Quote from: GrimJesta[votes this the worst thread ever]

Indeed.

Quote from: Erik BoielleSorry, I'm not sure you are bright enough to understand what I'm getting at.

Ah well, I'm sure I'll rant on this again in a week or so.

Your just so cute, I could pinch you.

Quote from: SpikeAnd you can't do that with any number of existing games for what reason?

Yeah, but it is gonna be tricky with WFRP, which I feel is odd given it is supposed to be a warhammer game. And it isn't the kind of adventure they write. Again, I feel, oddly.

I dunno. As a result it makes life more difficult - you can't rip off stories or characters from warhammer novels, computer games, comics, anime or whatnot that are surely stuff that  roleplayers like.

Quote from: Erik BoielleYeah, but it is gonna be tricky with WFRP, which I feel is odd given it is supposed to be a warhammer game. And it isn't the kind of adventure they write. Again, I feel, oddly.

I dunno. As a result it makes life more difficult - you can't rip off stories or characters from warhammer novels, computer games, comics, anime or whatnot that are surely stuff that  roleplayers like.

You have no idea what you're talking about. You must have mistaken a deck of Munchkin cards for the WFRP corebook and flew into a knee-jerk fury. Have you even played the BI game?

-=Grim=-

Quote from: GrimJestaYou have no idea what you're talking about.

Ah! fantastic! Can you tell me which genre sources you draw on when playing your WFRP games? How you deal with players who want to play someone like such fan favorites and Gotrek or Hellbrant Grimm or Magnus Darkblade (or Kal Jerico or Lorken or Ragnar Blackmane)?

QuoteHave you even played the BI game?

Actually no. I've played some WFRP1, generally games that go something like 'PCs are at an inn. A noble insults them, so they murder him and promptly go on the run from the law'. Then the game falls apart and we go back to Vampire. And I've played a lot more GURPS and Call of Cthulhu, and between them I am convinced I never want to play another game where the PCs are normal people with no cool powerz ever again.

Sadly, I am an unreconstructed gamer who reads cheesy fantasy novels and likes anime, and it's just easier and more fun when everyone can act like they are in a cartoon.

Quote from: GrimJestaHave you even played the BI game?

Quote from: Erik BoielleActually no.

Things make a whole lot more sense now.


.

And I'm not gonna play it until they fix the fucking thing. It isn't an order of magnitude different from first ed. As far as I can see the most important changes they made were to slow progression by about half and nerf attacks a bit. Theres very little in there that plays to what I like about warhammer.

Why the hell would I want to play something I don't like! Hell, thats what I'm going on about! It doesn't make me want to play it, and its a warhammer game!

And I played Fire Warrior! All the way through!

That said, I haven't even been getting the books recently (no real interest, yknow?).

So maybe it has changed.

See, heres a thing from the BI boards - this is a character someone wants to play:-

QuoteShip’s Capitan and Ex Nobleman, Lucius Alexander Damien Picard. Lucius was born to a Imperial Noblewoman named Annette Picard after being raped by a Dark Eldar pirate. The event was hushed up and the child was raised as her own, he was never told of his father. As a young boy he yearned to explore the stars and would listen to the tales of adventure and battles told by the admirals and captains that would come to see his mother when they made port. When he was 17 his mother married an admiral named Sir William Tavington. She died later that year. Soon after her death Tavington discovers Annette’s diary. At the reading of Annette’s will he reveals that Lucius is part xenos so that he gets the fortune instead of Lucius. Tavington and Lucius dueled. Lucius drives a saber through the admiral’s heart shortly before grabbing all the money he can, getting on a ship and fleeing just as the Inquisition arrive. His appearance in records over the next few years is erratic. Until the start of the 3rd Armageddon War in 997.M41 where he is, at the age of 20 given his first command when he joined the Imperial Navy as volunteer Captain by the name of “Damien Tavington”. He fought in 7 major ship to ship conflicts and 1 ground assault. After the war he is said to have taken the ship he was commanding at the time (which he named the “Annette”) and returned to drugs and weapons smuggling and pillaging Imperial cargo vessels.

Okay. So thats Jean-Lucius Picard, the nice-half dark elf. For the record, I think it is as naff as you do*. And really, he should be doing that stuff in the game, not writing it in his character background.

But people come up with stuff like that all the time! They love this shit! Why isn't GW selling it to them!

*Or do I? It is no worse that most of the stuff I come up with. Hmmm. It is hard to live by ones own rhetoric. Certainly, his adventures sound kind of fun, and melodramatic enough. But really, don't write it in to the bloody background kid! Focus on what makes him interesting now, not what intereting things he has done before!

Quote from: Erik BoielleActually no. I've played some WFRP1, generally games that go something like 'PCs are at an inn. A noble insults them, so they murder him and promptly go on the run from the law'. Then the game falls apart and we go back to Vampire. .

