Quote from: S'mon on February 15, 2024, 02:18:30 PM
I've just started running Cyberpunk (the Red rules) for the first time ever. I'm loving the ruleset overall, but a lot of the detail seems pretty rough & in need of tinkering. Any advice for running Cyberpunk? I do have Listen Up You Primitive Screwheads but haven't read over it recently.
Roll20 site https://app.roll20.net/campaigns/details/16712626/cyberpunk-getting-paid

Something that I found made the game pretty fun and helped with the sandbox style of game was keeping track of factions and character backgrounds. Figure out who the big players are and track the party's relationship with them on a piece of paper. Do the same for individuals the players are involved with.

So for example, if you have a character who had a tragic relationship with a woman years ago, use that at some point. Not right away, but bring it up. Maybe she's a rival now, maybe she wants to hook up again but she's got it in with a gang, etc. I find it's fun to attach the players to a gang or group so the gang's problems become the player's problems.

Quote from: 1stLevelWizard on February 15, 2024, 06:49:42 PM
Something that I found made the game pretty fun and helped with the sandbox style of game was keeping track of factions and character backgrounds. Figure out who the big players are and track the party's relationship with them on a piece of paper. Do the same for individuals the players are involved with.

So for example, if you have a character who had a tragic relationship with a woman years ago, use that at some point. Not right away, but bring it up. Maybe she's a rival now, maybe she wants to hook up again but she's got it in with a gang, etc. I find it's fun to attach the players to a gang or group so the gang's problems become the player's problems.

Thanks, that seems good advice. My D&D sandboxes rarely involve PC's pre-game lives, but that's an important part of this and other Noir genres I shouldn't overlook. In Streets of Fire Cody and Ellen Aim's past is a big plot driver. That Diane Lane (Ellen Aim) was 19 at the time just contributed to that heightened reality - or unnerving - feel. 

My players have rolled their Lifepaths, but nothing much grabbed me yet. I should look at them again and do some editing.

Re factions, having a Media PC in the group has been brilliant. One session in and his video uploads https://app.roll20.net/forum/post/11794012/in-the-know have already got the Red Chrome Legion and a corrupt gang of Dirty Cops hating his guts and determined to kill him. 

Quote from: 1stLevelWizard on February 15, 2024, 06:49:42 PM
So for example, if you have a character who had a tragic relationship with a woman years ago, use that at some point. Not right away, but bring it up. Maybe she's a rival now, maybe she wants to hook up again but she's got it in with a gang, etc. I find it's fun to attach the players to a gang or group so the gang's problems become the player's problems.

Actually, that's awesome, cheers.  The PCs currently have a wounded female Red Chrome Legion Ganger tied up in the boot of their car.  Now I want to make her the ex GF of the new Lawman PC...

Quote from: Grognard GM on February 15, 2024, 06:23:17 PM

Quote from: ThatChrisGuy on February 15, 2024, 05:53:24 PM

Quote from: Grognard GM on February 15, 2024, 04:56:16 PM

Quote from: jeff37923 on February 15, 2024, 04:22:45 PM
Watch Ghost in the Shell (all of the anime) and Cyberpunk: Edgerunners, that will go a long way to understand the vibe of the genre and setting.

I'd instead recommend ...Johnny Mnemonic...

You fiend!

Look, neither Johnny Mnemonic nor Nemesis are great cinema, but they are the only movies that represent Cyberpunk as shown in Cyberpunk 2020/Shadowrun.

Johnny Mnemonic is THE Cyberpunk 2020 movie, IMO. It's got a cyberpsycho, street punks, a fixer, computer hacking, corporate shenanigans, an uploaded human conciousness, and a plot revolving around a guy who sacrificed a chunk of his brain and memories in order to be a better data courier.

It's not a great film, but it's not that bad, and has one of my favorite meltdowns...

Adventures written for Traveller are good for Cyberpunk as well.  There's a lot of the same kind of thing where the PCs are independent contractors, therefore expendable, therefore likely to get in over their heads in a fun way.  Obviously, you'll have to do some conversion and not every adventure will fit the party.

Don't  .

I've never read the Red rules, and I found 2020 to be one of the more unwieldy systems I've ever tried to run, so I can't give rules advice. For more constructive advice:

I'll piggyback a bit on the brewing argument about inspirations and say that it can be quite important to be clear on which kind of cyberpunk you're running. The hyperdysfunctional, gritty neo-noir, style-over-substance branch of cyberpunk that you get in the likes of Blade Runner, Akira, or Judge Dredd is very different from the sleek, iphone-future, high concept stuff that you get in Neuromancer, Ghost in the Shell: SAC, Paprika and similar. If some of your players expect one and others the other, it can create problems. The Cyberpunk game setting adheres much more to the former, but it can do either.

Assuming you're going with the gritty street-level version of the genre, I'll make an anime inspiration recommendation most people probably wouldn't: Black Lagoon. Not strictly cyberpunk, but it nails the whole "modern mercenaries" vibe and could probably give you a fair few adventure ideas.

