Quote from: S'mon;1084800Well I know they can't win, because they are fundamentally opposed to reality. It's a question of how much damage they can do.

I'm starting to feel that we're all stuck in a live action game of Mage...

Quote from: HappyDaze;1084824I'm starting to feel that we're all stuck in a live action game of Mage...

Well they believe that Narrative = Reality. But Reality doesn't agree.

Quote from: sureshot;1084773It seems a rpg culture war is beginning and the SJWs insust on fighting it to the bitter end even if it destroys the hobby.

Well atomization of everything is the point of factionalism. In that way there can be no organized resistance, just isolating anomie.

Honestly, does no one want to play an In Nomine SJG PbP game with me? We could pretend to embody these values to their neurotic and destructive conclusion, wallowing in its crapulence like a Swedish LARP. It'll be fun!

Quote from: Brad;1084623I've played in Bill Webb's convention games what, three or four times? Seen him at at least six conventions total. That dude is 1) super friendly, 2) extremely high strung, 3) and drinks heavily. His wife and kids are usually with him, which makes this whole thing seem suspect...at 2AM when someone has been drinking throughout the entire day still seems 100% lucid and "into gaming", while talking about his kids in front of a bunch of gamers with his wife present, it almost makes zero sense to me he'd be hitting on some young girl. Like when would he have the time? The dude is frantic as shit, running a ton of games and basically shilling his company. I'm inclined to agree with the whole offered the girl a cigarette and she freaked out. Even if it was a pass, so what? FGG telling Bill Webb to avoid talking to young autistic milennials who take everything out of context? Could totally see that happening. Bill Webb sexually assaulting someone? Nope.

I get where you're coming from, and I agree, in principle - if he is generally a nice guy, as many here have vouched for, then it's ever the more outrageous what is being done to him. But we have to be careful not to get distracted by the usual rhetorics of "the great culture war": Whether he hurt BJ Hensley's feelings is not the question. It's about whether he actually did something that could be considered an illegal act, or not.

IMO that's the distinction to make that get's a little bit overlooked: Webb is accused of criminal behavior - if not by Hensley herself, then by others. These others voicing their general dislike for him, or for harassing behavior in general, is a completely different topic. Them raging on about the general matter is not even necessarily bad - only them trying to project any fantasy scenarios on what happened between Webb and Hensley.

This is also why I consider breaking the news through that amped-up YouTube podcaster such a stupid move. Granted, it WAS funny. But if Webb ever had the high ground, then he's lost it now.

Quote from: HappyDaze;1084824I'm starting to feel that we're all stuck in a live action game of Mage...

Quote from: S'mon;1084855Well they believe that Narrative = Reality. But Reality doesn't agree.

Which is why I never liked Mage. It had that tone of "this is how the Real World works - now play it in your game!" without ever explicitly saying so.

The irony of all the shit over at RPGkremlin is the sheer fucking hypocrisy. Bill Webb was being castigated for not being publicly contrite. The minute he raises his head above the parapet and IS publicly contrite, out come the Death Squads to shoot him down. He mentioned his victim's name: so what? Everyone knew it already. Those bastards don't want contrition: they don't want apologies, exemplars of good behaviour or anything else. They just want Webb's head on a spike, just like they wanted (and more or less got) Mentzer's. These guys may have been clumsy and dumb, but they're not malicious. There are plenty of accusations of Webb being some kind of serial convention lecher, but evidence is thin on the fucking ground.

And as for going after SJG? Bullshit. FGG is more than the sum of its parts, and SJG is savvy enough to know this. They've most likely done a fuck of a lot more investigation into Paizogate than Helton, Delofarno and Price ever have, and reached an informed fucking conclusion that's driving their business decision. But that's anathema to the Purple Stalinists. Suing this hand-wringing trio of character assassins is going to set an example that I hope the SJWs will actually take note of. Just as they want to make some examples of Webb, Mentzer, and whichever poor sap is next, they need a few of their own to be made an example of. That's the Chicago Way.