And  once again you demonstrate that your real problem is shitty game masters.  The sooner you understand that the sooner the rest of us can stop having to listen to you whine.

I so want to repeat the canard 'No gaming is better than bad gaming'.  Consider it. You have yoru playstation, your xbox, your pc. Go forth and do what you enjoy. Be fruitful and pixelated.

Quote from: SpikeAnd  once again you demonstrate that your real problem is shitty game masters.

I dunno man. Abandoning game we thought we liked and moving to games that we really liked (games featuring characters like the above mentioned jean-lucius, if I am honest with myself) a lot of the problems went away.













Christ almighty but I hate elves though. Sigh. Do as I say, not as I do people!



AND he flies a ship named after his Mum! Isn't that a little weird?

Just so people understand where Erik's coming from, it's been established through previous discussions of a similar nature that:

1. He's a huge 40K fan who doesn't really know much about WH fantasy. He's never actually played WFB, although he owns a few (unpainted) WFB minis.
2. He thinks WH fantasy is basically 40K set in the Olden Days (a reasonably common misconception, but a misconception nonetheless).
3. The only fantasy fiction he's familiar with is the Slayer series.
4. He thinks WFB is about invincible "Space Marine"-type heroes hacking through hordes of rank-and-file.
5. He's not really interested in WH fantasy anyway. WFRP is just a foil for him to express his angst over the 40K RPG.

Thanks for clearing that up Herr Arnulfe. I'd just recently signed up in anticipation of royally flaming Erik for his facile understanding of Warhammer and its setting. Now I can save myself that time and aggravation.

Quote from: Herr Arnulfe2. He thinks WH fantasy is basically 40K set in the Olden Days

I'd phrase it more as 40K is warhammer in the future.

Quote(a reasonably common misconception, but a misconception nonetheless)

Seemingly a misconception held by everyone who isn't a fan of WFRP circa 1980.

Get with the program dude. It'll stop you being surprised when even the monkey is covered in skulls...

Actually, see, buried in the comment that I think warhammer is 40K in the past kinda implies you think 40K is what I think it is, and yet they are still making a WFRP inspired game for it. So you must admit my irritation there is justified.





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I mean, there are always people who mistake pulp for being something more serious -

For instance, here is an article derying the ever increasing fantasy seen in Metal Gear Solid.

The game with the psychic and the dude carrying the minigun.:-

http://www.metalgearsolid.org/show_features.php?id=934

Quote from: Erik BoielleI'd phrase it more as 40K is warhammer in the future.

Aside from commonalities in art direction and the Chaos connection, they're quite different. The political setting background and underlying themes are very different.

Quote from: Erik BoielleSeemingly a misconception held by everyone who isn't a fan of WFRP circa 1980.

Uh, no. I know plenty of current players who realize the two settings are very different. The misconception is typically held by casual GW fans.

Quote from: Erik BoielleGet with the program dude. It'll stop you being surprised when even the monkey is covered in skulls...

Yeah. Here's hoping GW's art department gets its act together and remembers how stuff used to look Warhammery without gratuitous skull usage.

Quote from: Herr ArnulfeAside from commonalities in art direction and the Chaos connection, they're quite different. The political setting background and underlying themes are very different.

I dunno man. I think you are wrong, and I'll debate that I think you can more or less switch elements and characters between them at will (so anything that is cool for Space Marines will likly be cool for Knightly Orders frex. And you can make a Warrior Priest with a hammer in to a, er, Space Warrior Priest with a Powe-Hammer with little difficulty), but I think the truth is that as far as the world is concerned the commonality in art direction is all that matters - a new guy isn't gonna be looking at themes or whatnot, he is just thinking those chaos knights look really cool. The setting doesn't REALLY exist beyond the few paragraphs about 'why you should collect Orks'* and any differences between the Imperium of Man and the Empire of Sigmar are really only going to be apparent to super-grognards like us. And for that matter, so probably are any differences between Lord of the Rings and Warhammer or the Forgotten Realms and warhammer.

(It might be worth knowing that 40K is also riven with discent - BI's 40k boards for instance are infested with a chap called Kage2020 who I would swear is a Didz clone (complete with his own website and followers dedicated to sucking the life and imagination out of warhammer:

http://forum.anargo-sector.net/

and a chap called Nerroth who likes the Tau (weirdo), and would like to see some non-cynical going out to do works for the greater good, even though he seemingly has no idea of how to make this work in a roleplaying game. And obviously you get lots of people who feel 40k is silly, and would rather remake it in the form of Baen Books style humourless military science fiction. And me.)

So, er,

http://www.gametrailers.com/player/15233.html

*Have you seen Flames of War? It more or less does for second world war miniatures games what Warhammer does for fantasy. And the 'what is cool about Nazis' sections are HILARIOUS!