Prompted by a few posts in the Mongoose's "Holy Grail" thread.

I'm extremely indifferent to Harry Potter. I won't go into it, but I just want to get that out of the way.

I'm kind of shocked at the idea that a D20 or MRQ adaptation of the game be an intelligent use of the property. At least, I don't really see either of those systems as especially relevant to what people would likely be going to a HP game for. You could use D20, sure, or MRQ--but you'd need a lot more than that, wouldn't you?

Don't you need something to handle the social one-up-manship and academic struggles? The rivalry between Houses?

Maybe it'd need mechanical support, maybe not, but surely the focus of the game would have to be quite a ways from your typical dungeon crawl. Maybe the form of "scripted" scenario with scenes laid out in advance would be acceptable to some, even though it's not very attractive to me.

So maybe the best way to phrase this would be: if you were making a Harry Potter RPG, would you sell packaged scenarios and what would they look like? Or if not, how would you advise GMs on how to create situations/scenarios, and incorporate them into ongoing play?

I'm not a big fan of HP, either. I never understood its appeal to adults in particular.

Still, if I were doing a HP line, I'd first put out a decent and rather expensive hardcover. Then a need-to-have supplement about the school. The game play would allow several options, including HP, jailbait chick and red-haired-guy doing the work by themselves, a totally new group of people and potentially adventures where HP does some stuff, but there's a new kid in school to help him.

The latter would be some kind of one-on-one scenarios, where a parent, sister or friend could run a child/sibling/friend through a rather narrow scenario. Lots of story-telling and some moral choices. In the end, there would be two scores, one about those stupid Grifflypuff points, the other about a concrete moral value. Most of those adventures would be pretty short and probably targeted at a younger audience.

Then the usual adventures for a whole group. I don't see difficulties with a traditional format, at least from the HP stuff I know. The academy is almost dungeon-like at times and it seems monsters and secret rooms abound.

Hmm...

Mechanically, HP could be done d20 style with skill-based magic, perhaps similar to how the Force is presented in d20 Saga, with spell knowledge trees and a skill roll to activate individual spells. It'd have to be "at will", however -- none of Saga's one use per encounter crap. I like the idea of splitting magic into several different skills, i.e. charms, transfiguration, potions, divination, combat, etc. The spells would have a high DC with wands providing a significant bonus to the activation roll.

On the other hand, it also might be interesting to use Serenity's 'Cortex' mechanic or WEG's d6 mechanic, with their general and specialized skills. The spells would simply be either known or unknown (basically by GM fiat) with perhaps a simple mechanic for learning a newly encountered spell, with the idea of a high DC to activate the spell and a wand bonus also applying.

I think the biggest problem would be the setting. Would it be presented strictly as student shenanigans and hijinx at Hogwarts (i.e. what's in the novels) or would more of the world outside Hogwarts be included? Then there's the whole aspect of the setting revolving entirely around Harry Potter -- how would PCs stand out compared to him Ron and Hermione? Tough, tough  choices.

I've got a soft-spot for the books from listening to them in audio-format on lengthy drives to work. But I'm far, far from a fantatic.

So here's my take:
1. If the objective was to *make the book's stories happen* then you'd want some really specific mechanics that do things like plot a schoool year for each adventure with specific scene-framing to the major events, create scooby-gangs of friends, and set up teachers that hate/like you.

Char-gen would include a sorting phase (not chosen by the player or the GM but by random roll to create the sense of uncertainty).

If you put canonical characters in you'd have the problem that Harry solves everything. If you play *after* the books then (likely) you lose most of the context of the inevitable showdown (presumably Voldemort dies and things resolve themselves).

2. If the objective was to simply create the HP world and let you play 'someone in it' then you'd be looking at something a lot more D20-like, IMO (I mean, maybe OtE-like or PDQ-like, or GURPS-like, or BRP-like, or whatever--but something pretty traditional).

You'd need niches (character classes? Talents? whatever) to create archetypes for the world.

There'd be a suppliment for the school, of course--but maybe source-books for other countries and being part of the magical police.

There are probably more--but my conclusion is that it could go several ways.

-Marco

There is a fan made GURPS HP Sourcebook that looks pretty good. This could be done very well with a level based system as well.

I lurve Harry Potter ... and I think that you can address the game in several ways:

• A game about magic in a muggle world, with Hogwarts only being one possible setting
• A game about boarding schools, with magic being secondary to Quidditch teams, house reputation and crushing loads of schoolwork.
• Something which intertwines the two ... drawing important parallels (as the books do) between the magical and the mundane, and infusing the hum-drum world of education with mystery and power.

