WANNA REPLACE GURPS (lite) FANTASY?
http://www.stargazergames.eu/warrior-rogue-mage/

Warrior, Rogue & Mage (for me) is everything kewl from GURPS Fantasy without the mountains of crunch I never enjoyed from GURPS.

Fans of GURPS lite & Fantasy RPGs will probably enjoy W,R&M (often called Wyrm by fans) and I can confirm it runs great at the table and there's PLENTY of bips and bobs to customize your campaign and characters. Not to the Nth degree like GURPS, but more than enough to run a kewl campaign of kewlness.

And it's free. With lots of supplements. Which are also free.

And also on DriveThruRPG and Stargazer's own site.
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/82643/Warrior-Rogue--Mage?cPath=5635_5757

However, I know NOTHING about the author's politics...and hope to never know.

Cool, I'll check it out...
Dare I say, for those seeking a replacement for GURPS, that Hero System never went anywhere :-)

I think there's a real need for a fan driven alternative to GURPS.  I've take a few stabs at it from a variety of angles but nothing ever really felt right.  It's hard to get a concensus because GURPS is something different to everyone.  But it seems to me a unified stat set and range and skill list would be the important part.  One might envision a dozen combat systems to meet every need but the data needs to be compatible.

Quote from: David Johansen on July 13, 2022, 08:38:21 PM
I think there's a real need for a fan driven alternative to GURPS.  I've take a few stabs at it from a variety of angles but nothing ever really felt right.  It's hard to get a concensus because GURPS is something different to everyone.  But it seems to me a unified stat set and range and skill list would be the important part.  One might envision a dozen combat systems to meet every need but the data needs to be compatible.

IIRC 3DT (a Brazilian RPG) is 3d6 based and it's author placed it in the public domain.

There's also Action! but that's a Hero or Fuzion clone, it's OGL.

It's a pretty good game, I've had it for years. But why do you compare it specifically to GURPS (or GURPS lite I guess).  What do you think makes it a good alternative to GL in particular?

(Not criticizing, just curious about your reasoning)

Quote from: Joey2k on July 14, 2022, 12:16:46 AMIt's a pretty good game, I've had it for years. But why do you compare it specifically to GURPS (or GURPS lite I guess).  What do you think makes it a good alternative to GL in particular?

Minimal Stats
Rules lite universal system
Lots of Kewl Ability & Skill Choices
No Classes, but easy to emulate any class
Many options to customize the ruleset & campaign
A dozen supplements with stacks of goodies

Quote from: Joey2k on July 14, 2022, 12:16:46 AM
. . . But why do you compare it specifically to GURPS (or GURPS lite I guess) . . .

Plus with a post like that, it will suck in a GURPS fan like me to check out his post. 

It is a cool little game.

Not much to do with GURPS.

I'm almost tempted to write my own version of GURPS but it wouldn't have a zillion skills, which is why I stopped playing the game.

Also, D&D stats are better than GURPS; most GURPS fans agre that Int does too much by taking Charisma, Perception and Willpower in a single stat, and even Kromm mentions Charisma is too cheap in GURPS.

Quote from: Spinachcat on July 14, 2022, 03:58:24 AM

Quote from: Joey2k on July 14, 2022, 12:16:46 AMIt's a pretty good game, I've had it for years. But why do you compare it specifically to GURPS (or GURPS lite I guess).  What do you think makes it a good alternative to GL in particular?

Minimal Stats
Rules lite universal system
Lots of Kewl Ability & Skill Choices
No Classes, but easy to emulate any class
Many options to customize the ruleset & campaign
A dozen supplements with stacks of goodies

Is it really universal? From reading the core system, it seems strictly medieval fantasy - and very few of my GURPS games were medieval fantasy. Could it handle post-apocalyptic steampunk or space opera?

I'm a sucker for classless systems, even if I'm probably never going to run them. Thanks for the recommendation, WYRM sounds like a lot of fun.

Quote from: jhkim on July 14, 2022, 09:45:23 PMIs it really universal? From reading the core system, it seems strictly medieval fantasy - and very few of my GURPS games were medieval fantasy. Could it handle post-apocalyptic steampunk or space opera?

I don't believe GURPS (or any system) is universal. Every system does some genre better than it does others, and no alleged universal system is going to please everyone.

WyRM is built for heroic fantasy. Could it do post-apoc, steampunk or space opera? Probably with some reskinning of talents and depending how much fantasy is involved in those campaigns. Could WyRM do Space Fantasy, aka Star Wars? Probably without much effort, but D6 Star Wars does that genre better.

As is, WyRM could do World of WarCraft very well - especially when you use the bells and whistles of the supplements to tweak and tune the campaign. But could it do StarCraft equally well? Doubtful.

