So my group is one of the groups that is mainly adults who have issues with scheduling get togethers. I admit, I am one of the issues. Since my divorce, I have my daughter every other weekend. That means, flat out, I am out every other weekend unless a holiday or such moves it. Others have their own scheduling issues. We were playing Castles & Crusades, but the gaps between games meant every time we got together, we had to spend a good amount of time catching a few of the guys up. Enter, an idea to try a game where I would wrap it up each session and leveling up was not so important. Enter, HeroQuest 2E.
I sent feeler-emails out to the guys, asking what kind of one-shot they would be interested in. Fantasy and witch-hunting were two of the ideas that came back. Working on that, I presented a very high level picture of the world. Going old world style, similar to Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay, but not the same. Also, the characters are part of the Theocracy, and are sent out on missions similar to Steakley's Vampire$. We were all good so far. Some guys made characters early, some did it when we got together.
Essential part of the concept is The Codex. A militant religious order that the characters could be members of. This is the group that hands out the assignments above.
Shaoul - a Justicar of the Codex, modeled after Judge Dredd. Idea is he performs judgment and punishment for crimes, instead of being meted out in a court. He is considered to be a court.
Aristes - a Fist of the Codex. The muscle. The one who is called to go and break things, or destroy things.
Justin - a Blade of the Codex. If you've seen or played Assassin's Creed, you know what this character is modeled after. (Played by the 10 year old son of Aristes' player).
Tal - a bounty tracker. Not a member of the Codex, but if you want to find something, this is the guy you hire. He almost always finds and gets what he is paid to.
Filos (renamed Falus, because of our group - phonetic, but not spelled correctly) - a very well-connected noble son, known for his dad's money and his extravagances, as well as his affairs.
The party starts off being summoned to the Codex by the Shadow Speaker of the Codex. The seers are blinded to a blight that has falled on the town of Phaffenchen. It is an agricultural town known for exports of grains, livestock, and the shrine to the Codex that is there. The blight was brought to the attention of the Codex by the family of Falus - as they have seen an impact to financials. The seers cannot say what is blocking their visions, but the players are able to determine that it could be:
a) Opposing forces that are using magic to obscure
b) a creature of such great evil that it blocks out the visions
The 3 Codex members along with Falus headed to the Prancing Crawdad looking for Tal to assist. Tal was on the job, watching one of the gamblers focused on the crawdad fights. The party arrives, and Falus spots his friend. But Aristes notices that one of the gamblers is using magic. He asks for the magicker's papers. The magicker tries to bribe him with money, then tries to bolt and run. Justin puts a hand out to stop him, using his hidden blade and sliding it in-between the ribs. He slowly eases the passing gambler back into his seat. During this, another gambler made a side comment about the magicker using magic again. Shaoul and Aristes go to question the man who knew of the unlicensed magick. They take his tongue when he tries to lie. Tal's original target tries to bolt at this point, but Tal has been moving around to the door during the whole incident, and cold-cocks the mark as he tries to flee. A few side-comments from the barkeep results in him losing a finger to the Fist, along with getting a decent grievance settlement against the Codex. It appears this particular Fist, Aristes, has had many such grievances filed against him.
The party travels to Phaffenchen uneventfully, meeting with a closed gate during the middle of the day. They find a charnel pit outside of the village, where dead livestock is being burned. Upon investigation, they find grievous bestial wounds on the livestock. They hail the guards and the mayor is brought to the gates. Upon proof of being Codex, they are allowed inside. Through discussion, they find out that just over 2 fortnight ago, 3 Codex members showed up, stayed in the mayor's house for 3 days, and then left. After that, killings started, always outside of the palisade. The party split up at this point, Shaoul and Falus going to check the mayor's house, Aristes going to check the Shrine, and Justin and Tal just doing general gossip and digging into the crowd.
Aristes finds that one of the volumes of the codex is missing from the shrine. It is the volume dealing with summoning spirits and binding them to victims. In place of the volume is a wood block that looked like the book spine, but instead had evil sigils carved upon it. He questions the elderly Keeper of the Codex, who was not aware of the theft. It was guessed that the 3 imposters were the culprits.