Personally, I think that the third option there is worth aiming for.  But I suspect that either #1 or #2 would be more commercially viable.  I don't really know what you'd have to do in order to make #3 work, but I sort of suspect that you'd be pushed into a holistic approach that might make it hard to sell supplements.

I think it would look something like this:

http://www.rpg.net/reviews/archive/9/9722.phtml

Pete

Quote from: Elliot WilenI'm kind of shocked at the idea that a D20 or MRQ adaptation of the game be an intelligent use of the property.

Well... I don't know if it would be intelligent use of the property, I can only tell you, that it would appeal to me a lot. I have gone through phase in my life, when I have tried any and all RPG systems and games I've been able to put my hands on.

I don't want that no more. I am tired of new systems. I don't want to learn yet another mechanical beast just because some designer thinks he will do it better. I like to play, I like new settings. Sure, all that still amuse me.

But to learn new systems. No, thanx.

I know d20 very well. So whatever little tweaks designers would make it do the system emulate Harry Potter setting, I will grasp it quickly. Or so I hope. Actually, I have already seen some fan build d20 Harry Potter already. Some things could be solved mechanically, it there is no need to make it D&D-like, when you can make it say Spycraft-like, SW Saga-like or whatever.

I don't know, whether it is wise choice for the publisher. Maybe not. I am perceiving the problem just from my subjective point of view. And that way it is pretty simple. I am buying good d20 game, nothing else. Not any more.

Alnag, my doubts are more on the lines of: if you make HP D20 simply by revising the classes & spells, giving a map of Hogwarts and writeups on all the major characters and critters, then...what do the players do?

I want to know what the players will be doing in the course of play.

The book should help the GM (and players) structure the game so that the players get to do that thing.

Quote from: Elliot WilenI want to know what the players will be doing in the course of play.

Oh. I see. Well, I would put it that way... they will be studying. Each year might be like three levels or two, or whatever. Now to pass to the other year you would have to succeed in some "tests". These tests would be base of the game I guess.

So the students would have to say save the pegas who disappeared from the School, or even buy new stuff for the school year, or whatever. I would like to express more, but unluckily I know Harry Potter only in translation to my native language, and I can't use proper english terms, despite the fact the other way around I would mostly understand when you would be talking about HP in english. Well, but you know what I mean.

There might be some intra-group competition as well. Between the players. Maybe you can't be best player of the broom-game (whatever is it called in english) and best-student and so on.

I agree one can not simply make it like take D&D and rename some stuff. But that's not a point of d20system and never was.

Quote from: AlnagI agree one can not simply make it like take D&D and rename some stuff. But that's not a point of d20system and never was.

That's okay, we don't need to get mixed up on whether I have a wrong idea of how D20 is. (Though, note the OGL/D20 distinction.) I'm more curious how a HP game would be.

So what you're describing sounds a little bit like Pendragon...hmm...anybody else see it?

Quote from: Elliot WilenI'm more curious how a HP game would be.

That's the problem isn't it? Do they present the game in terms of kids at Hogwarts getting into quirky situations, or do they present the game in terms of Wizard World at large? Are the PCs 11 and learning magic, or are they 20 year old Aurors working for the Ministry of Magic?

Personally, I think the best bet would be to present the game in terms of the world at large, with a significantly large section (preferably in the GM section) dedicated to Hogwarts adventures.

Quote from: ElectroKittyPersonally, I think the best bet would be to present the game in terms of the world at large, with a significantly large section (preferably in the GM section) dedicated to Hogwarts adventures.

I don't think that would be a wise decision. I'd start with Hogwarts and then maybe publish a source book detailing the rest of that erm, world.
Most kids/"grown-ups" buying that game would want to emulate the adventures of HP. I'd say even more so, they would want to play the actual characters, maybe with themselves as Mary Sues.

With the publishing output of Mongoose, hey, maybe we'll even get "Quintessential Slash Fiction"...

Perhaps you're right. Still, *I'd* want to play in the world at large, so... simultaneous publication?

Quote from: ElectroKittyPerhaps you're right. Still, *I'd* want to play in the world at large, so... simultaneous publication?

Whatever floats your boat. I would be crying in a corner anyway, as I still hope that Eden gets the license and publishes a AFMBE supplement with it.