Quote from: WarthurFWIW, I think it's worth checking out Chaosium's new version of Basic Roleplaying coming out in the near future - all the rules from all the various versions of BRP (including older editions of RuneQuest), with plenty different optional bits, all assembled into a coherent whole. To my mind that's more of a spiritual successor to RQ than MRQ is; there's no precedent for things like Legendary Abilities in any BRP game I'm aware of, where special powers and whatnot tended to be natural outgrowths of the percentile skill system.

absolutely. i figure the fantasy system i'll end up using will be a hybrid of all of those systems.  that said, i may use BRP as the "base" since i'm already familiar with it via CoC.

Y'know... very rarely do I see something on the shelf and get absolutely pissed off.

But after buying some four or five ultra-thin books to run my RQ game, to see this 'three books in one for half the cost of the three' just burned me up something fierce.

That. That pissed me off.

That said, after running the game I am sure previous editions of RQ were not so damn wonky about defense, but never having played or run them, I couldn't say for certain.  Me 'n my players still scratch our heads over defenders part of combat... or would if we were playing (damn unreliable work schedule... damn unreliable players... grr)

Quote from: SpikeY'know... very rarely do I see something on the shelf and get absolutely pissed off.

But after buying some four or five ultra-thin books to run my RQ game, to see this 'three books in one for half the cost of the three' just burned me up something fierce.

That. That pissed me off.

I can see that, although for my part I think it's the only way the core MRQ books could be packaged to make them at all cost-effective. Even then, it's worth remembering that RQ2 managed to pack rules, a few setting details, two magic systems and a bunch of monsters into 120 pages back in the day - so when you look at it that way, it's no wonder fans of old RQ cried foul right when MRQ first came out.

The nicest thing I can say about MRQ is that it made me a convert to earlier editions...

Quote from: WarthurThe nicest thing I can say about MRQ is that it made me a convert to earlier editions...

and so i keep waiting for a deal to surface on ebay. . .

Quote from: Warthur...there's no precedent for things like Legendary Abilities in any BRP game I'm aware of, where special powers and whatnot tended to be natural outgrowths of the percentile skill system.

It's a stretch, I realise, but there were the +100% skill rules for Rune Lords and Priests.  Of course, you had to earn them during the course of the game.

!i!

That's a hell of a stretch, and the 100%+ skills didn't work like Legendary Abilities in MRQ - Legendary Abilities are essentially feats, and IIRC 100%+ skills don't give you feat-like abilities in earlier editions of RQ.

Not feats as such, though some of the RQ3 supplements suggested something of the sort.  "Ki Skills" from Land of Ninja, for instance.  Again, I stretch, if only to show that the notion of superheroic abilites was there, if not implemented in the same fashion.

!i!

Weren't ki skills run under the percentile system?

EDIT TO ADD: My objection to Legendary Abilities isn't that they're superheroic - there's plenty of scope for that in BRP/RQ - it's that they are very obviously grafted onto the system, and aren't really integrated with any particular part of it. They don't derive from the core percentile mechanic, like just about every other BRP subsystem you care to mention does.

I played RQ a lot in high school. It was the only game we could get girls to play. I never could completely fall in love with it, though. I enjoy Glorantha, but there are worlds I like better. So I'm a fan of the old RQ, but not a superfan.

I've picked up MRQ. I think the criticisms offered so far are valid. It departs bafflingly from old RQ stuff, and it is wonky. That said, to me it's fun in play. I have really enjoyed it--especially Lankhmar. The game system is fun and reasonably easy to customize, if you're into that. It's been hard for me to find regular players, but we're playing some Elric in a couple weeks, and that may pan out well.

One criticism that hasn't been stated strongly enough, though, is that the books fall apart. I know Mongoose bought their own press last year to save money, but it just doesn't seem to be working out. I hope it does get squared away, because I'm really looking forward to CthulhuTech and a fresh paper printing of SpyCraft. SpyCraft won't even stay together on the shelf if the binding isn't better than the MRQ stuff. For the more commonly-used books, I've had to trim off the gluey edges of the pages and comb-bind them. That's not too cool for slightly pricey hardbacks.

I'm really looking forward to BRP. Not because I hate MRQ, but because I love the original system, I love CoC, and I like options. I think we'll have a huge d100 buffet to choose from. That'll be great.

Quote from: stu2000I
I'm really looking forward to BRP. Not because I hate MRQ, but because I love the original system, I love CoC, and I like options. I think we'll have a huge d100 buffet to choose from. That'll be great.

I'm looking forward to BRP as well but I'm concerned that Chaosium is going to run into the same problems that Mongoose did with MRQ.  The RQII and RQIII core mechanics were very sound and IMO didn't really require major changes, just a few tweaks here and there.  So when I got MRQ I took a few new ideas out of it but essentially kept what I liked from the old RQ.  IMO the same is true for BRP, which is a close cousin to RQ.  So I think Chaosium has a tough task ahead of them because if they just make a few cosmetic changes then people will feel ripped off but if they screw around with the core mechanics of BRP too much they will take the same kind of heat that Mongoose is for MRQ.  I wish them luck, it would be nice to see Chaosium have a win here.

Quote from: WarthurThat's a hell of a stretch, and the 100%+ skills didn't work like Legendary Abilities in MRQ - Legendary Abilities are essentially feats, and IIRC 100%+ skills don't give you feat-like abilities in earlier editions of RQ.

You do remember correctly.  Skills over 100% give you some advantages like being able to split attacks, and of course you have a higher chance of getting a special or critical roll but there wasn't really anything like a legendary ability in RQII or RQIII.  I can take or leave legendary abilities but I think some kind of "legendary ability" rule that was less like DnD feats would be nice.

Quote from: GrimjackI'm looking forward to BRP as well but I'm concerned that Chaosium is going to run into the same problems that Mongoose did with MRQ.  The RQII and RQIII core mechanics were very sound and IMO didn't really require major changes, just a few tweaks here and there.  So when I got MRQ I took a few new ideas out of it but essentially kept what I liked from the old RQ.  IMO the same is true for BRP, which is a close cousin to RQ.  So I think Chaosium has a tough task ahead of them because if they just make a few cosmetic changes then people will feel ripped off but if they screw around with the core mechanics of BRP too much they will take the same kind of heat that Mongoose is for MRQ.  I wish them luck, it would be nice to see Chaosium have a win here.

The guy behind the project (I'm afraid I don't remember his name) used to post regularly about it on tBP. Apparently they're sticking to a tight set of core rules - the BRP elements we all know and love - and providing a whole assload of optional rules. If my interpretation of his posts is correct, you'll be able to take the BRP rulebook and reconstruct RQ2/3, or Call of Cthulhu, or Stormbringer, or Ringworld, or Superworld, or at least something very like any of the above games very easily.

Jason Durall is the guy behind the project.

I can see Grimjack's concern; I guess the problem is that they're screwed either way with the true grognards. Make it different and they won't like it, make it they same and they won't see the point in buying it. But as Warthur suggests, by including stuff from the lesser-known BRP variants as options, they can hopefully offer value to people who only own one of the games in the family but would like to branch out genre-wise without having to track down a whole bunch of OOP stuff.

I'm more concerned though that DBRP will have had a lot of its thunder stolen by MRQ when it comes to the newbie market.

My main concern about DBRP is that we will never see it.

I think that's unlikely. The final manuscript is in-house, the cover art is done, the interior art is being cranked out and final layout is continuing apace. This isn't vapourware to nearly the same extent as, say, Pulp Cthulhu is.