As Justin and Tal walk through the market, someone bumps into Justin. A note is slipped into his tunic. The note says the imposters went northeast every night they stayed in the town. Justin used his shadow training to follow the person that deposited the note, finding an herb shop that the person entered from the back door. He sent Tal to get the others, while he stayed there and kept an eye on the place.
At the mayor's house, Shaoul and Falus investigate. Shaoul finds reason to suspect something under the beds, and moves them. There he finds carvings in the floor. Evil runes that are used in binding spirits. Falus investigates the house and find that he has caught the eye of the mayor's daughter. She asks him to meet her after nightfall outside the palisade. Tal shows up and gathers the others, who all head to the herb shop.
Upon arrival, they confront the woman tending the store, only to find out she is one of the Eyes of the Codex. Trained spies who live their lives among the common people, watching for any events that might indicate issue. They ask why she hasn't contacted the Codex, and learn that she has sent weekly missives since the killings started. She tells them of a copse of woods that the strangers went to. But she is not trained for combat. She did what was required of her, and what she was capable of. When they leave, the Codex members knock over her carts and shop goods so she doesn't appear to receive special treatment.
They return to the mayor's house and destroy the bindings. They party gets prepared to head to the copse of woods. They should arrive shortly before nightfall. But Falus has other plans, and flatly states that his specialty is not combat, plus he has a meeting scheduled. So the party splits again, with 4 heading to the woods, and 1 heading outside the palisade at night.
The party at the copse encounter an old idol with 3 effigy set up on it. One appears to be a boar, another a wolf, and the third a woman. The woman looks remarkably like the mayor's daughter. They proceed to destroy the altar. During the process, as they are using magic to dispel the ancient god's foothold here, a larger than possible boar with flaming red eyes and foot long tusks attacks. Tal steps in and counters it, grappling with the beast. The others destroy the effigies, weakening the beast. They fight continues, with the others defeating the dark god while Tal manages to defeat the possessed beast. They discuss the effigies and head back toward town.
Back in town, darkness has fallen. Falus bribes the gate guards to let him out with a code to be used to let him back in. He has the rendezvous with the mayor's daughter. After a brief meal and a not-brief physical session, Falus is tired. The mayor's daughter gets up and walks away, saying she is ready to replenish her needs, and she hungers for him. She turns and her blazing eyes, black claws, and fangs catch in the moonlight. Falus, though, had oracular visions earlier in the day. He saw something wrong this night. So he left a note for the mayor saying his daughter was going to be outside the palisade that night. They see torches off in the distance, so Falus takes off running toward them. The beast gives chase. Falus realizes the beats may likely catch him, but the daughter's affection seemed real. He turns on the charm, and tries to talk her out of this. Unbelievable, this starts working. She really did desire him, and she is fighting the possession with his help. Between the two of them, she is able to drive the spirit out of her. They go to the guards, and head back toward the gate.
The rest of the party arrives as they are about to the gate. The Codex claim she is possessed. She admits she was, but is no longer thanks to Falus. The Fist and Justicar investigate the guards and find that the spirit fled to one of them. They restrain him, so he tries to swallow his tongue. The Fist binds the spirit to the flesh, so even if the host dies, it will be trapped. Then they head out looking for the wolf. They find it and make surprisingly quick work of the wolf through a lot of hero points.
------------------------------
All in all, it was a good first session. Or one-shot, if we never go back to that setting. Everyone enjoyed it. It was refreshing to see someone use their abilities to overcome the challenge without it being violence. I like that this system encourages that. Frame the contest, and say how you are trying to win it.
It sounds like you guys had a great session, and I hear you on liking that abilities, other than the martial, are used to overcome challenges.
HeroQuest 2 is one of my favorite narrative systems. You can play pretty much any setting at the drop of a hat. I also like that it doesn't feel all loosey-goosey while hammering the rule of kewl. Some of the most grounded and serious feeling sessions I've ever run were with HQ2.
