Quote from: Omega;1090336Its more that this should not have been run at a con where you werent darn sure it was ok to. That sort of session would fly at MiniCon. I mean really, they had a live BDSM party going every night every year. But it would not be ok at a more family friendly con. GenCon might be a no. Though in ages past they wouldnt have cared. There was some pretty creepy stuff played. But usually the more adult stuff was sectioned in special areas for that so you wouldnt creep out anyone else. Werewolf, Vampire, etc, saw those sectioned off now and then.

A quick glance at the expo site seems to indicate it is more family oriented? That should have been a red flag warning right there?

Good point.

Mistakes do happen it was just the very cavalier attitude to the players complaints which really tells me the character of the DM. The players at the table are angry and not at all happy with the content of the scenario and the DMs response was "I did it for shits and giggles and because I like pushing people buttons". That kind of response shows an utter lack of basic human decency imo. Who is to say he will not pull that kind of thing a second time. He gave fake account of what he was going to run so he could get it past the cons vetting committee or whatever they use to verify scenarios before they are allowed to be played on the floor. Decides to add sexual assault at the last minute to the scenario at the last minute without telling the players. To me that is not someone who is going to learn from past mistakes. More someone complaining they were caught.

Maybe that would fly at Mini-con as you. though even there I think they would have a warning about sexual assault.

Quote from: GeekyBugle;1090338I'm with Bunch in this, if he showed he learned why it was wrong to spring gang rape on the players? sure.

The thing is I'm not sure if he will learn from his mistake. One normal reaction to pissing off and angering people is not to say that one intent to was push their buttons for shits and giggles. One apologies on the spot. Whose to say he won't try it again given his past behavior at trying to circumvent the cons rules and policies on sexual assault and changing the scenario at the last minute.

Quote from: Omega;1090339Where I play it is considered polite to bow out of a session if its not going in a way you like and impolite to sit through when you are hating it. Or just speak up and say "hey? could we tone this down some?"

I've actually had issues with players who played something horror themed, were asked halfway through if they are enjoying it, they said yes, and at the end declared they didnt. Theres the door. Go.

I have played in one or two sessions where the DM one male anmd female were adding questionable material to their games. They refused to remove it from their campaigns and I and some other players walked away. The only thing I will say in defence DM dumbass is that the offended player(s) should have left immediately and gone to report his behavior to the con organizers. Not sit through the entire thing than complain about it.

Quote from: Darrin Kelley;1090305The GM in question lacked basic common sense. He disregarded the fact the con was a public venue. And that there is just content you do not ever bring to a public venue.

Quote from: spon;1090306More than that - he didn't warn his participants there would be ANY adult material, let alone what he eventually sprang on them. The scenario submitted to the organisers did not include any mature material at all.

That seems to be the case. Its weird and a bit suspicious. Either the DM was stupid, or deliberately out to shock. Or the DM did warn ahead and someone was shocked anyhow? Does anyone know what the session pitch was? Was it a scheduled event or a walk in? This could be a telling factor.

Addendum: Seems he did not warn anyone beforehand? That changes things quite a bit.

Quote from: GeekyBugle;1090327The GM didn't warn anybody, not even the convention, the characters were all 18-19 (so teens) despite some here calling it paedophile gang rape.

Agreed with everything.

Ok so if he didnt warn anyone then yeah thats on the DM and he pretty much begged to get kicked. The Expo isnt MiniCon or any other adult con with gaming venues. Though still I think the first recourse should have been to just ask the DM to tone it down or cut it out. And boot him only if he didnt.

Quote from: Omega;1090341That seems to be the case. Its weird and a bit suspicious. Either the DM was stupid, or deliberately out to shock. Or the DM did warn ahead and someone was shocked anyhow? Does anyone know what the session pitch was? Was it a scheduled event or a walk in? This could be a telling factor.

I have it from one of the organisers of the con that he did not warn anyone ahead of time about what he was going to do. There was no warning of any sort of mature content at all. The game that he submitted to the organisers for vetting had no such content in it. It was a scheduled event. The game was a teenage version of a stranger things-type scenario. The GM was someone who had GMed at cons before without any issues at all. Who knows why the F he did it?

Quote from: sureshot;1090274Hell I might even reported him to the con organizers because that kind of shit does not belong in anyway shape or form at any rpg convention.

The other thing is, most conventions don't have each game group in their own room with closed door, but a table in a room full of tables. People at other tables and passers-by get to hear what's going on. So even if everyone at the game table is good with it all, others who didn't sign up for it will cop some.  

One of the purposes of a game convention is to promote gaming generally, get new gamers in, and old gamers back in. You're sitting next to or walk past this, it puts you off, maybe you decide you're better off packing away your dice and going back home and playing Minecraft instead.

And of course, many gamers try to bring their kids into gaming by means of conventions. If this sort of stuff happens they'll certainly leave their kids at home, and may not even come along themselves.

As someone said above, sometimes the enemy of my enemy is just a cocksmock.

Quote from: Charon's Little Helper;1090322Technically yes - but when people say "free speech" the implication is the "right to free speech" - which is inherently a right from government, whether or not it's in the US. You can't have a "right" in relation to another private person.

There is also the principle of free speech. It's the principle that keeps us from becoming bloody savages, tearing each other's throats out. When speech ends, violence begins.
But, we're talking about a private venue with, I'm assuming, an expectation of content. Which is fine.

