I'll join the Kender bandwagon.

Retroism/Minimalism. Keep all your simple20, C&C, or whatnot. Gimme a fantasy game I can sink my teeth into.

Either extreme end of the "magic item importance spectrum". I hate games that try to be stingy about magic, and I hate games where the players cry because Mordenkainen's Disjunction exists in the setting. Your items are cool, but they are not you. Prepare to lose them. Easy come, easy go, bitch.

Long intros. If you're not investigating mysteries or rolling initiative in half an hour, something's wrong.

Twist-my-arm-to-get-me-to-do-anything characters. If your character is so reluctant to adventure, they would stay at home and become a farmer; roll a new one.

Maps of inns without outdoors bathrooms!

Quote from: Pierce InverarityMaps of inns without outdoors bathrooms!

You've got a street; what more do you want?

Quote from: Pierce InverarityMaps of inns without outdoors bathrooms!

The problem is that you are expecting a bathroom.  I think you need to spend more time touring historical sites.

Quote from: John MorrowThe problem is that you are expecting a bathroom.  I think you need to spend more time touring historical sites.

 But they are FANTASY roleplaying games - not always historical recreations.  Can't part of the fantasy be an attempt at good hygiene for the characters?

- E.W.C.

Anal historicism in fantasy games!

Quote from: KoltarBut they are FANTASY roleplaying games - not always historical recreations.  Can't part of the fantasy be an attempt at good hygiene for the characters?

At some point, one has to wonder what the purpose of the Medieval trappings are.  

But, OK, let's say we want anachronistic personal hygiene in our fantasy.  We put a bathroom in the inn.  What are the facilities like?  Does the inn have running water?  Does it have drains?  Where does the waste go?  If it doesn't go anywhere, that's like having a porta-potty in your house.  Yuck!  If it just goes into a hole in the ground, you've essentially built the in over the latrine pit.  Again, yuck!  So now we are in the realm of considering fantasy plumbing, septic tanks or sewage treatment plants, and so on.  

Now, if you still want to argue it's FANTASY, I've got to ask why the concern over where the characters go to relieve themselves?  If anything needs to be glossed over here, I would think that would be it.  Or maybe it would be easy to assume that there is an outhouse somewhere outside that's just too simple to be included on the floor plans.

Quote from: Pierce InverarityAnal historicism in fantasy games!

Hey, you're the one who is worried about where the characters go to relieve themselves.  I think that's being, quite literally, anal about something.

• Polytheism as a set of monotheistic deities - instead characters should follow a whole pantheon worshipping and sacrificing to each god in turn as fit (one reason I like Tekumel as it's one of the few settings to treat fantasy religion like this)
  
• XP sink Gods - Deities & Demigods shouldn't be yet another Monster Manual
  
• D&D's alignment system - even Palladium's works better; I prefer none at all but ye Olde Law vs. Chaos is fun in stuff like WFRP and I'm warming to Tekumel's Stability vs. Chaos with the Concordtant leading to underground warfare between temples, secret societies, & inter-temple plotting
  
• alignment tongues - ok I get that they might have been intended to be some sort of Law vs. Chaos solidarity thing but that's not how they turned out
  
• Realworld Cultureland Musical Chairs - at least a little bit of internal consistency and some spark; too close to history (but not enough) and it can turn into Ars Magica nitpicking fests / disconnect between setting and history; that and yetanotherVikingClicheLand etc. has gotten a bit old for me
  
• Vancian magic that isn't that much Vancian
  
• Magic items and magic on every street - i.e. so commonplace and mundane they're no longer "magical"; they should exist with quite the variety but should not be the equivalent of going down to the corner market to stock up on
  
• short emo elves with more hair colors than anime girls - I want tall First Age Kinslaying elves that shatter the world order & bring down the wrath of the Gods lusting after their lost creations! Elves that challenge the Dark Lord to single combat, burn for their pride, die for their passion. Burning Wheel comes close esp. The Path of Spite pdf.
  
• too many non-humans running around - IMO they're best used as spice, usually lone wanderers
  
• too many half-breeds - No parties of tweaked-out half-elves. Instead they should be as rare and different as the children of Beren and Lúthien. Half-orcs more along the lines of earlier D&D and Tolkein, odd humans instead of odd orcs.

QuoteAt some point, one has to wonder what the purpose of the Medieval trappings are.

Dude, the bloody Romans built sewers ages before the "medieval" era that most Fantasy goes for, I don't think it's at all a stretch to suggest some utter fantasy world couldn't have them as well.  

Lighten up.

which brings to mind another pet peeve:  Anal retentive individuals who insist on trying to force fantasy into complying with their own conception of "what makes sense".  I imagine some of these sorts as children bitching about the Care Bears.  "But mommy, bears can't make beams of light come from their tummies!  That would require a much higher metabolism!"

Hey I didn't bring up the "outhouse" topic , just added a comment to someone else's thought.

 I like My 'Fantasy" to be well... FANTASY!. In other words fun!! . So, of course we gloss over stuff like that.

  I just recently ran the setting of BANESTORM - which has many intentional anachronisms in it as part of the setting. One is that the world's inhabitants know of the idea of germs and infection. They DO know its generallly a good idea to wash your hands after certain things. The people in  that land gave germs the nickname of "demonettes".

- E.W.C.

Quote from: Dr Rotwang!From this day on, we are as brothers.

Can someone clue me into this Kender thing?

I've yet to encounter, in game, something to hate about fantasy.  Fuck, I've had: towns with standing bounties for dead monsters; stores that stocked every item and weapon known to man; half-dragon rangers on the hunt for draconic child support (a fine campaign from my middle-school years)...

Let it be known, though, that I classify kitchen-sink anime stuff like Exalted as outside vanilla fantasy (steampunk, too.)  That may skew my data.

I do not like unachievable goals.

The evil that cannot be defeated, the horrors that cannot be stopped, and the bad guys who cannot be foiled.

Other than that I hate not being able to compete against my archnemesis.

QM:confused:

Anything that's in the realm of distinction without difference.

Quote from: AkrasiaI can't imagine playing in a setting that had cultures completely alien to me.  It would take years to even learn the setting, let alone play in it.  (This is, I suppose, one of the reasons why I could never get into Tekumel.)

My recomendation is to give Raymond E. Feist's Riftwar books a try. They start in a vanilla fantasy world and go back and forth between Tekumel with the serial numbers filed off. Someyear I should run an Empire of the Petal Throne PBEM or chat in media res game. D&D party rifts onto Tekumel & becomes a sorceror's dogsbodies, barbarians off the boat, tomb patrol ala Discworld's Night Watch, or doomed legion ala 300.

Most of my group start as total newbies* to the setting & we're having a blast. I fired an orbital laser on them last session. :keke: In game I assume the culture functions as it should most of the time and focus on player actions. I have some Real World "soundbites" I use to quickly help a player grasp an aspect of Tekumel culture as well as 1:1 analogues to the Five Empires of the setting but Pundy might bleed from his ears again. For another thread or PM.

Tekumel's not going to be everyone's cuppa by any means but it doesn't have to presented in an inaccessible way. Some of the fans seem to want that, me I just want to have some gonzo fun. It's Dungeoncrawl+. The depth is there for when I want to use it.

(caffeine is the killer of sleep)

* I had heard of Tekumel sometime after 2000 but it didn't click & I didn't really read anything until T:EPT; since then I've also found Empire of the Petal Throne very accessible if you are ok with early TSR presentation; I've yet to read any Tekumel book cover to cover