Yes, everyone had a blast. The 10 year old got bored when there wasn't blood, but that's pretty standard for him. I liked the way most folks built their characters; a good amount of depth and possibility. We did a modified play as you go / list. I gave them 11 abilities to lay out, with 1 being a possible breakout/keyword. Then I offered up to 3 flaws, that I would use to cause character drama, but also for hero points. It went very well.
I also used the HeroQuest Glorantha conceit that, in case of a tie, high roll wins. That allows the guy at 19 who rolls a 17 to beat the guy with a 6 who rolls a 5.
Did they buy the rights to HeroQuest from Milton Bradley or Games Workshop? Or is this an RPG based on the HeroQuest board game?
Quote from: Ulairi;980122Did they buy the rights to HeroQuest from Milton Bradley or Games Workshop? Or is this an RPG based on the HeroQuest board game?
It's this.
https://rpggeek.com/rpg/1618/heroquest-2nd-edition
Or, if you prefer PDF, this:
http://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/65600/HeroQuest-Core-Rules?manufacturers_id=2
I would recommend the HeroQuest Glorantha version for better reading. But the one I just linked there is very serviceable. HQ:G has made some changes as well, as it is built for running in Glorantha.
Quote from: Ulairi;980122Did they buy the rights to HeroQuest from Milton Bradley or Games Workshop? Or is this an RPG based on the HeroQuest board game?
Just to give you background, heroquesting is a thing in Glorantha. There was always a planned game/supplement to RuneQuest called HeroQuest that they never got around to before Milton Bradley used the name for their unrelated game. When MB let the rights to the name lapse, it got grabbed again for the Gloranthan-based 1st edition of HeroQuest.
From the publisher
QuoteHeroQuest is the innovative, dynamic, and flexible rules engine by Robin Laws, suitable for play in any genre or setting. It present a simple and flexible system that allows Game Masters to make decisions the way authors and screenwriters do when creating novels, TV episodes and movies.
HeroQuest encourages creative input from your players, resulting in an exciting, unpredictable narrative created through group collaboration. Its resolution methods and scalable character levels make it equally suited for any genre, from epic fantasy to satirical soap opera.
Whether your next game idea draws on horror, war, westerns, martial arts, pulps, cyberpunk, cliff-hangers, giant robots, super-powered heroes, space opera, cop action, corporate intrigue, furry animals, swashbuckling adventure, Greek tragedy or even drawing room comedy, HeroQuest can handle it! You can even use HeroQuest to emulate a musical - although it won't do the singing or dancing for you.
In before the move to Other Games.
This would be much more useful if it described the actual interactions at the table and how the rules were used, instead of being a chronicle of events purely from the in-game perspective.
I have a soft spot for HQ2. Good to hear you're having fun with it Imaginos:)
Quote from: Imaginos;980128Or, if you prefer PDF, this:
http://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/65600/HeroQuest-Core-Rules?manufacturers_id=2
I would recommend the HeroQuest Glorantha version for better reading. But the one I just linked there is very serviceable. HQ:G has made some changes as well, as it is built for running in Glorantha.
Is the Heroquest Glorantha available in pdf? I may need to spring for the hardcopy.
Quote from: Voros;980210Is the Heroquest Glorantha available in pdf? I may need to spring for the hardcopy.
It is, but only direct from Chaosium. I cannot link to their site from work (they are blocked). I ordered my hardcopy from GameNerdz (it was $30) but they are out of stock.
Quote from: Arminius;980137This would be much more useful if it described the actual interactions at the table and how the rules were used, instead of being a chronicle of events purely from the in-game perspective.
I second this motion.
I own Hero Wars and Heroquest (the two predecessors to Heroquest 2E) and the rules never clicked for me. I'd be interested in seeing how someone actually used the rules in play.
Quote from: Bren;980323I second this motion.
I own Hero Wars and Heroquest (the two predecessors to Heroquest 2E) and the rules never clicked for me. I'd be interested in seeing how someone actually used the rules in play.
