Several pages of village idiot applicants doing to one group exactly what they bitch incessantly about the Woke doing to them.

Get a mirror. You are just another form of Moral Guardian pushing oppression, censorship, and unreasoning hate.

Quote from: Rob Necronomicon on April 22, 2022, 11:22:49 AM

Quote from: ShieldWife on April 22, 2022, 10:43:02 AM
In fact, usually if "conservatives" want to censor something these days, it's because they have been influenced by the left and are censoring something that they perceive as being too far right.

Oh Sure. LOL

The conservatives are not trying to ban transgender bathrooms and force creationism into the classroom.

Transgender bathrooms? What is that? Bathrooms for trans people only? Or are you talking about banning males (trans women) from the women's bathroom?

As for the creationism in schools part, that made the political right unpalatable to me too back in the day. But I think it's been 15 years or more since we saw the last of that in any meaningful way, and even then I don't think most Republicans were that keen on it. Right now, the woke attempt at takeover is much worse, led to more violence, and has been much more successful.

Quote from: Trond on April 22, 2022, 05:38:27 PM
Right now, the woke attempt at takeover is much worse, led to more violence, and has been much more successful.

Two sides of the same 'extreme' coin both effluent as far as I'm concerned.

Although, I don't have a problem with your 'average' conservative or churchgoer.

Also, I thought we've moved beyond all this and we're supposed to go back to WW?

Was WW ever coercing people into changing their vocabulary? Were they demanding that people adppt a whole new set of pronouns? Were they telling people that long used and accepted words were now forbidden because in their newspeak they were offensive?  Were they actively organizing efforts to harass, persecute and cancel culture people out of their careers and livliehoods?

If not then no they were not woke, because that's what woke is.

Quote from: Battlemaster on April 26, 2022, 06:38:21 AM
If not then no they were not woke, because that's what woke is.

Nailed it.

Quote from: Rob Necronomicon on April 26, 2022, 06:41:01 AM

Quote from: Battlemaster on April 26, 2022, 06:38:21 AM
If not then no they were not woke, because that's what woke is.

Nailed it.

Thank you. Really.  I'm glad to see someone agree with my definition.

Quote from: Battlemaster on April 26, 2022, 06:38:21 AM
Was WW ever coercing people into changing their vocabulary? Were they demanding that people adppt a whole new set of pronouns?

Yes. They just are limited in enforcement because they are books anybody can buy.

Its very limited to assume that cultural pushes and demands are weaker then political pushes and demands.

Quote from: Trond on April 22, 2022, 05:38:27 PM

Quote from: Rob Necronomicon on April 22, 2022, 11:22:49 AM

Quote from: ShieldWife on April 22, 2022, 10:43:02 AM
In fact, usually if "conservatives" want to censor something these days, it's because they have been influenced by the left and are censoring something that they perceive as being too far right.

Oh Sure. LOL

The conservatives are not trying to ban transgender bathrooms and force creationism into the classroom.

Transgender bathrooms? What is that? Bathrooms for trans people only? Or are you talking about banning males (trans women) from the women's bathroom?

As for the creationism in schools part, that made the political right unpalatable to me too back in the day. But I think it's been 15 years or more since we saw the last of that in any meaningful way, and even then I don't think most Republicans were that keen on it. Right now, the woke attempt at takeover is much worse, led to more violence, and has been much more successful.

How dare the women want to be able to pee without seeing a stranger's feminine penis!?

Ah the classic "Not enforcing our political will is the same as us taking away your options"

Quote from: Battlemaster on April 26, 2022, 06:38:21 AM
Was WW ever coercing people into changing their vocabulary? Were they demanding that people adppt a whole new set of pronouns? Were they telling people that long used and accepted words were now forbidden because in their newspeak they were offensive?  Were they actively organizing efforts to harass, persecute and cancel culture people out of their careers and livliehoods?

If not then no they were not woke, because that's what woke is.

They were one of the prior waves version of woke, which was overall not as stringent as the current 2010 wave. But they were playing the game of that era.

"boo hoo hoo Native Americans! Boo hoo hoo Native Americans!" remember that? Yeah. The trailing end of the 70s waves pet minority before the 90s wave switched to mostly championing hispanics.

This  is not a thread to discuss politics outside of gaming.

I dont think anyone had yet? We are still kicking White Wolf for some of its early woke material. Which compared to the current iteration of the Woke agenda. Was relatively mild overall. Shadowrun jumped on the same bandwagon. And over time watered down its NA elements with each edition.

Now-a-days WW is too busy bending knee rather than being edgy.

Quote from: Omega on April 30, 2022, 05:16:59 PM
I dont think anyone had yet? We are still kicking White Wolf for some of its early woke material. Which compared to the current iteration of the Woke agenda. Was relatively mild overall. Shadowrun jumped on the same bandwagon. And over time watered down its NA elements with each edition.

Now-a-days WW is too busy bending knee rather than being edgy.

Renraku is one of my favourite campaign/splatbooks ever. It's like an pen and paper version of System Shock. I doubt such a book would be made today.

To get back on topic, I think the big issue isn't just a White Wolf issue. A lot of RPG makers hired people from California, Portland, and so on. They all leaned left at a time when doing so was the counter culture and edgy thing to do. White Wolf in particular took that MTV style of punk mixed it with Goth culture at the time (which also leaned left due to conservative christians) the issue is a lot of these people are now in their 40's and are DESPERATELY trying to delude themselves and other people into believing they're still hip and counter culture. So they double down which results in shit like VtM becoming a political manifesto. Because these 40 year old men are so desperate for validation from younger people that they will just throw these IPs at them. They aren't thinking about business or making money. It's pure emotional need. And then you get into the situation where these out of touch Gen-X to early Millennial guys were still not getting enough validation so outright gave control of things like White Wolf to idiot young people who were even more sick and twisted than the OGs. You can say the same about the Comic book industry which has similar issues. Lots of out of touch old men trying desperately to stay relevant and not realizing the cognitive dissonance their actions are causing. We even have one who occasionally posts here in Zak Sabbath. He's a textbook example. The RPG industry was always doomed tbh.

I'm currently working on some retroclones myself, taking into account how urban fantasy fiction has evolved significantly since the early 90s. For example, my take on werewolves uses modern tropes like born vs bitten and alpha/beta/omega biological divisions.

Quote from: BoxCrayonTales on May 01, 2022, 09:48:08 AM
I'm currently working on some retroclones myself, taking into account how urban fantasy fiction has evolved significantly since the early 90s. For example, my take on werewolves uses modern tropes like born vs bitten and alpha/beta/omega biological divisions.

If you want to be ahead of the curve on the understanding of wolf behavior then nuke the alpha/beta/omega thing as its been wholly discredited in the last few years. It turns out that packs are almost entirely immediate families and "alpha" is really just "mom and dad" and "omega" is just the youngest members of the family.