Okay, Palladium tends to be a bit of a whipping boy but really there's a lot of things they get right.  It's bogged down in the cludgy stuff but there's things I'd really like to see in a game.  I'll note that most of my love goes to the Mechanoid Invasion and First Edition Palladium Fantasy.  Heroes Unlimited and TMNT is where I feel they jumped the shark.

The weapon bonuses.  Palladium has the best weapon differentiation system in the entire industry.  It's clean, it scales as you level up, it broadens the sweet spot, and it works great in play.  Daggers are better for throwing, shields are for parrying, axes are great at attacking but not so hot at defending.  And I'm saying this as a Rolemaster fan.  They could use damage type verses armor type mods for the damage system but I wasn't praising the damage system.

The strike, parry, dodge dynamic.  Dodging costs you an attack but some martial artists can automatic dodge.  Parrying costs you an attack but trained fighters can automatic parry.  The beat the other guy's roll mechanism just works and with a five hitting you get rid of the whiff factor that plagues so many other games.  Of course if you've got simultaneous initiative you've the potential for a simultaneous strike with no defenses allowed.

The Attacks per melee round set up.  While later versions clog it with special case rules the grouping of a number of attacks under a longer melee round is the best of both worlds when it comes to initiative per round or initiative per combat.  And it's still dead simple to use.

Lots of professions.  I like this approach far better than the attempts to blend classes, multi class, spiff up classes with feats and powers.  I was all for ditching the professions as skill costs and replacing them with professions as skill packages in the new Rolemaster.

Saving throws based on caster level.

Real differences in the way magic-using professions approach their art.  This is more of a first edition fantasy thing and the PPE rules leave me cold.  But a Mind Mage, Wizard, Summoner, and Diabolist are all very different in play and have real character and flavor.

I AM IRON MAN is a perfect launch pitch for a grand space opera campaign.

Hit Points based on Physical Endurance.  Yes Tunnels and Trolls did it first. But they still got it right.  D&D's Hit Dice system is a wargames mechanic and I love it for that more tactical kind of my army guys beat on your army guys type of play.  But for the more detailed and realistic (yes I just called Palladium more realistic, scary) rpg it's a good rule.

Armor as hit points.  This gets armor degradation in place and avoids the invincible tank problem of DR and the difficulties that arise from armor making people harder to hit.

Like D&D I think Palladium is a game that has actually ridden on the good core design in spite of the crap that's piled on over the years.  Of course I'd love to see it rebuilt and streamlined but only if they can do it without stripping out the stuff that made it good in the first place.

Yep. People love to rag on Palladium product. But all too often they are just parroting what someone else said without ever actually having looked at the game.

It plays pretty smoothly and even the MDC works after a fasion.

Its probably gives more options than Gurps for character generation and equipment.

Lots of imaginative material at a modest price!

That for me was the appeal of the Mechanoids and Palladium RPG books. (I don't know enough about 2nd ed. to comment, except that a glance suggested there was still a ton of cool stuff.)

TMNT in my memory seems remarkably well organized compared with most of Kevin's line.

I pulled out Heroes Unlimited 2nd Ed. Revised (with USA-1 on the cover) recently for another read-thru and character generation. It clicked a little more than before, but still seemed too bogged down in minor fiddly details and too amateurishly presented.

Note that here we really don't have a lot besides a rules set. Mechanoids is groovy because so much of it is depiction of an interesting world, with lots of illustrations.

What Palladium got/gets right:

- Enthusiasm, that despite our jaded times, is often infectious. Why shouldn't a game remind people that it's supposed to be fun?
- Making opposed rolls the core of combat makes it fun, and more interactive.
- Like David mentioned,the different methods of magic and psychic powers make the different spellcasters distinct and interesting.

Actually I'd even give them points for not having stat penalties.  It's a brilliant way to take the sting out of low rolls.  The main role of stats is in determining the professions you can take.