Here's a quick summary of a Robotech: Macross Saga game I ran a while back, with some system details:
http://platonicsolid.blogspot.com/2009/08/heroquest-20-mecha-veritech.html
Quote from: Eisenmann;980326Here's a quick summary of a Robotech: Macross Saga game I ran a while back, with some system details:
http://platonicsolid.blogspot.com/2009/08/heroquest-20-mecha-veritech.html
Thanks, though other than for a couple of attacks with the GU-11 I'm not seeing where it is clear what was rolled or the result of the roll. Also it would be helpful to have stats for the opponents to get a better sense of the mechanics.
To be fair, part of my problem is also that I'm not too knowledgeable about Veritech so when you say in paragraph 3, "As the veritech changes modes to evade enemy fire..." I don't know what mode he changed to. I assume he started in Fighter mode since he was on patrol and that he changed to a mode with a better maneuverability than the Fighter's Maneuverability 6 for evasion, but I don't know if that was Guardian (Maneuverability 8) or Battloid (Maneuverability 12). Also, if in Battloid mode, when would the player roll for Poor Flight 15 (-3).
Also, is the (-3) a die roll mod for any Flight rolls?
System specifics aside, the linked robotech posts are pretty interesting.
I've seen a few HQ 1e/HW play reports that gave at least some feel for the system--mostly at The Forge or some other place frequented by (I think) Mike Holmes. Strangely, the one that made it seem the most cool was a Livejournal post by someone who was using it to run Nephilim--but when I asked for more details, the person said the game had run aground because HQ "kinda sucked".
Anyway, I know that 2e did some things to streamline play while also adding some narrativium--along the lines of difficulties, if not outcomes, being malleable according to the needs of dramatic flow. Perhaps ironically, this wasn't wholeheartedly embraced by the story-games fans, but that's not really surprising as it smacked of railroading.
These days I reckon that Mythic Roleplaying will do much of what I'd want from HQ, though with less of an open-ended upper bound on abilities/traits.
Quote from: Bren;980332Thanks, though other than for a couple of attacks with the GU-11 I'm not seeing where it is clear what was rolled or the result of the roll. Also it would be helpful to have stats for the opponents to get a better sense of the mechanics.
It's been a while, but I think I just set the resistance of the entire bad guy side. The back and forth rolls, that aren't directly described, were part of an
Extended Contest (for those following along and don't have HQ2) where each side accumulates resolution points, 5 points wins. In this scenario, the bad guys got 5 point first but really wanted to really stick it to the PC but fumbled, allowing the tide to turn.
Quote from: Bren;980332To be fair, part of my problem is also that I'm not too knowledgeable about Veritech so when you say in paragraph 3, "As the veritech changes modes to evade enemy fire..." I don't know what mode he changed to. I assume he started in Fighter mode since he was on patrol and that he changed to a mode with a better maneuverability than the Fighter's Maneuverability 6 for evasion, but I don't know if that was Guardian (Maneuverability 8) or Battloid (Maneuverability 12). Also, if in Battloid mode, when would the player roll for Poor Flight 15 (-3).
That first mention of changing modes was actually just setting color. It's one of those things that you see aces in the setting do. The transformation to Guardian mode in the next paragraph was for in-game tactics and system effect. The PC was able to augment with mode's
stable ability to have a better chance of not hitting the protoculture chamber.
Quote from: Bren;980332Also, is the (-3) a die roll mod for any Flight rolls?
I treat the vehicle flaws as per page 14:
QuoteNarrators may decide during play that certain aws are better expressed as penalties to your attempts to overcome other resistances. Divide the value by 5 and round.
Quote from: Arminius;980341System specifics aside, the linked robotech posts are pretty interesting.
Thanks, Arminius. It's worked out pretty well for us. But I think I'd treat mecha a little differently now. I'm not quite sure what I'd change but I have a better understanding of the game's nuance after getting more time with it.
