular brand of smartass really clicked with me. I liked Alpha Blue a lot.

Limited audience, yeah. But it worked for me.

The window of interest is much like early White Wolf or Call of Cthulhu or especially Tekumel and Skyrealms of Jorune.

The Weird and the Freakish.

Attracting and Holding that audience can be really tricky.

Quote from: JeremyR on August 25, 2024, 03:08:58 AMMy guess is he found a new grift

So what, exactly, was the old grift?

Without getting into personality, politics, etc., I wrote a few reviews of his work, judged by its own merits.

Overall, I think it is both creative and weird - very unique, inspired, and somewhat random.

It is a bit hard to describe, really, but worth the read. I think it is fair to say it is MEMORABLE.

It is not something you add easily to your vanilla D&D games. It has no boring dungeons filled with dwarves, goblins, pit traps, skeletons and giant bats.

But: "The pyramid contains orcs, a pizzeria, a village, aliens, a podcast recording session, a couple of dragons, clowns, anthropomorphic fruits, a tiki bar, a game show, a clone of Rob Schneider... with more "traditional" stuff like cultists, robots, tentacled aberrations, great old ones, etc."

I don't think you can run this as written without a very healthy dose of humor. Also, I played once briefly with Venger online, and he is very good at making something engaging out of this random mess - not something all GMs might do, which limit the appeal somewhat.

https://methodsetmadness.blogspot.com/2020/03/review-chaalt.html

https://methodsetmadness.blogspot.com/2021/04/chaalt-fuchsia-malaise-osr-rpg-review.html

Not sure about the business side either. I'm trying to make this work for years, with mixed results. I do not think success is about quality, but a combination of quality, consistency, networking, and luck that is very hard to achieve.

Also, I vaguely remember getting some flak for posting Chaalt reviews and being prevented to post in certain places. I do not remember the exact reasons.

EDIT: I think I should add that Chaalt is currently free on DTRPG, so just see it for yourself.

Quote from: JeremyR on August 25, 2024, 03:08:58 AMMy guess is he found a new grift with an even more gullible audience. Remember, he's the guy who tried to make a living off of an actual Cthulhu cult before finding the OSR...

I can't help to think that comments like yours comes from nothing more than a place of jealousy.

Quote from: Thornhammer on August 25, 2024, 11:22:08 PM

Quote from: dungeonmonkey on August 25, 2024, 05:38:41 PMIt was like someone looked at Appendix N and said, "You know what's missing? Leisure Suit Larry." The demographic for that kind of product has got to be awfully limited.

Venger's particular brand of smartass really clicked with me. I liked Alpha Blue a lot.

Limited audience, yeah. But it worked for me.

Yep, Venger's smartass-ness is a huge appeal to me.

Looking at his Cha'alt material, his Gonzo over-the-top style is right up my alley for a specific campaign I've designed. I spoke of if briefly in the Kickstarter announcement he made here recently.

The whole "he needed to make stuff with broader appeal", is nonsense. The whole point of Cha'alt is that it's unique. Not some cookie-cutter crap.

But the funny thing is, if you wanted to "tone it down", you can if you wanted to. Unless your lazy and want things spoon-fed to you. Which apparently is what the kids want, hence he's dropping out of publishing.

"modern" gamers want generic, easy to fit stuff because they lack the creativity an drive to even modify creative material out there.

If it's not making the money like it used too and you don't want to compromise you creative integrity, you might as well get out the top of your game.

Ultimately, IMO Venger is like David Lynch or Quentin Tarintino: either you get it or you don't.

Reading this thread makes me think how cool a book would be with different articles from different creators about their experiences in RPG publishing and the lessons learned.

I said this in the other thread that Venger started but I don't think it was a subject matter of appeal but rather a matter of not quite feeling like a complete setting with internal consistency.  When I've used Cha'alt material, I had to do a lot of work to prep it for my table.  I think his stuff is inspired but if he worked with a good editor to give it a solid foundation I think it would have done much better.

@TheRPGPundit, I'm sorry it didn't work out between you two.  I hope someday for you to reunite and adopt some great African babies and take up quilting.

