SPECIAL NOTICE
Malicious code was found on the site, which has been removed, but would have been able to access files and the database, revealing email addresses, posts, and encoded passwords (which would need to be decoded). However, there is no direct evidence that any such activity occurred. REGARDLESS, BE SURE TO CHANGE YOUR PASSWORDS. And as is good practice, remember to never use the same password on more than one site. While performing housekeeping, we also decided to upgrade the forums.
This is a site for discussing roleplaying games. Have fun doing so, but there is one major rule: do not discuss political issues that aren't directly and uniquely related to the subject of the thread and about gaming. While this site is dedicated to free speech, the following will not be tolerated: devolving a thread into unrelated political discussion, sockpuppeting (using multiple and/or bogus accounts), disrupting topics without contributing to them, and posting images that could get someone fired in the workplace (an external link is OK, but clearly mark it as Not Safe For Work, or NSFW). If you receive a warning, please take it seriously and either move on to another topic or steer the discussion back to its original RPG-related theme.

What I would like to see in core rules books

Started by BadApple, January 08, 2024, 08:02:56 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

BadApple

As I've been reviewing games, I've noticed several things that make or break a core book for me and I thought I'd share here.   Hopefully this will spark a healthy conversation.  I know there's a number of designers and aspirants here so maybe this might be useful.  These aren't demands, just my thoughts.  Anyone that has the vision and the fortitude to get something out to the public automatically gets my respect.

1.  Don't mix your mechanics and lore too much.

When it comes to trying to learn the mechanics of the game, I want a clean description of the mechanic and then followed up with a simple example.  Of course, use in setting assets in the narrative to go over your example but make the rule itself a clean and neutral statement.

2.  Give me quick reference cheat sheets for generating PCs and for combat.

For PC creation, a simple bullet point step by step list is all that's needed to keep me straight.  Each line item needs to be a single action by the player; don't add two things like buy equipment and adjust bonuses on the same line.  It doesn't need to describe how to do the step but a page number for that step would be a bonus.  Also, keep the PC creation part of the book in the same order as it's on the cheat sheet as this will greatly help the first time player roll up a PC smoothly.

For combat, The goal should be a sheet or two for a new player to quickly reference to get through his turn.  Lay out the the way checks are done for both offense and defense.  List all the possible choices that are mechanical to your system that a PC can do in combat.  List bonuses and penalties under their common effect.  If these things do a +2 then they should all go together.  List all the status effects.  Finally, make sure to hit things like cover, stealth in combat, etc.  Again, you don't need to do a detailed description of these things.

3.  Give me NPCs in context with the setting.

A well done NPC will help me understand your setting and how characters fit into it better than anything.  If you want to do some form of faction leader, that's ok.  I think the best NPCs would be some form of mid level character that both has a little influence but also takes orders.  Tell me a lot about him; his job, how he thinks about his peers, his family, a little history, something players can do to get on his good side and something they can do to piss him off that they may not be prepared for.

4.  If you're introducing a novel mechanic, tell me in plain language why and how you think it makes the game better.

I've seen a lot of new mechanics and sometimes it's a bit difficult to sus out what it's for.  Just spell it out.

5.  FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, QUARANTINE YOUR ART!!!

I love good art in game books. Whether it's a simple black and white ink drawing or a color plate with lots of action, I'm happy to have it.  Please keep the text black on a white background for the body of the book.  Reading text that's over images gets to be taxing and more so the more images are under the text. 

6.  Give me a good table of contents, an index, and a glossary.

The easier it is to use your book, the more likely I am to use your book.  These basic tools should be in every game book and done to the nines. 

7.  Give me tables for the equipment.

The game needs detailed descriptions of weapons and gear with out a doubt.  It also needs a table where I can compare similar gear and their stats in a single location.  Whether it's a GM trying to adjudicate an in game event or a player trying to buy his next new shiny, table make things work better.

8.  Organize rules together.

All the rules pertaining to how to use a piece of equipment or seduce a horse should be in the same location.  I shouldn't have to look in one location for determining the ingredients for a potion and another location to look up the skill check for mixing the potion.

9.  Give me designer notes.

You aren't breaking your game or your setting if you explain a little about why you made certain choices or what kind of experiences your hoping players are going to have.  As a GM, I'm working with you the author to share your magic with the players.  Make me a team member with you.

10.  Play test your game.

Find the meanest players you can and have them rip you apart.  It will hurt your feelings but you will be given feedback that you can use to see parts that don't work well.

Roll dice and simulate various aspects of your game at the table for a while so you get a sense of how it's working.

Find someone to read your stuff and be prepared to not like what you hear.  If you can take your lumps in the beginning, you can avoid producing an expensive failure like Dark Stars or Katana-Ra.
>Blade Runner RPG
Terrible idea, overwhelming majority of ttrpg players can't pass Voight-Kampff test.
    - Anonymous

Tod13

The play testers don't even have to be mean. I have a co-worker who will figure out the maximum effective character design. Just cause that's how he works. He's great for that sort of playtesting.

hedgehobbit

I 100% agree with this list. The one thing I'd add is that I prefer that most of the lore actually be revealed as part of the rules; whether that's regional specific character classes and equipments lists or short descriptions in the monsters list ("commonly found on the shores of the Emerald Isles" sort of thing). Long descriptions of ancient politics is almost entirely useless in actual play. Save that stuff for the novelization.

rytrasmi

I agree with all of these and most of them fall into the broad category of "know your audience".