Quote from: Arminius;980341I've seen a few HQ 1e/HW play reports that gave at least some feel for the system--mostly at The Forge or some other place frequented by (I think) Mike Holmes. Strangely, the one that made it seem the most cool was a Livejournal post by someone who was using it to run Nephilim--but when I asked for more details, the person said the game had run aground because HQ "kinda sucked".
I think you have to be in the mood for HQ and I think it has to fit your interpretation of the source material. One of the big reasons why I went with a mecha setting was that I hadn't been able to translate the fast and fluid dynamic that you see on the screen to the table. HeroQuest 2 did it pretty good job of it without what you'd usually expect from a game in that genre. If nothing else, it was a fun experiment.
Quote from: Arminius;980341Anyway, I know that 2e did some things to streamline play while also adding some narrativium--along the lines of difficulties, if not outcomes, being malleable according to the needs of dramatic flow. Perhaps ironically, this wasn't wholeheartedly embraced by the story-games fans, but that's not really surprising as it smacked of railroading.
For some reason, some people think that because the Pass/Fail cycle is in the book it must be used. Ironically, I've found it most handy when the game goes off in a direction that I hadn't anticipated - go with the pass/fail flow until I get my GM feet firmly back under me.
Quote from: Arminius;980341These days I reckon that Mythic Roleplaying will do much of what I'd want from HQ, though with less of an open-ended upper bound on abilities/traits.
Mythic is great. I've a few posts about it too.
Quote from: Bren;980323I second this motion.
I own Hero Wars and Heroquest (the two predecessors to Heroquest 2E) and the rules never clicked for me. I'd be interested in seeing how someone actually used the rules in play.
I didn't record everyone's rolls, but when I have time this weekend, I will try to lay out what I have. I will also strive to record rolls and results next time we play it.
Quote from: Imaginos;980358I didn't record everyone's rolls, but when I have time this weekend, I will try to lay out what I have. I will also strive to record rolls and results next time we play it.
Thanks in advance!
Quote from: Arminius;980341Anyway, I know that 2e did some things to streamline play while also adding some narrativium--along the lines of difficulties, if not outcomes, being malleable according to the needs of dramatic flow.
Quote from: Eisenmann;980346For some reason, some people think that because the Pass/Fail cycle is in the book it must be used. Ironically, I've found it most handy when the game goes off in a direction that I hadn't anticipated - go with the pass/fail flow until I get my GM feet firmly back under me.
This seems to come up in every discussion of HQ2. The rulebook is pretty clear that the Pass/Fail Cycle is just one way you can use to determine difficulties when they aren't immediately obvious. Still, there are always people who claim it is some mandated way to determine all difficulties, that if the players encounter a dragon while they are on the low end of the cycle, you need to make the dragon a pushover. Of course, you know that dragons are tough, so you make the dragon tough no matter where you are on the cycle.
The cycle is for the kind situation where the PCs get into some unexpected encounter with an NPC you just invented on the fly where you have no immediate idea how tough they should be.
On top of that, it's also completely optional. You can play HQ by-the-book just fine without using it at all.
Quote from: CRKrueger;980134From the publisher
In before the move to Other Games.
I'm surprised it is still here. Pundit is going to get kicked out of the OSR Taliban if he keeps letting threads like this exist in the main RPG forum.
Quote from: Baulderstone;980674This seems to come up in every discussion of HQ2. The rulebook is pretty clear that the Pass/Fail Cycle is just one way you can use to determine difficulties when they aren't immediately obvious. Still, there are always people who claim it is some mandated way to determine all difficulties, that if the players encounter a dragon while they are on the low end of the cycle, you need to make the dragon a pushover. [snip]
On top of that, it's also completely optional. You can play HQ by-the-book just fine without using it at all.