Had to do it, that subject title makes it look like you two broke up.

LOL. No breakup here. Venger and is, and hopefully will always be, my friend.  It's just annoying I have to go to the Genesis planet to rescue him from the Klingons.

In my own case, hm, I guess I like my sleaze with a dollop of plausible deniability. If it's front and centre as the main focus of the product it's very hard to justify buying and running it. I do have some sleazy players who'd love it, but I myself get embarrassed pretty easily 😅

Quote from: BronzeDragon on August 24, 2024, 08:56:40 PMMy feeling is that Venger's stuff is a super niche within a niche.

The market for that kind of thing is only ever so large, and even tiny variations or gaps will lead to unprofitability, specially if you are spending quite a bit on the production side (Cha'alt books seemed to be very "premium" for lack of a better term).

I wish him the best of luck on any future endeavors.

You nailed it right out of the gate.  Pundit, too.  That + politics / culture war issues.

Quote from: Tod13 on August 25, 2024, 08:03:43 PM

Quote from: dungeonmonkey on August 25, 2024, 05:38:41 PM<snip>It was like someone looked at Appendix N and said, "You know what's missing? Leisure Suit Larry."<snip>

Now you're just hitting the reasons to buy Venger's stuff! LOL (I get what you're saying. I just really liked that sentence.)

I must confess, I liked it, too.  Lol

Don't forget to back Venger's last project on Kickstarter (until the reunion tour) - PRIMORDIAL CHAOS: Gonzo Like A Fucking Boss...  https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/vengersatanis/primordial-chaos-gonzo-like-a-fucking-boss

QuoteYep, Venger's smartass-ness is a huge appeal to me.

Looking at his Cha'alt material, his Gonzo over-the-top style is right up my alley for a specific campaign I've designed. I spoke of if briefly in the Kickstarter announcement he made here recently.

The whole "he needed to make stuff with broader appeal", is nonsense. The whole point of Cha'alt is that it's unique. Not some cookie-cutter crap.

But the funny thing is, if you wanted to "tone it down", you can if you wanted to. Unless your lazy and want things spoon-fed to you. Which apparently is what the kids want, hence he's dropping out of publishing.

"modern" gamers want generic, easy to fit stuff because they lack the creativity an drive to even modify creative material out there.

If it's not making the money like it used too and you don't want to compromise you creative integrity, you might as well get out the top of your game.

Ultimately, IMO Venger is like David Lynch or Quentin Tarintino: either you get it or you don't.

Still flattered by your comparisons, hoss.  Thank you!

Quote from: Ruprecht on August 26, 2024, 01:49:16 PMReading this thread makes me think how cool a book would be with different articles from different creators about their experiences in RPG publishing and the lessons learned.

I agree, and if someone put that together, I'd be happy to contribute... assuming it would get down in the dirt.

Quote from: RPGPundit on August 27, 2024, 11:49:12 AMLOL. No breakup here. Venger and is, and hopefully will always be, my friend.  It's just annoying I have to go to the Genesis planet to rescue him from the Klingons.

You got anything better to do, hoss?   

Oh, and you're welcome for being instrumental in saving everyone's ass.  The OSR lives on by my sacrifice.  I'm so fucking noble, it's just sickening.

Venger-out!

p.s. Share the KS and back it - https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/vengersatanis/primordial-chaos-gonzo-like-a-fucking-boss

Quote from: Mishihari on August 25, 2024, 03:57:36 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on August 25, 2024, 11:01:10 AMThat, and I can imagine some conservative and Christian OSR gamers might even have some qualms about buying a product from a guy named "Satanis".

Yeah, that's me.  I saw the name, figured he wouldn't have anything I was interested in, and didn't even give his stuff a look.  From reading his posts here I figured out that he's probably a good guy and might have stuff worth considering, but most folks aren't going to do that.  Selling RPGs is hard enough without handicapping yourself from the get-go like that.

That is me too.  I had the same initial reaction. I know very little about him.  I asked him just a few days ago on YouTube why his surname is listed as 'Satanis.'  He responded that it is because he is the son of the devil.