When I ran my Cyberpunk campaign, I set the PCs up as a private detective agency, which worked well. It's a good format for episodic campaigns, gives you an excuse to interact with all levels of society, and you can change from case to case how much you want to lean into either the neo-noir or hard sci-fi elements of the setting.

Quote from: ForgottenF on February 15, 2024, 11:50:50 PM
Don't  .

I've never read the Red rules, and I found 2020 to be one of the more unwieldy systems I've ever tried to run, so I can't give rules advice. For more constructive advice:

I'll piggyback a bit on the brewing argument about inspirations and say that it can be quite important to be clear on which kind of cyberpunk you're running. The hyperdysfunctional, gritty neo-noir, style-over-substance branch of cyberpunk that you get in the likes of Blade Runner, Akira, or Judge Dredd is very different from the sleek, iphone-future, high concept stuff that you get in Neuromancer, Ghost in the Shell: SAC, Paprika and similar. If some of your players expect one and others the other, it can create problems. The Cyberpunk game setting adheres much more to the former, but it can do either.

Assuming you're going with the gritty street-level version of the genre, I'll make an anime inspiration recommendation most people probably wouldn't: Black Lagoon. Not strictly cyberpunk, but it nails the whole "modern mercenaries" vibe and could probably give you a fair few adventure ideas.

When I ran my Cyberpunk campaign, I set the PCs up as a private detective agency, which worked well. It's a good format for episodic campaigns, gives you an excuse to interact with all levels of society, and you can change from case to case how much you want to lean into either the neo-noir or hard sci-fi elements of the setting.

Thanks. I'm going for Noir, but not hyper dysfunctional, not the Karl Urban Dredd where the 'good guys' execute surrendering Perps. Cute NPCs may randomly get their heads blown off, but it's not a Crapsack World. "The last bird died in 2003" was a joke. The environment isn't in great shape, but there are still trees and pigeons and stuff. You only need an NBC mask in the Hot Zone. My art inspiration is more vitalist '80s CP 2020 than CP Red's depressed "Current Year" vibe.  Neuromancer, but seen from Street level; Case and Molly would be Rank 8+ characters, not starting Rank 4 types. There may even be a bit of Streets of Fire's 1950s-style emphasis on the indomitable human spirit - Robocop has a bit of that too. Light in the Darkness, not just Grimdark.

I agree about CP 2020 being unwieldy, but CP Red actually does a great job streamlining the core system. It desperately needs an editor though.

Quote from: Darrin Kelley on February 15, 2024, 06:44:19 PM
Interface Red Vol 3 reintroduces the Full Body Conversions from the old Chromebooks. It's due out sometime in POD later this month,

I might get it, but I'm taking a less-is-more approach to Cyberware, Full Body Conversions do exist but are rare, mostly encountered as Cyberpsychos. Conversely a Red update of Maximum Metal would be cool.

Quote from: S'mon on February 16, 2024, 05:29:03 AM...I'm taking a less-is-more approach to Cyberware...

BLASPHEMY!

Quote from: Grognard GM on February 16, 2024, 06:07:26 AM

Quote from: S'mon on February 16, 2024, 05:29:03 AM...I'm taking a less-is-more approach to Cyberware...

BLASPHEMY!

I mean, like Ripperclaws and Cosmetics are pretty common (Elf Ears and Anime Biosculpts are currently in fashion). But it's not a Transhumanist setting. I want to keep it relatable.

Quote from: S'mon on February 15, 2024, 07:01:35 PM

Quote from: 1stLevelWizard on February 15, 2024, 06:49:42 PM
So for example, if you have a character who had a tragic relationship with a woman years ago, use that at some point. Not right away, but bring it up. Maybe she's a rival now, maybe she wants to hook up again but she's got it in with a gang, etc. I find it's fun to attach the players to a gang or group so the gang's problems become the player's problems.

Actually, that's awesome, cheers.  The PCs currently have a wounded female Red Chrome Legion Ganger tied up in the boot of their car.  Now I want to make her the ex GF of the new Lawman PC...

Hell yeah, that's the stuff right there that can kick off another adventure! Cyberpunk was a blast to run because of scenarios like this, and more often than not it was the little random side stuff the players end up focusing on that keeps them interested in surviving session to session. I mean sure, the party has been hired to find some stolen chrome, but what if the guy that stole it is one of PC's brothers?

Where to start?

So based on your criteria - Less is More (Cyberware), Noir, CPRed with CP2020 stylish 80's tones...

1) Keep the characters hungry for credits. This should be easy because while they might be street-poor, even if they're making decent money if they have real jobs, nickel-and-diming them with costs: food, rent, shakedowns, muggings, having their "homes" broken into, power-outages, shortages of food resources, etc. should be motivators to make money and therefore be open to Edgerunning gigs.