I've been a regular and nearly exclusive user of HQ(1) for a good while now, and read HQ2 and did adopt stuff from it too, later. I love the system! My feeling is, rather, that HQ is
written as one of the smuggest and most sanctimonious RPG systems I've ever encountered, and that HQ2 actually
is the most smug & sanctimonious. So when the HQ2 book spends as much time as it does presenting the pass/fail thing -- condescendingly, pausing here and there to congratulate itself again -- it's harder for a reader to respond unemotionally, literally, and mechanically to the merits and necessity of the thing being described. Sure, it's technically optional and can be ignored. I think it's weird not to expect lots of people to want to throw the book against the wall while reading about it, is all.
For more than one person I've heard from, the HQ2 messenger shoots itself in the face before delivering its message. (We've done dramatic readings out of the book; nosebleeds from laughing have resulted.) But in the end, it works for me -- a lot. The treat is that once you've read through the rules once or twice, you never really
need to refer to them again. I have players now who I think have never looked at the rulebooks, just a couple pages of cheat-sheets I've printed up along with whatever specific house rules.
It's true that HQ dumps
all the work of establishing and maintaining shared world / genre / tone / scale assumptions onto the ref & players, but in practice that's never been a real problem. For me, anyway. (So far!)
Quote from: kk7;980985I've been a regular and nearly exclusive user of HQ(1) for a good while now, and read HQ2 and did adopt stuff from it too, later. I love the system! My feeling is, rather, that HQ is written as one of the smuggest and most sanctimonious RPG systems I've ever encountered, and that HQ2 actually is the most smug & sanctimonious. So when the HQ2 book spends as much time as it does presenting the pass/fail thing -- condescendingly, pausing here and there to congratulate itself again -- it's harder for a reader to respond unemotionally, literally, and mechanically to the merits and necessity of the thing being described. Sure, it's technically optional and can be ignored. I think it's weird not to expect lots of people to want to throw the book against the wall while reading about it, is all.
For more than one person I've heard from, the HQ2 messenger shoots itself in the face before delivering its message. (We've done dramatic readings out of the book; nosebleeds from laughing have resulted.) But in the end, it works for me -- a lot. The treat is that once you've read through the rules once or twice, you never really need to refer to them again. I have players now who I think have never looked at the rulebooks, just a couple pages of cheat-sheets I've printed up along with whatever specific house rules.
It's true that HQ dumps all the work of establishing and maintaining shared world / genre / tone / scale assumptions onto the ref & players, but in practice that's never been a real problem. For me, anyway. (So far!)
How is HQ1 different from HQ2, and why is it better in your opinion?
Apologies for the long delay in replying, and apologies for the mushy answer to follow!
My impression is that HQ2 aimed to radically strip out any remaining trace of 'simulationist' playing, whether in feel/tone/tenor/whatever and in mechanical practice. A lot of HQ1 was pretty frank about the problems of dealing with, e.g., an extended battle, using 'narrativist' tools & techniques. I think what I like about it (HQ1 I mean) is that it was interested and wiling to bridge gaps not just in "narrative style", but in "gaming style" aso.
HQ2, as my impression was, is much more focused and dedicated to a single way of playing games: the narrative one, the pseudo-literary one. I -- personally and frankly speaking, here -- think this is a terrible bad road to go down. At best, it's a misunderstanding of the esthetics of literature vs. that of play; often, it's a perversion of both literature and imagination, an outlet for fetishism.
That being said, I don't think HQ2 is not worth reading. Every bullshit "what is role playing?" plug that gets inserted into a game book, it supersedes. Likewise for "how do I run a game?" and "how do I be a player?" bits of boilerplate -- whether you're a grey old coot like me or a kid born after the millennium like a few of my gaming crew today, it focuses you on what and why and how you're doing this make-believe stuff.
That being said, if you want a 'gaming system', it's not worth your bother. Seriously, someone else who has read the book can well teach you all its "mechanic" in thirty seconds or under. (As if anyone here needs to be "taught", except for private excitement?) And there's also the issue of autocongratulation, that I mentioned initially. Holy Moonballs, HQ2 is a self-satisfied text, and one that I can attest has directly put people off RPGs as a practice and as an entire subculture. And in the end, you do feel like buying a book that tells you, over and over again, to make it all up yourself.
