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Pen & Paper Roleplaying Central => Pen and Paper Roleplaying Games (RPGs) Discussion => Topic started by: Berger King on March 20, 2006, 12:29:04 PM

Title: Two-Weapon Defense and Combat Expertise
Post by: Berger King on March 20, 2006, 12:29:04 PM
Two-Weapon Defense feat grants:

QuoteBenefit: When wielding a double weapon or two weapons (not including natural weapons or unarmed strikes), you gain a +1 shield bonus to your AC.

When you are fighting defensively or using the total defense action, this shield bonus increases to +2.



Would the shield bonus increase in the second part also apply when using combat expertise?
Title: Two-Weapon Defense and Combat Expertise
Post by: Limper on March 20, 2006, 12:31:15 PM
Quote from: Berger KingTwo-Weapon Defense feat grants:


 


Would the shield bonus increase in the second part also apply when using combat expertise?

Combat expertise is a Dodge Bonus so it would be additive.
Title: Two-Weapon Defense and Combat Expertise
Post by: Berger King on March 20, 2006, 12:38:43 PM
I mean does the bonus go up to +2 when using combat expertise. I guess the question is: for the purposes of this feat, is combat expertise the same as fighting defensively/total defense?
Title: Two-Weapon Defense and Combat Expertise
Post by: Sobek on March 20, 2006, 12:52:46 PM
Quote from: Berger KingI mean does the bonus go up to +2 when using combat expertise. I guess the question is: for the purposes of this feat, is combat expertise the same as fighting defensively/total defense?

No.  Combat Expertise is different from fighting defensively.  You can do one, the other, both, or neither.  If you do both, the bonuses stack.
Title: Two-Weapon Defense and Combat Expertise
Post by: Limper on March 20, 2006, 12:58:41 PM
Quote from: SobekNo.  Combat Expertise is different from fighting defensively.  You can do one, the other, both, or neither.  If you do both, the bonuses stack.

And it would stack in any case with a shield bonus.
Title: Two-Weapon Defense and Combat Expertise
Post by: Limper on March 20, 2006, 12:59:22 PM
Quote from: Berger KingI mean does the bonus go up to +2 when using combat expertise. I guess the question is: for the purposes of this feat, is combat expertise the same as fighting defensively/total defense?

Sobek has the right of it.
Title: Two-Weapon Defense and Combat Expertise
Post by: Dacke on March 20, 2006, 01:41:41 PM
Not by the RAW. There are a couple of feats that let you substitute "Expertise for 2 or more" for fighting defensively (at least two in Races of Eberron), but Two-weapon fighting isn't one of them.
Title: Two-Weapon Defense and Combat Expertise
Post by: kryyst on March 20, 2006, 02:29:25 PM
I was always under the impression that fighting Defensively is not stackable with Combat Expertise becasue of the descriptive text in Combat Expertise.  I don't have it with me but it's something like.

Characters without combat expertise may fight defensively subtracting -4 from their to hit and adding 2 to their AC.  Characters with Combat Expertise get a 1 for 1 trade.
Title: Two-Weapon Defense and Combat Expertise
Post by: Sobek on March 20, 2006, 02:58:19 PM
Quote from: kryystI was always under the impression that fighting Defensively is not stackable with Combat Expertise becasue of the descriptive text in Combat Expertise. I don't have it with me but it's something like.

This was specifically FAQed or errattaed at some point.  The official word is, unambiguously, "they stack".
 
Regardless, I'd house-rule it to stack because I want the Combat Expertise feat to be of value, even to someone with 5 ranks of Tumble.
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