For all those types, who want to see proof of shilling and swinery:

http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=194714

The thread is about the Jenga-Horror-Game. The author of the game comes to the thread and is not doing any harm.
But post #39 is the prototypical forger-viral swinery.

I'm not so sure that's evidence of "Swinery" as much as it is of the poster being a totally misinformed consumer with little experience in the hobby at large outside of the games or systems mentioned in his post. I don't see any malice there, just ignorance.

QuoteWell, you really can't fault somebody for coming up with a clever RPG that requires creativity and imagination, can you?

I've been on a "story games" kick lately-- Agon, Carry, Mortal Coil, and the ultrapopular Dogs in the Vineyard have been run at my wonderful FLGS-- and Dread is now on my list of things to try. The guys that work on this stuff are the ones who are really evolving the hobby.

It has really made me wonder how-- or if-- it is possible to apply some of these principles to something like d20. So I'm digging this discussion.                                                                                          __________________
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Uninformed? I think it´s shilling/threadcrapping.

EDIT: I´m not getting worked up on it. I just read it, and thought it is  a perfect example, of what has been discussed.

Quote from: SettembriniUninformed? I think it´s shilling/threadcrapping.

It's that, too, though I see C&C, OSRIC, BFRPG, and D&D fans post similar links, so that's not a sure sign of "Swinedom" -- just of discourteous posters. I meant that this poster's enthusiasm (the comments about innovation) and the resulting links seem to be the product of having only ever played D&D and those few games that he provides links to.

I think that the post in question was two parts ignorance of the larger hobby and one part new found enthusiasm for. . . er. . . something new. I don't see the hallmarks of a sinister shadow conspiracy here. If he'd said something like "Dread sucks and these games do it better!" then, yes, I'd say that's the kind of thing that Pundit is always talking about.

This, though? Nope. I don't buy that it's anymore "Swine" behavior than that exhibted by the gaggle of C&C fans who follow me around claiming that C&C is a better game than D&D and that I'm crazy/ignorant/wrong to like the latter better. It's just fandom, really.

Quote from: jdrakehIt's just fandom, really.

And that could be the sad truth...

(I've been thinking a lot about common fandom behaviors lately. Its kinda depressing.)

There is a simmering contingent of posters at ENWorld who simply can't stand D&D3.5 and will use any opportunity to pump their own favorite game.  Those games are usually OD&D, AD&D and their neo-versions, and they'll use the same player degrading tactics that the Kool-Aid drinkers use.  But I've never seen someone pump a HippyForge game before today.

Quote from: MoriartyThere is a simmering contingent of posters at ENWorld who simply can't stand D&D3.5 and will use any opportunity to pump their own favorite game.

It is very simple. The Forge swines has EnWorld as its new target. The boards which used to be mostly about D&D will became very anti-D&D if this attack will last for longer period of time. That is classical Swinish behavior. Scout - lay eggs (mention these cool new games) - attack others on all fronts - overtake the boards moderation posts (hard but manageble) and finally wipe out the old stuff.

@admin: Feel free to move the post to the general forum.

Quote from: Settembrini@admin: Feel free to move the post to the general forum.

Will do, given that this has fuck all to do about me.

RPGPundit

Quote from: jeff37923And that could be the sad truth...

(I've been thinking a lot about common fandom behaviors lately. Its kinda depressing.)

Tell me about it. I don't think I've ever copped to this publically. . . the primary reason that I stopped roleplaying from 2002 to 2006 was fans and fandom. Specifically, I realized that there is a rather large cross-section of the hobby that I want absolutely nothing to do with. I didn't get to where James Wallis was, though I found myself quietly sympathizing with him. Frequently.

Quote from: MoriartyThere is a simmering contingent of posters at ENWorld who simply can't stand D&D3.5 and will use any opportunity to pump their own favorite game.

Like vikings, they seem to have highly organized annual raids on the ENWorld forums, as well. About a dozen infrequent posters will start several "edition wars" threads simultaneously and then sit back and fan the flames until mods tell them to cut it the fuck out.

Quote from: SettembriniFor all those types, who want to see proof of shilling and swinery:

http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=194714

That's the first time I've ever heard of someone whose stock-and-trade is D20 Supplements being called a swine.

Quote from: jdrakehTell me about it. I don't think I've ever copped to this publically. . . the primary reason that I stopped roleplaying from 2002 to 2006 was fans and fandom.

I know that feeling. I cut way back on my forum posting when I came to realize that interacting with some folks was actively degrading my enjoyment of gaming, despite that all the ranting was never echoed amongst people I actually played with.

Let's just say that's when the whole Go Play thing came along and I was very sympathetic to its message.

Quotethe ultrapopular Dogs in the Vineyard

:haw:

But moving on...

QuoteI've been on a "story games" kick lately-- Agon, Carry, Mortal Coil, and the ultrapopular Dogs in the Vineyard have been run at my wonderful FLGS-- and Dread is now on my list of things to try. The guys that work on this stuff are the ones who are really evolving the hobby.

It has really made me wonder how-- or if-- it is possible to apply some of these principles to something like d20. So I'm digging this discussion.

Is there some sort of school these people go to that teaches them to write like smarmy douche-bags?  :raise:

Fuck me!  You guys are critical.  Talk about jumping at the shadows.