It seems to me the biggest trends or populair game systems (wether we like it or not) are:
1. D&D (D20)
2. Fate
3. Savage Worlds
4. Gumshoe
5. Indie (Apocalypse World/Burning Wheel)
6. Retroclones/OSR
7. Pathfinder
Is this a valid conclusion?
Quote from: jan paparazzi;971193It seems to me the biggest trends or populair game systems (wether we like it or not) are:
1. D&D (D20)
2. Fate
3. Savage Worlds
4. Gumshoe
5. Indie (Apocalypse World/Burning Wheel)
6. Retroclones/OSR
7. Pathfinder
Is this a valid conclusion?
In terms of talk, you're possibly right. In terms of -play- I'd order it:
1
7
5 (cause it's too damn broad)
3
2
6
4
But really, after D&D and then Pathfinder I'm not sure you could get an accurate number.
Definitely D&D, but various iterations. Lots of 5E games going on in the area, but also some old school stuff, too (at least one regularly-running 2E campaign I see on meetup). Then there's PF, which, to me, is still D&D in a different guise. Third place is everything else.
I will definitely agree with san dee jota - it seems like there are a LOT more proportional people online who are Fate proselytizers than there are playing. While I didn't look super close - I didn't spot any Fate games in the Origins book this year. (not that that's proof - but I was expecting to see a few)
Quote from: cranebump;971203Then there's PF, which, to me, is still D&D in a different guise.
Well - yeah. It was just a further iteration of 3.x because they (and many other people) didn't like how 4e was going.
Quote from: jan paparazzi;971193It seems to me the biggest trends or populair game systems (wether we like it or not) are:
1. D&D (D20)
2. Fate
3. Savage Worlds
4. Gumshoe
5. Indie (Apocalypse World/Burning Wheel)
6. Retroclones/OSR
7. Pathfinder
Is this a valid conclusion?
Aside from maybee Fate? No.
5e is eclipsing pathfinder/d20/3e.
Gumshoe I've never had anyone interested in. Theyd rather play Call of Cthulhu rather than a "fix" for something that was never broken.
WoD seems to be still coasting along. Maybee at 7? 8?
The rest. Havent heard much at all of so cant say.
Quote from: Charon's Little Helper;971204Well - yeah. It was just a further iteration of 3.x because they (and many other people) didn't like how 4e was going.
Right. And, considering that, I should probably amend my response to read, "It's D&D (to include clones, knock-offs, various house rules, etc.), and then everything else in second place."
According to various Market surveys the top four are
D&D5e
Pathfinder
Star Wars
Shadowrun
With various other systems rotating in fifth.
The list was in no particular order by the way.
Quote from: estar;971219According to various Market surveys the top four are
D&D5e
Pathfinder
Star Wars
Shadowrun
But that would be what's been purchased, right? Not necessarily what's being played.
When I look at what's on offer around her locally, on P&P Games, local game meetups, and our city's RPG FB page, it's all 5e and Pathfinder... occasionally Shadowrun... I saw a guy asking for Traveller.
Taking into consideration discussions, PbPs and rules questions threads, I would say the OP is spot on.
I would just swap Apocalypse World for Dungeon World.
Pretty much everything you can find that tracks sales or play online will put D&D at the top.
Q1 2017 on Roll 20 Report says: (http://blog.roll20.net/post/159952619415/the-orr-group-industry-report-q1-2017).
QuoteDungeons & Dragons fifth edition continues to increase in both player and game activity – this quarter, 49% of Roll20 games were 5E games. Pathfinder continues to hold the second most popular spot, and 3.5E remains in third place.
Just for kicks, I looked at Amazon's current list (https://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/books/16211/ref=pd_zg_hrsr_b_1_3#5). D&D 5E takes up almost the entire 1-20 block, with Pathfinder at #22, Shadowrun at #47, and Savage Worlds at #48.
Quote from: jan paparazzi;971193It seems to me the biggest trends or populair game systems (wether we like it or not) are:
1. D&D (D20)
2. Fate
3. Savage Worlds
4. Gumshoe
5. Indie (Apocalypse World/Burning Wheel)
6. Retroclones/OSR
7. Pathfinder
Is this a valid conclusion?
Its an almost data-free conclusion. So no, not valid.
