That's one way to view how much alignment is imbedded for D&D. Though with clerics, active gods, and their magic I am strongly inclined to disagree. I also find it rather attached to strategy & tactics when issues of tight space skirmishing and unclaimed loot (and possible betrayal) is involved, too.

I know it's not popular, but I do understand the point of view that a shift in alignment penalizes rate of experience growth. By discarding your previous boundaries and taking up another you are re-learning your approach to the world. Be it combat, social, or exploration, your new boundaries favor certain expedient approaches and new discretion more.

i.e. Shifting from honorable, self-sacrificing headlong combat (LG), into strictly honorable and technical combat (LN), into an undisciplined, dispassionate ferocity that gets the job done combat (NN), into gleeful, unpredictable "cheating" frenzy (CN), and into a disorganized "cheating," no-holds-barred aggression that'll eat its own to save its own tail (CE) takes time to learn.

From stabbing someone in the back without hesitation, to shaming someone successfully into action, to eavesdropping gracefully by diplomacy, takes real practice. To commit you got to truly believe, which shapes success. How you see the world determines your favored confident manner of approach.

I agree there have been some imperfect applications done in game design with Alignment.

Quote from: RPGPundit;822753I agree there have been some imperfect applications done in game design with Alignment.

  And some of them in profoundly influential places, like the 1E DMG's draconian atonement rules.

Quote from: Armchair Gamer;822854And some of them in profoundly influential places, like the 1E DMG's draconian atonement rules.

I still use them.

Part of the fun of not using alignment on paper is when players get so caught up in their own machinations they lose sight of what they claim their characters originally stood for. It's especially true when my campaigns gravitate towards great conflicts between sovereign powers and the PC's are headlong part of it. War, and the necessary problems that follow it often cause PC's to drift far afield and before they know it... they're in that morally grey region they never thought they'd be in.

For most players this is the stuff that they color their play with as their PC's mature. "Remember back when we fought at the siege of Ankhrys?... dark times brother. Dark times. I confess I still have a taste for halfling-jerky."

But for players who cleave to a deity and a religion with specific moral obligations - the effects are more dramatic. Spells stop coming or change in the nature of their manifestation, dreams and portents darken. Life really starts to suck... and yeah, casting a "simple" Atonement isn't necessarily enough (in my games) - often I make players have to prove their atonement thought play, and the Atonement spell itself is the capstone to the whole affair.

I long since quit using alignment as a player facing rule.  As a DM tool, it is handy for quick insight into a monster.  

Good and evil are the standard way to discuss morality, so easy enough to use in game.

Law and chaos are weird concepts that make little sense to this guy who has never read Moorcock.  So I just figure law means calm and rational; chaotic means temperamental and emotional.

Quote from: Armchair Gamer;822854And some of them in profoundly influential places, like the 1E DMG's draconian atonement rules.

Yes.

a lot of people seem to have 2 major misunderstandings of how alignment works

people need to remember 2 things

the ends dont justify the means
its not about what somebody thinks of there actions its about the actions themselves (there is actually a little wiggle room here but its best to beat those first 2 things into somebodies head before you add on any details (no wiggle room on the ends and means though))

also something i see come up a lot is an argument of if evil is people that hurt people to get what they want or people that hurt people for the sake of hurting people

what people need to learn is that they both count as evil alignment is not a straightjacket there simple clasifications there are many many types of evil

Quote from: mAcular Chaotic;819019Do you use alignment in your D&D games? How do you track a player's movement along the spectrum?

It seems like a nightmare.

I only use and track alignment if a character is getting powers from a god. For instance, a cleric needs to stay on track with his deity if he wants to keep getting his prayers answered. For anyone else, I don't use alignments at all.

Quote from: Brad;819160As much hate as Palladium gets, I always liked Siembedia's alignment system. In the very least it's unambiguous as to what someone with a particular alignment would do.

Preach on, brother.

Palladium combat is better, too.

Quote from: Matt;824760I only use and track alignment if a character is getting powers from a god. For instance, a cleric needs to stay on track with his deity if he wants to keep getting his prayers answered. For anyone else, I don't use alignments at all.

That is exactly when it gets hairy, because the alignment matters, and you can get caught in lots of ambiguous situations like a Paladin allowing some evil to occur by inaction in the name of stopping a greater evil.

Quote from: mAcular Chaotic;824907That is exactly when it gets hairy, because the alignment matters, and you can get caught in lots of ambiguous situations like a Paladin allowing some evil to occur by inaction in the name of stopping a greater evil.

One would assume that divinely imbued beings would be absolved the 'mortal sin' of not being omnipresent — and supported for using their judgment to fight the greater evil.

Quote from: mAcular Chaotic;824907That is exactly when it gets hairy, because the alignment matters, and you can get caught in lots of ambiguous situations like a Paladin allowing some evil to occur by inaction in the name of stopping a greater evil.

if you are having that problem somebody is seriously misunderstanding how the alignment system or palidan code is supposed to work