TLDR: Find a copy of HQ1, it's open-minded in a fairly broad sense. You can turn it as diceless and storytellingist, or as points-logging and chaotic-gamist as you like. HQ2 is marginally worth buying for the intertextual sake of ancient gamers, well depraved in their vice, and for properly dubious newbies seriously interested in what they're into.
Victor, I don't think I really answered your question. I'm sorry. I think they're the same at heart -- yet HQ1 feels more flexible and open to me, while HQ2 seems written to be only one way, the snide and superior way.
Didn't want to answer until kk7 had a chance but since some of the question remains, I'll mention what I've heard. If this provokes a nerd-raged correction to my hearsay, so much the better.
HQ1 had two elements of play that were problematic for folks. One was that people would hunt across their character sheet looking for bonuses that could justify, since there was no limit to the number of "helper" skills/abilities/aspects that could be applied. IIRQ HQ2 only allows one.
The other element was extended contests. I think in Mythic Russia, which was sort of a HQ 1.5, an alternative mechanic was introduced, and that was retained at least as an option in HQ2.
You did answer my question! I think I'm going to hunt for a copy of HQ1. I like HQ2 but the way it tries hard to distance itself from any "simulationism" or "virtual world-ism" botters me a bit. Thanks!
Isn't Heroquest 2E the book that advices play following some kind of narrative rythm or something, with pre-scripted failings by the players in the name of drama and all that? If so, its not my thing. Too railroady. I prefer the other drama school (the "forgite" one).
Quote from: Arminius;988719HQ1 had two elements of play that were problematic for folks. One was that people would hunt across their character sheet looking for bonuses that could justify, since there was no limit to the number of "helper" skills/abilities/aspects that could be applied. IIRQ HQ2 only allows one.
The other element was extended contests. I think in Mythic Russia, which was sort of a HQ 1.5, an alternative mechanic was introduced, and that was retained at least as an option in HQ2.
Oh, yes, thank you! Those are/were/will be big tripping points for any crew taking HQ1 off the blocks and running a game from scratch. I was blowing hot & abstract air ;(
The 'applicable bonuses' breed like rabbits in the hands of even lightly experienced RPG'ers and can bring a game session to a screeching halt just as fast as High Baroque era Rolemaster. OTOH, HQ2's procrustean solution kills off a lot of the joy in building characters in the mechanics. ("How often can Dr. Pop's 'The Wind Is Full of Evil Farts 1w2' Illumination insanity ever matter? Yeah, screw it then.") Some fix to HQ1 is needed (in the absence of cosmically wise and restrained players), and I think house rules are a better option than what HQ2 put forward. What my own group has settled down on is "only one modifier per 'category' of character rating", with ratings roughly separated into physical characteristics, personality, cultural background, knowledge and skills, community links, personal ties, religious powers, and a few others ad hoc.
I actually have had Mythic Russia for years and never actually used its rules bits for gaming, and so didn't realize it had a different approach to extended contests... so I should probably shut up about the second point you raise. But yes, it's hard to use the HQ1 mechanics as written to run extended contests, strictly speaking. Mostly what I seem to find people doing is assigning 'real' consequences at each turn of the contest, at the same time you narrate what's happening, with the clear understanding that after the contest is wrapped up, weird/conflicting story-telling bits can get edited. (Lightly edited.) I don't know that that's anything like a good fix; OTOH, I do know I still want some baby in the bathwater, is all. ("Tastes great, no empty calories!")
Quote from: Itachi;988982Isn't Heroquest 2E the book that advices play following some kind of narrative rythm or something, with pre-scripted failings by the players in the name of drama and all that?
As someone more articulate than me said near the start of this thread, HQ2 does advise something like that, but it really does not stipulate it. I don't see why that should be a problem, and the "pass/fail cycle" can be smoothly and joyously booted from anyone's use of HQ2. If anything, I disliked the rhetoric of HQ2, and its smugness -- definitely not any inherent railroadiness.