So here's what I'm doing for my small part. As CoreyHaim8myDog, a line editor for Modiphius, is one of the vocal supporters of the SJG/FGG pogrom,  I'm going to use their tactics against them. Guilt by association right? So here's a representative of a respected RPG company openly advocating the boycotting of two other respected RPG companies. I'm therefore done with Modiphius. I have a few of their books, and the whole fucking lot is going to my nearest Thrift Store tomorrow morning. I won't spend another nickel with them. Fuck, I was looking forward to Dune, but if Modiphius is going to allow one of their employees to target other members of the industry in this way, fuck 'em. The game works in two directions. I will continue to buy from SJG. I will buy stuff from Frog God. I'll make up my own mind as to who's innocent and who's guilty based on the available evidence, and it's pretty fucking evident that CoreyHaim8myDog is helping to drive a lynch mob.

I wonder if Modiphius is even aware an employee is doing that. I can't imagine any company would be happy about that behavior.

Quote from: myleftnut;1084907I wonder if Modiphius is even aware an employee is doing that. I can't imagine any company would be happy about that behavior.

Me neither. But there he is, shooting his mouth off, agitating, all the while with his tag line displaying his industry credentials. I guess it all depends on how Woke the Modiphius management structure is, and if they, as a company, are going to come out in support of their line manager, or back the industry itself.

Quote from: myleftnut;1084907I wonder if Modiphius is even aware an employee is doing that. I can't imagine any company would be happy about that behavior.

Well, we are talking about the same company that "accidentally" hid Gareth Michael Skarka's writing credits in the new Star Trek stuff until they got called on it.

What's so very cool: how Rpg.net mods allow their own site rules to be broken in order to attack people they do not like:

RPG.NET RULES:

Rule 0: The mission statement of this forum is "Keep the forums friendly and welcoming to as wide a range of gamers as possible." --- bullshit. How is bullying game designers 'friendly'?

Rule 4: Respect the privacy of your fellow gamers. Do not post emails or private messages without explicit written permission of all those involved. Do not use any posts or part of posts from these forums for commercial purposes without the express permission of each person involved. "Doxxing" anyone is cause for an immediate permanent ban. --- more bullshit. The SJW's & Mods post lies about Webb taken from all over the web, plus any toxin an SJW has posted on their site previously. Doxxing link included.

Rule 6 ("Rule 9"): Do not ask for medical, legal or other professional advice. Do not offer medical, legal, or other professional advice. Do not request emergency crisis counseling or solicit personal financial donations. If you're not sure if what you'd be asking counts, ask yourself "If the advice here is bad, is someone going to be harmed?" --- posters are in the threads discussing how to destabilize Frog God Games and Steve Jackson Games.

SJWs don't even understand the more they post their toxic ideology, the deeper the hole they dig for themselves. I hope Beard files and wins against them - then goes after RPG.net, ENWORLD and every other SJW troll-cave.

QuoteI hope Beard files and wins against them - then goes after RPG.net, ENWORLD and every other SJW troll-cave.

Agree with you on this 100%. Webb really has no other recourse. He's tried staying silent; he's tried to explain his position; he's tried to show he's changed when attending conventions. None of that is acceptable and the attacks still come. Suing Helton, Stacey D and Price - along with any other instigators of this Stalinist witch hint - needs to happen, and that should include RPGnet for providing a willing platform and constant encouragement for the activity. But one battle at a time.

I don't know who's right, even though it increasingly appears that Bill Webb is. I only hope that if he is, then FGG rightfully sues the seemingly lying, slandering fucks so deep into the dirt that they can't see daylight for a decade.

I suppose it's clear I'm not entirely impartial, though.

Quote from: Antiquation!;1084951I don't know who's right, even though it increasingly appears that Bill Webb is. I only hope that if he is, then FGG rightfully sues the seemingly lying, slandering fucks so deep into the dirt that they can't see daylight for a decade.

I suppose it's clear I'm not entirely impartial, though.

  Well, now that Webb has given his side of the story, there are three possibilities:

  1. Webb is deliberately lying or misrepresenting himself and/or the situation, whether through flat-out lying or using a minor incident to deflect attention from major ones.
  2. Webb is misrepresenting things, but not deliberately--difference of perspective, memory lapse due to time, alcohol, and/or other factors.
  3. Webb is telling the truth.