Quote from: jan paparazzi;971193It seems to me the biggest trends or populair game systems (wether we like it or not) are:
1. D&D (D20)
2. Fate
3. Savage Worlds
4. Gumshoe
5. Indie (Apocalypse World/Burning Wheel)
6. Retroclones/OSR
7. Pathfinder
Is this a valid conclusion?
No idea as I play none of those. And since I'm generally the default GM, neither do the players. Flashing Blades is happening now, possibly to be followed by James Bond 007.
More to the point, why would anyone care what's popular anywhere other than at your table?
Because if the game I play is more popular than the game you play I am a better, smarter, and more attractive person than you are. Isn't that obvious?
Seriously I'm a bit jealous. Those are two good games that I own but that I have never played or run.
If you're referring to my post, that's unfortunate because they are both excellent games that were designed specifically for their settings. If you're even in the San Diego area maybe you can sit in if there is a game going on. Can't promise what game it'd be, though, as I change from one to another fairly often.
Quote from: Dumarest;971437If you're referring to my post, that's unfortunate because they are both excellent games that were designed specifically for their settings. If you're even in the San Diego area maybe you can sit in if there is a game going on. Can't promise what game it'd be, though, as I change from one to another fairly often.
I was. I'd love to. :) Unfortunately I'm on the other coast. :o
Quote from: Dumarest;971370More to the point, why would anyone care what's popular anywhere other than at your table?
How can this notion not be the notion that everyone starts from? I am honestly baffled by the panic that people feel that either
a) I need to know what other people are doing?
b) the panic that some people are driven to tears over that someone might be playing a game they don't play or don't like.
Quote from: ChristopherKubasik;971520How can this notion not be the notion that everyone starts from? I am honestly baffled by the panic that people feel that either
a) I need to know what other people are doing?
b) the panic that some people are driven to tears over that someone might be playing a game they don't play or don't like.
Yeah, I think for all the good of easy access to information and communication that it allows, the Internet also tempts us to indulge in our worst instincts. Much easier to be an argumentative petty busybody when anonymous. It's part of why I try to limit my time online. Sometimes I'm sorry I caved in and registered in this forum. I think we often feel compelled to comment in threads even when we really have nothing useful to add and would probably be better off scrolling down to a thread where we have something worthy to post. I know I've regretted posting my opinions on a few topics. We get too involved in things that really have no bearing on our lives or our gaming groups at all.
But I do enjoy your blog especially when you write about Traveller '77. I think it's been about a month since you last posted there! Get cracking!
Quote from: ChristopherKubasik;971520How can this notion not be the notion that everyone starts from? I am honestly baffled by the panic that people feel that either
a) I need to know what other people are doing?
b) the panic that some people are driven to tears over that someone might be playing a game they don't play or don't like.
For myself, my only concern is whether I could find a group to play with that I'd enjoy or find Players if I wanted to run a particular game. Here locally, it's gotten harder I think.
Really, I'll play just about anything at least once... but I've seen how hard it is for our GM to find new Players and keep them... and some of the demands I see local LFG/LFM queries making are very narrow.
It's been MUCH easier to find what I'm after online, but it's still optimal playing face-to-face.
Quote from: jan paparazzi;971193It seems to me the biggest trends or populair game systems (wether we like it or not) are:
1. D&D (D20)
2. Fate
3. Savage Worlds
4. Gumshoe
5. Indie (Apocalypse World/Burning Wheel)
6. Retroclones/OSR
7. Pathfinder
Is this a valid conclusion?
What's popular right now still are solo-players that are looking for human random number generators for their next game. So they tell their friends that they wan't to be Dungeon Master at a game table.
Quote from: Dumarest;971554But I do enjoy your blog especially when you write about Traveller '77. I think it's been about a month since you last posted there! Get cracking!
Thanks so much!
Things are really busy right now and time is tight. For now I can either put my gaming time into prepping my game or into writing the blog posts. So I game.
But I do have more posts I want to get on!
Quote from: ChristopherKubasik;971612Thanks so much!
Things are really busy right now and time is tight. For now I can either put my gaming time into prepping my game or into writing the blog posts. So I game.
But I do have more posts I want to get on!
Clearly your priorities are correct.