2) Desperate, but not necessarily TOO desperate. I don't say Cyberware is rare, per se, I enforce that some types of cyberware are highly regulated. Bioware? That's for some fancy-dan Euro trash that living in the clouds. This doesn't mean that a shipment might fall off a truck somewhere - and act as a MacGuffin for some enterprising Fixer to hire the the PC's to nab it (for him not them). Cyberware should be priced by rarity AND availability based on your locality. Your players should hear about cool upgrades, and you should make them work for it.

3) Keep it local. One of the big things about Cyberpunk is establishing the niche in which the PC's operate - whether it's the building and neighborhood in which they live, the corporate high-rise they've been been given a company flat in, you need to flesh out their local sandbox with NPC's and "issues" appropriate to the tone and themes you're gonna play with (at the start).

4) Crime pays. The Local Fixer(s) is a must. Decide what these NPC's specialize in - because those are the missions that the PC's are going to help maintain. And if the Fixer branches out and the PC's are reliable performers, they will rise too. Decide what the Fixer's main roadblocks are: local gangs, rival Fixers, Corporate interests, logistical chokepoints in their distribution chains etc. The criminal ecosphere is the bread and butter of what Edgerunners live for, I mean they don't have real jobs, right?

5) Real Jobs. Okay so they might have real jobs. Well in Cyberpunk real jobs just means you're doing crimes under the cover of corporate authority. Think of all the dirty interests in corrupt companies today, and magnify it, and let the PC's do the dirty work. Politician trying to push legislation locally that will disrupt some Company project? The PC's might be hired as consultants (if they're not officially on the payroll) to lean on him. Of course that politician is sponsored by corporate rivals... No politician *actually* works for the people after all. PC's should be enticed to work for The Man - that means clean housing in the corp-zone (potentially), sponsorship? Free gear? Corporate Fixers are real, or maybe it's just some Corpo that needs "discrete" muscle for his climb and the PC's fit the bill. Plausible deniability pays.

6) Romance. Yeah romance. Noir is nothing without the potential for love in an uncaring world. Cultivating real relationships should be HARD in CP. But it should happen in the face of violence and treachery. Because you don't really know who'se down with you until they prove it, right? When it happens, the PC's should try desperately to maintain those rare relationships - friend, lover or whatever. Of course it has to end bad. There is always the promise of riding off into the sunset... but it's always one bad decision from going sideways. Nothing underscores that like $$$ to stab you through the heart, or better tempting the PC with money/cyberware/drugs or whatever to do the backstabbing. Tie that romance off with a bow made of razorwire and strangle them with it.

7) The Law Won. You wanna fight the Law with big guns? Up to you. CP is/should be deadly. But if everyone wants to be a gunbunny give them what they want - they'll end up dead as doornails. Enforce the laws *brutally*. But enforce it SELECTIVELY. The Corps keep their zones clean. The local cops keep clean the sectors they're told to keep clean. The Combat Zone? Ain't no fucking cops in the CZ unless they're there to take some fools out, or pick up a person of interest - and that means anyone looking slideways at them while they're doing it, better not be you. Make NPC's within the areas of PC play known. OR conversely make them nameless/faceless enforcers to be feared. I'll do a little of both. Remember not all Johnny Law organizations are on the same side per se. Jurisdictions are generally well defined but interests will blur those lines. That's where Adventure calls! Corporate defector is outside Corporate controlled area? Might be a Corp Security specialists hooks up with the PC's needing their help to locate the target in the Hood! Entice the PC's! Make the NPC's as desperate as the PC's. Just contextualize it.

String it all together! Said Corp Security agent could lead to being a contact for the PCs! They might now have a means to up their status on the streets by leveraging that contact with their local Fixer - depending on the Corporation he works for, it might turn into a regular thing where the PC's now are a valued set of cogs to maintain some new illicit revenue stream. They'll have to protect their racket. They'll have to get enticed by other criminals who want in on it. They'll be attacked by rival corporate molls that want whatever the racket is to be stopped. And then there's the Cops. Never underestimate the Do-Gooder Cop that wants to "help" by putting your PC's down.

Create the eco-system around the PC's by selectively opening and closing gates of opportunity where their hunger drives them. Immerse them in the petty emotional triumphs and tragedies of just living in CP world. It's not about the cyber, or the guns, it's about the setting. Soak them in it.

Thanks, Tenbones! This is all gold! Saving this to my Cyberpunk folder!

Quote from: S'mon on February 16, 2024, 12:11:50 PM
Thanks, Tenbones! This is all gold! Saving this to my Cyberpunk folder!

So, yeah. There's a lot there to digest. I feel like Pondsmith just gave me a tutorial.  I'm pleased to see I'm already doing some of these things, but there's a lot more to get a handle on. South Night City is coming along well as a nascent sandbox, an ex industrial area that IMC is the 'most marginal Combat Zone' in the city. Which means uncertainty. Everyone knows what the Old Combat Zone or Little China is like, who rules the streets (not the police). In South NC, is it the Cops? They rarely respond to calls, unless it's to stop a Boostergang assault on the University District. The Red Chrome Legion? Piranhas even?  None of the gangs really have the numbers to rule the streets.