Quote from: jhkim on July 14, 2022, 09:45:23 PM
Is it really universal? From reading the core system, it seems strictly medieval fantasy - and very few of my GURPS games were medieval fantasy. Could it handle post-apocalyptic steampunk or space opera?

Here are some of my opinions:

Is GURPS really universal?  Yes.  Absolutely.

Can it do post-apocalyptical?  Sure.  No problem.  Go grab "High-Tech" and maybe "Ultra-Tech" for the really advanced future tech toys.  The real question for the GM is how devolved is your post-apocalyptic is your setting?  What's available?  What's not?

Steampunk?  As a separate genre from post-apocalyptic yes.  Figure out what flavor you want for your steampunk and there's GURPS "Cyberpunk" setting book to help with those elements.

Space Opera?  Maybe?  GURPS tends to do well with grounded Role Playing settings.  Can it handle mystical powers?  Sure.  GURPS Magic may not work as well thematically, but check out GURPS Powers for how to budget and balance super powers/mutations/psionics.  As the GM you'll need to spend some time figuring out what powers are appropriate for your setting.

While I have never participated in a Super Heroes campaign (in ANY genre or rule set) in theory GURPS Powers has the guide stones for making low powered superheroes.

I wrapped up a Cyberpunk campaign this spring using GURPS.

I think the most important thing to consider when approaching using GURPS is to remember that you're not going to be using EVERYTHING in GURPS (unless you're running a Banestorm campaign) but you'll need to figure out what elements of GURPS are appropriate for your setting.

And yes.  GURPS excels at pulp Fantasy.  In part I believe that GURPS Magic is the best magic system ever developed for a roleplaying game.

Quote from: Spinachcat on July 13, 2022, 04:38:41 PM
WANNA REPLACE GURPS (lite) FANTASY?
http://www.stargazergames.eu/warrior-rogue-mage/

Warrior, Rogue & Mage (for me) is everything kewl from GURPS Fantasy without the mountains of crunch I never enjoyed from GURPS.

Will check it out. Thanks.

ADDED:
Um. This game is too lite to even be compared to GURPS. It's barely a game mechanic.

Quote from: Mark Caliber on July 15, 2022, 01:23:04 PM

Quote from: jhkim on July 14, 2022, 09:45:23 PM
Is it really universal? From reading the core system, it seems strictly medieval fantasy - and very few of my GURPS games were medieval fantasy. Could it handle post-apocalyptic steampunk or space opera?

Here are some of my opinions:

Is GURPS really universal?  Yes.  Absolutely.

Mark Caliber - sorry if I was unclear. My question was whether Warrior, Rogue, & Mage is universal, not whether GURPS is. No system is "universal" in the sense of pleasing everyone and doing everything, but some systems are designed for multiple settings and genres - like GURPS, Hero System, Savage Worlds, and Basic Roleplaying.

Though to be fair, the subject from the original post (OP) does suggest it as a replacement for GURPS (lite) Fantasy - but Spinachcat cited it as a universal system. I've only read the core game, but it is built for a particular fantasy setting - and it looks like there are 5 supplements which are all expanding the fantasy setting.

Quote from: jhkim on July 15, 2022, 02:15:35 PM
Mark Caliber - sorry if I was unclear. My question was whether Warrior, Rogue, & Mage is universal, not whether GURPS is.

Ah, no worries.  Now that we've clarified that question we can dig into that point of topic!  (I have no opinion on WRME so I will not comment to that question)

Quote from: jhkim on July 15, 2022, 02:15:35 PM
No system is "universal" in the sense of pleasing everyone and doing everything,

From an gaming industry perspective "Universal" RPG's have never been defined in this way.

The only game that seems to have 'universal' appeal seems to be D&D, but even that game fails to be 'universally' appealing.

D&D has the edge because it was first and first to market itself well.

Quote from: jhkim on July 15, 2022, 02:15:35 PM
but some systems are designed for multiple settings and genres - like GURPS, Hero System, Savage Worlds, and Basic Roleplaying.

Since GURPS was designed from the ground up to address multiple genres well it and since GURPS IV (Fourth Edition) literally went through a decade of extensive playtesting, I think as an end product, GURPS does what it was designed to do fairly well.

I also happen to prefer the core gaming mechanics aside from it's genre versatility.

I haven't played Hero System, but it has a reputation for being even more crunchy and complicated than GURPS is professed to be.

Savage World (herein "SW") (IMHO) is overly simplistic.  While it professes to handle multiple genres well, I think the SW it's simply just  its own rule sets with different setting skins slapped on top of it.

"Basic Roleplaying" is a new term for me.  Any insight on what this is?


While I stumbled into this topic due to the mention of GURPS, I'll admit that my problem isn't finding a GURPS replacement but in finding GURPS players.