If I had to pick two I'd say "management" and "artwork"

Wait, what?  OH!  Got right.  Sorry, I misread.

Enthusiasm and resources.

Quote from: thedungeondelver;765330If I had to pick two I'd say "management" and "artwork"

Wait, what?  OH!  Got right.  Sorry, I misread.

Enthusiasm and resources.

Palladium games tended to sport some pretty good art throughout. The occasional low points. But overall pretty good.

I definitely agree with value to cost ratio.  And I still think Splicers and Systems Failure are way under appreciated.  The ebb and flow of strike/parry/dodge makes for a very interactive and exciting conflict.  And the fact you could increase poor physical stats with certain skills was a cool, if often abused, option during character generation.

Enthusiasm, gun porn, the art of Ramon Perez, the magic systems in Palladium Fantasy, anything Erick Wujcik or Bill Coffin did, back-and-forth combat, and the original setting of Rifts.

The hit on a five+, extreme variation on how magic users function, awesome artwork, and enthusiasm for what they were making were the best parts of the Palladium systems.

Most of the games that I've read by them get you fired up to play in a way that other games could only dream of.

Many of the ideas and hooks present in Palladium's products are awesome.

I remember as a kid that their products were high value for a cheap price.

While their soft covers can and will de-laminate, the sewn binding is close to bomb proof.

Lastly- The Palladium Role Playing Game First Edition Revised is a masterpiece:)  It's the original next wave retro-clone.

Quote from: RunningLaser;765352Most of the games that I've read by them get you fired up to play in a way that other games could only dream of.

Many of the ideas and hooks present in Palladium's products are awesome.

I remember as a kid that their products were high value for a cheap price.

While their soft covers can and will de-laminate, the sewn binding is close to bomb proof.

Lastly- The Palladium Role Playing Game First Edition Revised is a masterpiece:)  It's the original next wave retro-clone.

All of this.

A couple years ago on the Palladium message board, one of the admins started a thread asking "what would you NOT want Palladium to change?" And my response was; the binding. Like you said, it's fucking indestructable. I have books almost 30 years old, dogeared, laminate peeled off, stained from who-knows-what, and the binding is still strong as hell.

Quote from: everloss;765368All of this.

A couple years ago on the Palladium message board, one of the admins started a thread asking "what would you NOT want Palladium to change?" And my response was; the binding. Like you said, it's fucking indestructable. I have books almost 30 years old, dogeared, laminate peeled off, stained from who-knows-what, and the binding is still strong as hell.

Oddly I have only had one of my Palladium books de-laminate, and bemusingly that was the Palladium RPG book. Ive got a few that are a little edge parted. But otherwise fine. Warping of the cover was my problem. They tended to curl a little after some use and take some work to flatten.

From the business standpoint, they've managed to stay afloat, getting their revenue almost entirely from RPGs, and decently priced ones at that, for over 30 years — longer than TSR, White Wolf or SJG (which remains alive but has since transitioned, revenue-wise, from being the GURPS company to being the Munchkin company) — and that's considering the Crisis of Treachery!!!!!111!1!!one thing. They are obviously doing something right.

Gaming-wise, well, the only things I can really fault them are:

1. Featuring contradictory rules across supplements to the same edition of the same game. Get your shit together, Kevin.

2. Killing the tables for hand-to-hand combat modifiers and skill levels somewhere between PFRPG 1e and TMNT. WTF, Kevster. Tables are easier than keeping track of fucking modifiers, especially with character generation.

3. Catering to the toy-loving, moar dakka munchkins and releasing Rifts book after Rifts book packed to the gills with new toys, instead of developing the Rifts setting and giving GMs good game-table-ready material like the awesome Ciudad Juarez write-up in Vampire Kingdoms.

4. Dismissing critics as haters and having them banned over at the company forums (and the Palladium mailing list before that).

Buy not giving much of a crap about the system and focusing on making a fun game instead.