The industry charts, from ENWorld, generally has it as:
1) D&D
2) Pathfinder
3) Star Wars
4) Shadowrun
5) Another game (varies)
The last two especially, fluctuate depending on releases. Call of Cthulhu 7E broke into the top 5 last quarter of 2016, Dragon Age before that, etc. These figures don't take into account things like online sales, drivethru or kickstarter campaigns. The various World of Darkness kick-starters and pdfs, have made a multi-million turnover in recent years but it's pretty impossible to be able to rank these alongside each other (although I suspect they would still be in there if there were conventional retail releases still). There are other measures of 'hotness' too - you can rank games in terms of internet buzz for example. Of these, 6 of the current Top 10 are D&D variants:
1) D&D 5e
2) Pathfinder
3) OSR
4) D&D 3.5
5) D&D 4e
6) WOIN (ENWorld's own system)
7) Savage Worlds
8) AD&D 2e
9) World of Darkness
10) GURPS
The full set of data can be found here (http://www.enworld.org/forum/content.php?1984-Top-5-RPGs-Compiled-Charts-2008-Present#.WVYSV8Z7G2x) and here (http://www.enworld.org/forum/hotgames.php).
Unless you are getting into splits by edition Pathfinder is D&D, as are most OSR/Retroclone games. Swords & Wizardry is D&D, Beyond the Wall is D&D.
I am certain that there are more tables playing some variant of D&D than all other games combined. My current table is no exception. We are currently playing Mutant Future which is a retroclone of Gamma World, using the Laryrinth Lord rules, which are a retroclone of D&D, so it boils down to a D&D variant.
Think of it this way if RPGs are soda D&D is cola. 5e, Pathfinder, OSR, that's Coke, Pepsi, RC, etc.
Quote from: jan paparazzi;971193It seems to me the biggest trends or populair game systems (wether we like it or not) are:
1. D&D (D20)
2. Fate
3. Savage Worlds
4. Gumshoe
5. Indie (Apocalypse World/Burning Wheel)
6. Retroclones/OSR
7. Pathfinder
Is this a valid conclusion?
No.
The most accurate listing would be:
1) D&D 5e
2) Pathfinder
3) in relatively distant 3rd: all other editions of D&D, plus OSR games.
4) everything else, which barely registers.
The Roll20 data agrees (D&D and Pathfinder dominant) and disagrees (WH, Star Wars and WoD are way bigger than the OSR). (http://blog.roll20.net/post/148840854540/the-orr-group-industry-report-q2-2016) Course online play isn't totally reflective of home games but I bet it gives a better indication than most think, I've noticed more and more migrating to online play, even older players. And the future is most likely more online than anywhere else.
Well let's see...
Currently Playing -
0D&D Campaign
5e D&D Campaign
Currently Running
0D&D Campaign
Actively Prepping or Developing for home games
Gamma World - Florida
Castles & Crusades Darkenfold adventures
Mindjammer Campaign (FATE)
Classic Traveller
Actively Prepping for Convention Games
0D&D
Gamma World - Florida
Mindjammer (FATE)
Traveller
Ran Earlier This Year
Star Wars Saga d20
I ran Roll20 earlier this year. Still am not enjoying running online games with the same enthusiasm as tabletop. With online games I'm getting a consistency problem with players not playing a full campaign, but just playing one or two sessions, and then switching games. Too entirely to unpredictable and flighty for me. Much prefer a game where a group of players get together regularly to play, with a history, and who work together as (more or less) a team. Not getting that with online games.
Quote from: ChristopherKubasik;971612Thanks so much!
Things are really busy right now and time is tight. For now I can either put my gaming time into prepping my game or into writing the blog posts. So I game.
But I do have more posts I want to get on!
At least you can use some of the material from here as you did on your June 29th entry. I only wish it were a book I could carry with me and refer back to as needed. You need to print it in the same size as the old Travelled books so I can keep it in my box.
Quote from: Voros;972614The Roll20 data agrees (D&D and Pathfinder dominant) and disagrees (WH, Star Wars and WoD are way bigger than the OSR). (http://blog.roll20.net/post/148840854540/the-orr-group-industry-report-q2-2016) Course online play isn't totally reflective of home games but I bet it gives a better indication than most think, I've noticed more and more migrating to online play, even older players. And the future is most likely more online than anywhere else.
It has its own biases, however. Fans of certain games are probably a lot more likely to embrace online play than fans of other games.
Quote from: RPGPundit;972949It has its own biases, however. Fans of certain games are probably a lot more likely to embrace online play than fans of other games.