QuoteThe guy has the right to say creepy stuff, and the con has the right to kick him to the curb for it.

I agree.

I wonder what KiA has to say about it.

Also here's the testimony of someone else who was at the game in question.

Quote from: GeekyBugle;1090179Besides it being an horror 18+ game what other warning do they need?

That the game features sexual assault.

Quote from: GeekyBugle;1090276The thing is (And I bet I'm right) the moron wasn't offended but titillated by the "Edgy Mcbearded rape fantasy scenario". Then got a guilty conscience for enjoying it and blamed the GM for the sin, then Mr Edgy Mcbeard gets kicked out, banned and the woke morons go after him to ruin his life.

And it's that last part I have a problem with.

...

Alllrightythen.

Quote from: Omega;1090323Thats the problem with the UK. They ban anything that 'might' be dangerous. Or even words that someone somewhere out there might find offensive or... dangerous!

TMNT is a good example. Someone used nunchucks to rob a store? All nunchucks are banned as are depictions of them. Ninjas are scary and use pointy things. Banned. Now its Teenage Mutant HERO Turtles!

I can't believe they just erased Japanese culture like that.

Quote from: GeekyBugle;1090338I'm with Bunch in this, if he showed he learned why it was wrong to spring gang rape on the players? sure.

Not without close supervision.

If one needs a refresher on whether or not it's appropriate to spring gang rape on the players, I would have rather grave concerns about what other very basic lessons one might have missed out on.

Quote from: Thornhammer;1090360Not without close supervision.

If one needs a refresher on whether or not it's appropriate to spring gang rape on the players, I would have rather grave concerns about what other very basic lessons one might have missed out on.

I agree. My comment is mostly about the idea that if you can show you acknowledge it was dumb and show you have learned there is a chance at forgiveness vs the idea that a stupid choice is a permanent irrevocable black mark for life.

It seems perfectly reasonable to expel him from the convention, a permanent ban from UKGE is harsh but ok.
It does not seem reasonable to seek to ban him from everything ever; that would be appropriate for someone who had really raped real people (once he got out of jail).

I agree he should not be banned from everything ever. Except he screwed himself over so badly by doing something that he should have never done in the first place. Include sexual assault in an rpg scenario at a con and then even more stupidly make fun of the reaction he received. The reason for shits and giggles. Yes people make mistakes this is one hell of a mistake which the Dumbass DM could have easily avoided. One apologizes profusely for including sexual assault in an rpg scenario especially when those who signed up for it were not expecting it. Not brush it off and laugh and say one is doing it for shock value.

Of course the SJWs are having a field day and why would they not. Given how Dumbass DM gave them the rope to hang them with it. He fucked up in a most spectacular way, did it on purpose and know has to accept the consequences of his own stupid actions.

Has there been any direct online response by the GM? I'd be interested to see what he says about the incident as well as his reaction to what others are saying/doing. If he was really going for intentional shock, then he might have anticipated everything that is happening and going ahead with his act implies consent for the banning et al.

Quote from: GeekyBugle;1090227And he had the right to be a prick, and the player had the right to up and leave, instead choose to stay to the end and then complain.

You just don't do that at Convention games. Sure, if you advertised it as 18+ Horror with sexual violence then people know beforehand whether to sign up. But springing that kind of thing in-game is just bad.

Quote from: GeekyBugle;1090227The con might be right in kicking him out, after that? Nothing.

Kicking him out and banning him for life is fine. I agree that the sanction should be the end of it.

Some people have been calling for Naming and Shaming, or banning him from other conventions. Personally, I think that is unfair.

However, if he pulls the same stunt at another convention then it would show what kind of person he is.

Quote from: GeekyBugle;1090292And that's all I have to say about this to those willing to let the woke pearlclutchers destroy that particular asshat's life.

Yay!

Quote from: GeekyBugle;1090299Yeah, I know he brought it on himself, and you seem pretty happy to let the SJWs destroy him because you don't like the shock jock theme.

I don't like the theme either, I just happen to think that letting the woke morons destroy ppl is never a good thing.

I thought that was the last thing you were going to say on the subject?

Boo!

Quote from: soltakss;1090410You just don't do that at Convention games. Sure, if you advertised it as 18+ Horror with sexual violence then people know beforehand whether to sign up. But springing that kind of thing in-game is just bad.

Problem is the spoilers to your campaign (or one shot) what we need is more classifications as Grimm suggested in his latest video on the matter, so you put a horror + rated X in your game and there's no need for anything else. I agree that springing it just like that is bad form, but we still don't know the whole of the story. Grimm is going to interview the asshat, then we will know more.

Quote from: soltakss;1090410Kicking him out and banning him for life is fine. I agree that the sanction should be the end of it.

Agreed

Quote from: soltakss;1090410Some people have been calling for Naming and Shaming, or banning him from other conventions. Personally, I think that is unfair.

Agreed, after all that was my contention from the get go, not about the con banning him (even for life)

Quote from: soltakss;1090410However, if he pulls the same stunt at another convention then it would show what kind of person he is.

Agreed, should he repeat the stunt he SHOULD get banned everywhere, not because of the fictional gang rape of characters 18+ but because he just springs it on unsuspecting people. And "It's just a prank bruh!" It's no excuse.