Okay, for this discussion, Blue Rose DOES NOT EXIST.  Green Ronin is just a faceless company, you've never heard of Steve Kenson and have no opinion on him (He rocks!  The Psychic Handbook blows the crappy 3e psionics system out of the water!), and NO ONE AT ALL HAD ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE RULES BEING RELEASED.

True20 is just this system that came in a plain brown wrapper, to be debated on its merits and its merits ALONE.

So, what do those of y'all who have seen it think of it?

I've borrowed a copy of the PDF version and I've been flipping through it, deciding whether I'll buy the hardcover.  (It'd certainly be easier to read than this print out!)

So far, I'm liking what I see, though I wouldn't use it for D&D.  The powers system is similar to the Psychic Handbook, so I like it in general.  I haven't read through all the powers, so I'm not 100% sure how they'll work.

Combat is intriguingly simple, though I still need to ponder it more.  The simplified damage system has me pondering the combat system I've developing for my own vapourware project.

With only bits and pieces read, though, I can't rate it, but I have a generally good feeling about it.  What do those of you with more knowledge of it -- and especially with experience with it -- think of it?

I've not actually looked at True20, just at that other version that no one cares about and we are not talking about in this thread.  Based on that, I pretty much call it the "Fix everything that pisses Maddman off about d20" system.

If I were to play any d20 fantasy game, I'd petition to make the system True20.

I've also been able to read the True20 system, though, like Maddman, it was in another form than the one that was just released.

I think it's a solid system, an interesting streamlining of the d20 system. Personally, I like more rules-heavy games, and using the three basic classes (am I right in thinking they used what was presented in Unearthed Arcana?) is a bit simplistic for my taste. However, I could see this game being a viable alternative to D&D for those wanting a less complex RPG, esepcially if they aren't turned on by more old-school oriented attempts like Castles & Crusades (another game I think is nifty).

Well, I've been immersed in it over the past couple months, converting my old game system to it. For my game, I used the original True20 .pdf (not the new release), which is basically the straight Blue Rose rules.

True 20 has two things that are minor annoyances to me; the wealth system and the damage system. In my game, I ignored the wealth system altogether and did it like most other games. The damage system I kept in place.

The new True20 book did not greatly impress me. I was hoping for them to do more cleaning up and less "new stuff." Even though the earlier True20 had some errata, I actually like it better than the new release. With that said, I do like True20 a great deal and recommend it to anyone who likes D20 but wants a simpler, more elegant system. The way True20 handles spells and classes is fantastic.

As someone who is interested in buying the book sometime soon, I would love some more elaboration on all points. I'm especially keen on understanding why Zalmoxis classifies the damage system as a "minor annoyance."

I ditto Willpax.

Oh, and y'all can talk about the *rules* in the Game That Cannot Be Mentioned.  I think it's similar to the PDF I have at the moment, if not the same.  I don't have the hardcover yet, so I really don't know anything about it.

I love it. Its easily the best and most significant innovation in D20 since the 3.0 rules themselves.  Its a brilliant, easy to play, fast running, malleable system.

It does Fantasy very very well, in a way that's totally different from how D&D does fantasy.

I will note that it doesn't extend as well into certain genres; its a bit more limited in that sense than D20.  Basically, the things D20 does with some difficulty, True20 can only do with a lot of difficulty. Like Mecha, for example.
But that's really a fact of the game's structure, not a criticism.

RPGPundit

I'm a huge fan of both the "other" game and True20. I will likely add back in AoO (still haven't decided for sure yet) because our group likes tactical combat, but other than that I love it. I like how the damage system evens out the power levels so that even low-level challenges are a threat to high level characters (compared to base D20 anyway), and I love the magic system the most. It is flexible, and lends itself very well to emulating many types of magic I've read about in different books. The Wealth system I can take or leave, but it's so easy to just yank price lists from any other game I choose that it's really a non-issue. I love that there is a section on conversion from base D20 so I can easily convert monsters and characters from all kinds of adventures and source material to use in a True20 game. I love the flexibility of the greatly simplified base classes, and having former class features be feats instead. Overall an excellent take on D20.

As I mentioned on my site, the Quick Start Rules and converted adventure Death In Freeport are available as free downloads for those who haven't gotten their hands on the book itself yet.

Quote from: Zachary The FirstAs I mentioned on my site, the Quick Start Rules and converted adventure Death In Freeport are available as free downloads for those who haven't gotten their hands on the book itself yet.

Man, Green Ronin is really pushin' True20. I LOVE IT! You go GR peeps I hope True20 gets loads of support and is around a long time.

Quote from: willpaxAs someone who is interested in buying the book sometime soon, I would love some more elaboration on all points. I'm especially keen on understanding why Zalmoxis classifies the damage system as a "minor annoyance."

The system uses a Toughness Saving Throw instead of Hit Points, and the damage is a scalable affair that tracks your character's damage according to a chart. It's not really more complex or worse than D20, it's just different and equally complex. It was a bit jarring to me that so much in True20 was streamlined and very elegantly-done, only to have the damage and Hit Points not improved, just different. But in the end I decided to use it for my game, because it wasn't worth the trouble to change all the monster stats and whatnot. To me, the game's major selling points are the simplified rules, classes, skills, and feats. Above all, the magic system is so simple and wonderful it sold me on the system almost single-handedly. Seeing it for the first time was one of those "shit... why didn't I think of that?" moments.

Is it worth buying? Absolutely yes.

Quote from: SigmundMan, Green Ronin is really pushin' True20. I LOVE IT! You go GR peeps I hope True20 gets loads of support and is around a long time.

Yeah that Death In Freeport freebie is seriously good stuff.  They're pushing hard on this, and I'm glad to see it.

Quote from: ZalmoxisThe system uses a Toughness Saving Throw instead of Hit Points, and the damage is a scalable affair that tracks your character's damage according to a chart. It's not really more complex or worse than D20, it's just different and equally complex. It was a bit jarring to me that so much in True20 was streamlined and very elegantly-done, only to have the damage and Hit Points not improved, just different. But in the end I decided to use it for my game, because it wasn't worth the trouble to change all the monster stats and whatnot. To me, the game's major selling points are the simplified rules, classes, skills, and feats. Above all, the magic system is so simple and wonderful it sold me on the system almost single-handedly. Seeing it for the first time was one of those "shit... why didn't I think of that?" moments.

Is it worth buying? Absolutely yes.

After looking over the system in the pdf, I see what you mean. On the other hand, I've been dissatisfied with hit points since about 1982, so that system looks like a potential improvement to me.

The magic mechanic looks very interesting, and fits very well with my homebrew (such that I think adapting it to this system would be a big improvement). How well does it work in an actual game?

The core mechanic looks quite elegant and easy to modify. I think I will be buying a copy sometime after pay day.

Quote from: Zachary The FirstAs I mentioned on my site, the Quick Start Rules and converted adventure Death In Freeport are available as free downloads for those who haven't gotten their hands on the book itself yet.

Thanks for this. I was able to download it and thus able to get an idea of what people were talking about.

Quote from: gleichmanThanks for this. I was able to download it and thus able to get an idea of what people were talking about.

Me, too.