Your readers are going to be looking up rules, so yeah, index and TOC are critical. A short book probably doesn't need an index but even a word processor's automatically generated index is better than nothing.

And designer notes are great! Lamentations does this often and it really helps. Your more experienced readers are going to question why you made certain decisions, so don't be coy - just tell them.

You've got a great list there and hopefully designers will take heed.
The worms crawl in and the worms crawl out
The ones that crawl in are lean and thin
The ones that crawl out are fat and stout
Your eyes fall in and your teeth fall out
Your brains come tumbling down your snout
Be merry my friends
Be merry

Steven Mitchell

Agree with most of that for a single core book. 

One of the things I'm learning as I play test is that the documents you need for a play test are not always inline with what you would need for a polished core book.  If nothing else, to save reprinting costs.  I've got 3 different test groups now, and have spent several hundred dollars on printing in the last 12 months (with a fairly efficient small business printer).  The only thing that makes it palatable is that I've got multiple, smaller books, not one core book.  An index is superfluous at this stage, since what's needed instead is a 1-page guide to the individual documents, and then table of contents in each one, along with the reference sheets you mentioned. 

Unlike an index, the reference sheets should be built as you go, maybe sometimes even first.  If you get to the point where you have a "core book" but no reference sheets, and need to do those at the end--I'll suggest there are flaws in the core book that doing it the other way would have uncovered.  It's not quite as bad as doing the character sheet as an afterthought, but the same dynamic.

Though since mine will always be either PDF, or maybe print on demand, I have no intention of doing a single core book. 

BadApple

Quote from: Steven Mitchell on January 08, 2024, 11:31:50 AM
Agree with most of that for a single core book. 

One of the things I'm learning as I play test is that the documents you need for a play test are not always inline with what you would need for a polished core book.  If nothing else, to save reprinting costs.  I've got 3 different test groups now, and have spent several hundred dollars on printing in the last 12 months (with a fairly efficient small business printer).  The only thing that makes it palatable is that I've got multiple, smaller books, not one core book.  An index is superfluous at this stage, since what's needed instead is a 1-page guide to the individual documents, and then table of contents in each one, along with the reference sheets you mentioned.

You're going about a solution in a way that's different than how I suggested but it looks like you've identified the same problem I have: GMs and players need to be able to find the things they need without rereading the entire game manual.  I appreciate that. 

Quote from: Steven Mitchell on January 08, 2024, 11:31:50 AM
Unlike an index, the reference sheets should be built as you go, maybe sometimes even first.  If you get to the point where you have a "core book" but no reference sheets, and need to do those at the end--I'll suggest there are flaws in the core book that doing it the other way would have uncovered.  It's not quite as bad as doing the character sheet as an afterthought, but the same dynamic.

Though since mine will always be either PDF, or maybe print on demand, I have no intention of doing a single core book.

While I don't have your experience, I suspect you're entirely correct.  I've recently reviewed five different games with mechanics that were to some degree broken.  I believe every one of them could have been avoided if they had just compiled a reference sheet for the core mechanics and rolled the dice a couple of times. 

Like I said in my OP, this isn't a list of demands.  This is me as a GM and a player offering an olive branch and some suggestions for our relationship as creator/GM/player to work better.  What I'm hoping is that there is someone who is working on a project that gets a little nudge from this that makes their product more usable to the players.

I appreciate you, as a creator, taking your time to read my list and consider it honestly.
>Blade Runner RPG
Terrible idea, overwhelming majority of ttrpg players can't pass Voight-Kampff test.
    - Anonymous

GeekyBugle

Good advice, bookmarking this thread to come back to it.
Quote from: Rhedyn

Here is why this forum tends to be so stupid. Many people here think Joe Biden is "The Left", when he is actually Far Right and every US republican is just an idiot.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act."

― George Orwell

yosemitemike

I think a game needs to some default framework for play.  What to the characters typically do in this game?  It doesn't have to be complicated or deep but I think it should be there. 

For god's sake, give me a useful table of contents, glossary and index.     

Don't put heavy textures and art behind the words.  I have to read this thing.  Also, cool it with the crazy fonts and layout.

Quote from: BadApple on January 08, 2024, 08:02:56 AM
Find the meanest players you can and have them rip you apart.  It will hurt your feelings but you will be given feedback that you can use to see parts that don't work well.

Roll dice and simulate various aspects of your game at the table for a while so you get a sense of how it's working.

Find someone to read your stuff and be prepared to not like what you hear.  If you can take your lumps in the beginning, you can avoid producing an expensive failure like Dark Stars or Katana-Ra.

I think you should also get people to playtest your game who don't know it at all.  They have to figure out how to play from just reading the book like many actual customers will. 
"I am certain, however, that nothing has done so much to destroy the juridical safeguards of individual freedom as the striving after this mirage of social justice."― Friedrich Hayek
Another former RPGnet member permanently banned for calling out the staff there on their abdication of their responsibilities as moderators and admins and their abject surrender to the whims of the shrillest and most self-righteous members of the community.