Just about any of the information is biased. That's the nature of data of this sort. Sales isn't correct because some people are still using their old books from 1982. Downloads aren't correct because not everyone has embraced digital and on top of that, I tend to download things on a laptop, desktop, and smartphone so I can read it whenever the urge strikes. Plus there's the fact that not everything bought or downloaded is even played. I know most of us have games on our shelves we bought and never played. How do you really know what people are playing? Polls are flawed.
Any of it is biased.
Quote from: Dumarest;972681At least you can use some of the material from here as you did on your June 29th entry. I only wish it were a book I could carry with me and refer back to as needed. You need to print it in the same size as the old Travelled books so I can keep it in my box.
For what it's worth, I've posted a summary of a Classic
Traveller session I improvised at a local convention a couple of months ago (https://talestoastound.wordpress.com/2017/07/03/an-improvised-classic-traveller-convention-game/).
To give you a fix for a while...
Quote from: Voros;972614The Roll20 data agrees (D&D and Pathfinder dominant) and disagrees (WH, Star Wars and WoD are way bigger than the OSR). (http://blog.roll20.net/post/148840854540/the-orr-group-industry-report-q2-2016) Course online play isn't totally reflective of home games but I bet it gives a better indication than most think, I've noticed more and more migrating to online play, even older players. And the future is most likely more online than anywhere else.
Roll20 also skews towards games with miniatures. I play in several online games, and the only one that uses something other than straight video chat is a Savage Worlds games. Everything else has no need for an interface. We just roll our own dice and talk to each other.
When I run, I actively avoid choosing games that will require any kind of interface as I find the prep involved to limiting. If I run something with minis at the tabletop, I can still easily improvise and scribble on the battlemat as needed. With minis in a virtual tabletop, I feel more bound to prepared maps and counters.
Obviously, there is no question that D&D and Pathfinder are top of the heap. I just think it gets a lot murkier past that point.
Quote from: TrippyHippy;972275The industry charts, from ENWorld, generally has it as:
1) D&D 5e
2) Pathfinder
3) OSR
4) D&D 3.5
5) D&D 4e
6) WOIN (ENWorld's own system)
7) Savage Worlds
8) AD&D 2e
9) World of Darkness
10) GURPS
The full set of data can be found here (http://www.enworld.org/forum/content.php?1984-Top-5-RPGs-Compiled-Charts-2008-Present#.WVYSV8Z7G2x) and here (http://www.enworld.org/forum/hotgames.php).
This is probably accurate. I see WoD dropping from nr. 2 till out of the top 5. Warhammer 40K and Frpg are both there some years ago. Personally I thought some of the other systems I mentioned like Fate, SW or Gumshoe would also see some play, because they got some Ennie nominations last few years. So people voted for them.
When the Roll20 data was first published, I noticed right away that there were some interesting numbers there that made me question just how much could be taken from it. For example, if you look at that list and nothing else then Exalted is actually less popular than Anima: Beyond Fantasy and only slightly ahead of Fallout, a game which doesn't officially exist. Non-American players can sway the numbers quite a bit as well, which many people don't consider.
I'd wager the top of the list is accurate in that D&D/Pathfinder and a few others like Star Wars are well ahead of the curve, but after that it's next to impossible to tell.
Quote from: ChristopherKubasik;973121For what it's worth, I've posted a summary of a Classic Traveller session I improvised at a local convention a couple of months ago (https://talestoastound.wordpress.com/2017/07/03/an-improvised-classic-traveller-convention-game/).
To give you a fix for a while...
Awesome, can't wait to read it. Probably tonight or tomorrow on a break as we are neck- deep in 4th of July events at a local park right now. Great homemade strawberry lemonade with real strawberries floating about and
puerco con queso straight out of Guatemala.
In any case, D&D in its many forms is immensely more popular than anything else.
Quote from: Brand55;973135When the Roll20 data was first published, I noticed right away that there were some interesting numbers there that made me question just how much could be taken from it. For example, if you look at that list and nothing else then Exalted is actually less popular than Anima: Beyond Fantasy and only slightly ahead of Fallout, a game which doesn't officially exist. Non-American players can sway the numbers quite a bit as well, which many people don't consider.
And I would guess that is partly because Exalted isn't a game that uses minis. There isn't a compelling reason to use Roll20 when playing it online.