  Are there any solid testimonies or pieces of information that could help determine which it is? Because I haven't followed this story closely, but the latest blow-up on RPGNet seems long on rumor, innuendo and accusation, short on details--and even if I could ask over there (I locked my account two years ago), I'd be accused of JAQing/sealioning/trying to protect the abuser.

Quote from: Armchair Gamer;1084970Are there any solid testimonies or pieces of information that could help determine which it is? Because I haven't followed this story closely, but the latest blow-up on RPGNet seems long on rumor, innuendo and accusation, short on details--and even if I could ask over there (I locked my account two years ago), I'd be accused of JAQing/sealioning/trying to protect the abuser.

I think the possibilities you present are fairly self-evident and most rational third parties could agree upon, yes.

As to solid testimonies, only those from the alleged victims who as far as I've read at least 2 of the 3 (not speaking of people who were present who appear to agree, but they're at least partially removed from the events in question) essentially corroborated Webb's story and said it's been a misunderstanding and that it's over now. The only account I've read related to the con injury was someone who was not physically capable of interjecting with him but still did so, and injured themselves in the process (reasons unclear, supposedly he was following someone but the waters are muddied there from both sides as far as accounts). Aside from that, lots of hearsay about him being a drunken lout at cons who continually harassed women at bars from people whose friends told them about how bad he behaved. Then more hearsay from people who met him in person and said he was fine and agreeable and never did a thing wrong and that he has been a great guy and kept his family with him at nearly all times.

I don't know and I don't claim to know. Someone else may be able to shed more light.

I can only say Webb appears to be mostly in the clear, from my perspective. Hopefully the law will sort it out. Whoever did wrong deserves justice. Whoever didn't does not deserve a witch hunt, regardless.

RPG.net is a bunch of fucking fanatics who literally prevent the presentation of actual evidence. Read those threads but don't drink the kool-aid. Also "sealioning" is a fucking embarrassing joke term that completely invalidates its own use by even being posted.

Quote from: Antiquation!;1084974I think the possibilities you present are fairly self-evident and most rational third parties could agree upon, yes.

As to solid testimonies, only those from the alleged victims who as far as I've read at least 2 of the 3 (not speaking of people who were present who appear to agree, but they're at least partially removed from the events in question) essentially corroborated Webb's story and said it's been a misunderstanding and that it's over now. The only account I've read related to the con injury was someone who was not physically capable of interjecting with him but still did so, and injured themselves in the process (reasons unclear, supposedly he was following someone but the waters are muddied there from both sides as far as accounts). Aside from that, lots of hearsay about him being a drunken lout at cons who continually harassed women at bars from people whose friends told them about how bad he behaved. Then more hearsay from people who met him in person and said he was fine and agreeable and never did a thing wrong and that he has been a great guy and kept his family with him at nearly all times.

I don't know and I don't claim to know. Someone else may be able to shed more light.

I can only say Webb appears to be mostly in the clear, from my perspective. Hopefully the law will sort it out. Whoever did wrong deserves justice. Whoever didn't does not deserve a witch hunt, regardless.

RPG.net is a bunch of fucking fanatics who literally prevent the presentation of actual evidence. Read those threads but don't drink the kool-aid. Also "sealioning" is a fucking embarrassing joke term that completely invalidates its own use by even being posted.

Greetings!

SEALIONING!!!:D Fuck, that term is so ridiculous I love it! LOL. I think Jeff or Ratman told me what it meant. I honestly didn't know what the hell it meant until a few days or whatever ago. I still love it! It's such a stupid thing. Like Surehot grinds on the SJW's all the time for making new words up. I have also mentioned it in the past--I learned years ago, now, how the Liberals get all this shit from fucking Marxism, where they twist and distort the meaning of everyday, normal words, and they freight-train in whole new definitions for expressions, then they also make up whole new words out of nothing--all designed to verbally and socially silence you, and paralyze your resistance to their argument in the public square. I've seen this done all over in college; in magazine articles; on talk shows; on interviews on news programs; as well as in political talks and debates. It's a toxic, fucked up philosophy pioneered by Marx, and Foucalt, and some other Communist troglodytes over the years, designed to make language itself a weapon to destroy Western Civilization, and crush the Communist's political and cultural opponents.

Good commentary, my friend!

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK