What's the gaming scene like where you live? Vibrant? Dead? Somewhere in between? Full of 5e newbies? Lots of Old School? What?
Fairly varied and vibrant, if word of mouth can be trusted. I meet someone else involved in a game fairly often. But I couldn't say for sure or provide details, because it is nearly all private. Most of the public gaming is miniature war games.
Large and extremely varied (I've seen D&D 2, 3, 4 and 5, VtM, Mage, WEG Star Wars, LUG Star Trek and the new one, Battletech RPG, Shadowrun, Rifts and even a group that does nothing playtest whatever they can get ahold of.
But it's also pretty insular. There's very little gaming in public locations like game shops; it's all in people's homes. If you're in the community you can find games no problem. If you're not though it can feel like a gaming desert.
Quote from: RPGPundit;1054480What's the gaming scene like where you live? Vibrant? Dead? Somewhere in between? Full of 5e newbies? Lots of Old School? What?
My local gaming pub is usually packed. The usual Magic, The Gathering crowd, but we have a weekly X-Wing Miniatures night (which I participate in) Starfinder and Pathfinder society, we once had to split into two tables of 7 each for Starfinder.
I've seen at least one other AD&D 2nd edition group, and plenty of 5th ed, Pathfinder, misc board games, chit and counter gaming. It's a pretty excellent spot for gaming.
Quote from: RPGPundit;1054480What's the gaming scene like where you live? Vibrant? Dead? Somewhere in between? Full of 5e newbies? Lots of Old School? What?
Where I live? Mostly magic card or warhammer crap. But on YouTube/Hangouts, I can find great role-players.
London's scene is large but a mixed bag.
There are no FLGSs here. At least, not like in LA and -- I'm assuming here -- the rest of the United States. There are stores but you can't just walk in, buy some cold brew or dew and sit down to play or even reserve a table -- like wargaming nights, for instance, are specifically held by the store instead of being customer-driven.
It is a big haven for WOD, as are the rest of the major/capitol cities in Western, Northern and parts of Southern (it's massive in Italy, according to my Italian players) and Central Europe. However, until I came onto the scene, there were no tabletop clubs dedicated to WOD -- it was all LARP. Managed to fill a big niche there, attracted a lot of players into and back into the hobby, grew it pretty big.
There are a number of "clubs" (a lot of them aren't really "clubs", just bigger standard meetups) running within Zone 1-2 and more outside but -- especially outside -- the average age is up there (half will be at least 40+) and as a result, they tend to play older games (excl. D&D, that's always played regardless) which at least half of this forum hold as treasured favourites I'm sure.
Universities have a long-standing, traditional RPG culture in London. Same can be found across the UK however, particularly in Southern England -- especially South-East -- but also north of London up-to and including the Midlands. A LOT of gamers got into RPGs through a student society at uni and continue to play with their mates from uni or have sorted themselves out other groups from there.
In terms of players, it's wide and diverse. Dozens of different nationalities can be found in the player base; ethnicity-wise, when I started I wasn't the only minority present at least half the time -- yay, progress! -- and its continued to gradually get better on that front.
All this said, much of the gaming in London is still very much in peoples houses and flats. It's a thing where people will just put out an lfg or lfp and will straight-up have people come to their house. Bit weird and I imagine more than a bit dangerous for anyone who's not a 6'6" male like myself. A lot of the people hosting the games though that put out calls usually are based in more "leafy" parts of the capitol -- Islington and Camden, for instance -- so swings-and-roundabouts.
And for the American grognards on this forum, you'll be pleased to know that the British grognards are also quite grognard-y, with their own particularly quaint yet punk feel as is the British way! (thank God I wasn't around in the Thatcher era... though I am a product of the Blairites era... uhhh...)
Portland, Oregon.
Rampant, full of 5e newbies on both sides of the screen. Lots of Adventure Leaguers. Meetups with social justice / D&D crossover themes like "5e for The Marginalized Minority Of The Week".
Also lots of Magic games, often on weeknights at local bars.
Vibrant and full of 5e newbies!
Quote from: PrometheanVigil;1054541All this said, much of the gaming in London is still very much in peoples houses and flats.
I recently had a young lady contact me out of the blue and ask me to run preferably-non-fantasy for her and her friends at my flat. Ran White Star for a couple months which was fun but not all her mates were as committed as she was so I decided to wrap it after a couple cancellations. It helped I could find out a bit about her before the first session, I imagine if a 6'6" guy with prison tats had made the same request my response would have been different! :)
Re player age and D&D in London - with so many new players joining, it has been going down for years, so you get age 40+ grognards like me plus a lot of players in their early 20s. Typically most of the players in my games are ca 20-25, but there's almost always some older players too so I don't feel odd (yet!).
Re ethnicity, while there are a lot of French, German etc players, there are REALLY a lot of Spanish players. RPGs seem to be huge in Spain.
Alive with 5E newbies, Pathfinder 2E playtest, and old folks like me.
Recent events listed in this thread. (https://www.therpgsite.com/showthread.php?39135-GEEK-Is-Now-Helping-With-A-Convention)
Mostly MtG and Pokemon for CCGs. Warhammer and the up-and-coming Gundam Build Fighting wargame for the lead pushers. RPGs are dominated by D&D 5E Organized Play, with smaller Organized Play groups fighting for leftover scraps. It ain't dead, that is for sure.
The gaming scene in my area is excellent. It consists of my lounge room, and a bunch of friends, as it pretty much has for about 30 years. I get to run whatever the fuck I want, and occasionally someone else in the group really wants to run something, so they get to do that too! It's awesome.
Apparently, there are cons and game stores and stuff, but I wouldn't really know anything about that.
Doing fairly well it seems. Both RPGs and LARPs. Though one of the biggest LARPs local has been on hiatus for a while. One that annually held a week long LARP event. The local Vampire LARP seems to have puttered out.
Seems pretty healthy, always see good mix of RPGers, boardgamers and wargammers whenever I am at the game store.
Full of 5e newbies. Game stores are filthy with them. In a good way. Highly enthusiastic mostly younger crowd, including middle school and high school students, flocking to learn how to play.
Seattle Metro area, East of the puddle.
There are a lot of nerds here that like a bunch of dumb shit but some okay shit too. Bottom line there will be someone just as dysfunctional and available as you to play whatever sort of play-pretend game you want to.
Plenty of gaming venues to sit down and eat/drink/play; AFK Tavern, Moxx, etc. on top of several Uncle's games, Card Kingdom, etc. although our local mom'n'pop stores never seem to last longer than two or three years, probably in part because it's just plain expensive as shit to rent space here.
Definitely a very heavy storygame presence, anecdotally. And lots of people who are overly fond of their personal political agendas. Plenty of Magic players and wargamers, even if I'm not a part of either crowd.
Pretty much 5e for role playing. Lots of magic and a little warhammer. Some small groups for other rpg groups. Seems WOTC owns store/organized play around here.
Quote from: PrometheanVigil;1054541London's scene is large but a mixed bag.
Is the Orc's Nest still around? At least I think that's what it was called, if I'm remembering correctly. It was near the British Museum back when I lived there. Again, if I remember correctly, on the same little road as Atlantis Bookshop (one of the best occult bookstores around).
Quote from: RPGPundit;1054963Is the Orc's Nest still around? At least I think that's what it was called, if I'm remembering correctly. It was near the British Museum back when I lived there. Again, if I remember correctly, on the same little road as Atlantis Bookshop (one of the best occult bookstores around).
Orc's Nest by Seven Dials is still going strong. I like having enough money to buy the painted minis in the shop window. A child's dream come true. :D
(But Playing Games by the British Museum closed about 10 years ago).
Quote from: RPGPundit;1054963Is the Orc's Nest still around? At least I think that's what it was called, if I'm remembering correctly. It was near the British Museum back when I lived there. Again, if I remember correctly, on the same little road as Atlantis Bookshop (one of the best occult bookstores around).
Yep. I love getting the plastic bags from the place -- they're like little bags of nostalgia, hah hah. I recommend Orbital Comics as well, gotten my copies of American Vampire from there plus a few other things from Vertigo.
Quote from: S'mon;1054979Orc's Nest by Seven Dials is still going strong. I like having enough money to buy the painted minis in the shop window. A child's dream come true. :D
(But Playing Games by the British Museum closed about 10 years ago).
Had a brief chat with the guy who runs the place last time I bought something from there -- think it was a hardcover of SLA Industries, found it behind some other RPGs. Nice bloke. Happy to hear he's still doing fairly well out of the tabletop business, especially with what must be an extortionate rent and with people buying all their stuff online. Another reason to support your local gaming store instead of a corporate monolith that just so happens to sell the same products!
RPGs and boardgames here in Brisbane, Queensland, Australia are doing very well.
Quite a few stores and seem to be doing ok. I notice most of the gaming stores have tables and facilities for people to use.
I mostly run and play DnD 5e, as it's easily accessible, easy to get players for and easy to drop in and out as you feel like.
I help out run a dedicated open table 5e DnD club fortnightly with a friend in a local library and it does well.
We usually get 15 to 20+ people coming regularly.
I also run another fortnightly gaming club that supports any RPGs and boardgames. Currently that's about a 70/30 mix of RPGs vs Boardgames, although the evenings fluctuate. I Usually get similar sort of numbers.
There's a fair few "Mini conventions" that run throughout the year too for boardgames and RPGs, although my personal experience is there's usually some political agenda (usually left and/or far left politics) being pushed at these things here a fair bit, so I don't tend to go to those.
I just don't want to see politics at all at gaming conventions.
I recently moved (locally) and now have a dedicated gaming room again, so intend to do more gaming nights at my place where I'll run Stars without number and play CoC 7th Ed and whatever else people will run.
Seoul Expat RPGs seems to be trucking along about the same as it ever was. 5ed is popular but not seeing a lot of 5ed fueled growth, but that's probably because Korean expats in general are getting fewer and older on average as the English teaching boom years are long gone now.
In spite of having no gaming stores per se in the whole country, the state of the hobby here in Uruguay is remarkably strong.
In Atlanta, pretty dreadful. It's all 5e and mostly adventurer's league stuff. I tried joining a weekly pub game and they were a nice enough crowd, but I really disliked the game. I do get to play in a DCC game about once a month, so that's fun, but haven't found anything else so I'm dependent on Roll20.
Sadly, here in OKC we have been reduced to 1 LGS, and while it does a brisk business, the crowd is largely Pathfinder and 5E. I am playing 5E in a group from work, but want to play other systems. I generally prefer to run in Hero System, but also would run 1E AD&D, and have put up flyers to that effect, but no bites. Pretty much, they play whatever the current trend is and that is all.
Yesterday, I went to Madness, the biggest game store in all of Dallas. Their RPG section has shrunk again and is now 1/2 of one aisle. They literally have more shelf space devoted to Funko Pops! than all RPGs combined (and that includes the SW RPGs). Less than 10 years ago, their RPG section was almost 1/3rd of the store.
I just wanted to quote this post for posterity. Because it's one of my favorite posts ever.
Quote from: FrankTrollmanNow, 5th edition is seemingly tanking much harder than 4th edition did. With 4th edition, it was the heir apparent, and on release prophetic people like myself were loan voices in the wilderness when we said that 4th edition was going to fail to be the #1 role playing game. We weren't even saying it was going to get canceled early, just that it was going to fail to be #1. With 5e, I don't think anyone is seriously suggesting that it's going to unseat Pathfinder as the #1 game, the only question is whether it's going to run a full three years. Signs are pointing to no at this time, what with the fact that there's nothing on the production schedule and the DMG is delayed.
That, and this one:
Quote from: FrankTrollmanSo I've stated that 5e is Vaporware. I'm pretty sure of it. The more of the release teasers I see, the more convinced I am. But I get questions like this:
Quote from: BearsAreBrownMaybe I'm less experienced or maybe I'm less jaded, but Frank, why are you so sure about all this? You seem to be extrapolating heavily from a few paragraphs of text. Are the drawing from some source material I'm unaware of?
And yeah, that's reasonable. Why should you be convinced that 5e D&D is a Vaporware Product? It goes to who is making it, what they've said about what they are making, what they've made recently and in the past, and so on.
First, let's look at the track record of Mike Mearls. Remember when he fixed Skill Challenges? Sorry, remember the first seven times that he announced that he was fixing skill challenges? Remember Iron Heroes? The man has a history, going back several years and literally dozens of instances, of announcing with great fanfare that he was going to make a new subsystem, then announcing the subsystem was ready for publication, then announcing that criticism of that subsystem was unfair because it "wasn't really finished" and he was "working on something new and exciting".
Fool me once, shame on me, fool me twenty eight times, what the fucking fuck?
Now 5th edition is supposed to be layer upon layer of Mike Mearls blessed subsystem. Each one done up to the specifications of a different section of the fanbase. Each one interacting in some odd way with all the others, but every one of them optional. So, for example: if you make a cogent condemnation of the way they track movement or durations or whatever, they can claim openly that this version is "not for you" and is nebulously for some other group and obviously you should be using some other movement or duration tracking subsystem instead.
They have announced a platform that is perfectly suited for denial in depth of non-functionality. In order to show that there is a problem to the satisfaction of their ability to not simply dismiss it for you supposedly not being the target audience, you'd have to do each separate variant together. And then they could dismiss your complaint for being TL;DR.
In short: they've made an edition that would take months or years to expose as vaporware and the project leader is a man who has made nothing but vaporware since Kerry was running for president. And his second in command is a man who hired out his name to promote that guy's actual Vaporware in 2005. Remember: it was originally called "Monte Cook Presents: Iron Heroes" when it was originally released and sold for real money despite the fact that none of the subsystems worked properly and even Mike Mearls admitted that the magic system was just a draft taken from a brainstorming session. The number three guy is Bruce Cordell, who apparently didn't read any of the rules or setting material for 4th edition before writing rules and setting material for 4th edition. In short: a man whose design work has been literally monkeys on typewriters style vaporware paycheck writing for at least four years.
So the entire core group of authors have a clearly demonstrated history of making vaporware, and the hype is completely consistent with and even suggests a vaporware product. But how do we know that this is actually vaporware? Well, there are clues.
- Let's talk about they admit they haven't done: higher levels and hard numbers. That's... the entire design. It's a level based system, therefore if you haven't tested the leveling or the system, you haven't actually done anything. They are already putting up sign-ups for beta testers, but their actual product has been admitted to being in a pre-alpha state.
- Now let's talk about the things they've promised. They have promised that a character who gets pure numbers will be balanced with a character who gets abilities instead. We already know that's impossible, because we've played BESM and Champions. So we know we're being promised things that we know can't be implemented. Either they know that they can't really deliver and are jerking our chain because it's Vaporware, or they haven't actually gotten far enough down the design rabbit hole to recognize that fact, because it is fucking Vaporware.
- Now let's talk about the things they've actually shown people: Magical Teaparty. MTP, all the way down. The actions people took at the D&DXP were not on the character sheets, the DMs did not have DC charts. The DMs used their judgment to determine whether actions succeeded or failed. The actual game system, if there was one, was not used.
Now let's get into the "how did we get to this point?" part. In short: job security. WotC has held Christmas Layoffs every year (except last year, when the layoffs were in early Summer) for as long as they have been owned by Hasbro. The head of 4th edition D&D has been fired every year since 4th edition D&D was created. It's entirely possible that the people left at WotC believe that the only way they can keep their jobs is by releasing a faulty product that needs to be patched so that they will be retained. It's possible that they believe that their jobs are completely unrelated to their performance and that they will probably have to go look for work in the near future and are simply phoning it in.
Regardless of the motivations on the ground, it is clear that having an office filled entirely with new blood means that there is no process. There are no working relationships or project schedules, because heads roll too often for a corporate culture to actually show up. A half-assed, overly ambitious project is probably inevitable with a core set of demoralized hacks who are already looking for a new job leading a group of untested fanboys who don't know what they are doing.
But the promises being made for 5e are on the face of it absurd, the people in charge have a long and storied history of booting projects out the door in a totally nonfunctional state, they lack enough confidence in their mechanics to actually use them, and they've admitted that they haven't even tried to do so in-house. This is what Vaporware looks like.
-Frank
Just so precious.
(https://charts.camelcamelcamel.com/us/0786965606/sales-rank.png)
Quote from: Mistwell;1055741I just wanted to quote this post for posterity. Because it's one of my favorite posts ever.
That, and this one:
Just so precious.
(https://charts.camelcamelcamel.com/us/0786965606/sales-rank.png)
So the state of the hobby in your neck of the woods is that you are experiencing schedenfreude over something posted by a guy who isn't even here any more? That axe must be razor sharp after being ground for so long.
Quote from: jeff37923;1055772So the state of the hobby in your neck of the woods is that you are experiencing schedenfreude over something posted by a guy who isn't even here any more? That axe must be razor sharp after being ground for so long.
I literally had my pointer hovering over the report button for the obvious shitpost earlier today. It's cross-posted from rival forum tgdmb.com from a completely unrelated thread on that site -- had happened to see it minutes earlier. But I'd like to see first how Pundit feels about posts like that, then I'll know what to report going forward, hehehe...
I'm going back and forth.
Maybe you all want to call me crazy. I'm a what you would call a SJW... if being a SJW means that I want EVERY human being on this planet to be treated with respect. I Will fight for that. That's my definition of a SJW.
I don't necessary think ACKS as a game system is fundamentally against my personal views. And OMG, it is the game I want to run. I consider it one of the best OSR games in existence... and quite possibly (of all the OSR games) the closest to the OD&D style game play. But there seems to be a lot of negative connotations to this game. I disagree, politically, with the author of ACKS, but I still think its the best game for my campaign.
Just curious, is anyone else running ACKS? Are you dealing with any weirdness as a result of running the game?
Quote from: fixable;1055782I'm a what you would call a SJW... if being a SJW means that I want EVERY human being on this planet to be treated with respect. I Will fight for that. That's my definition of a SJW.
That's our definition of Classical Liberal, which most of us are at least to a large extent. As is Milo fwiw.
I own ACKS but have not run an ACKS game. I would not expect it to raise any issues, and would be happy to expel anyone who objected. There is no politics in the game and you would have to be a hardcore SJW/RPGnet reader to think of objecting to it. Anyone thinking of conflating it with actual-horrible-games like FATAL or RAHOWA gets bumped.
I disagree with Pundit on a lot of things, being very left of centre on domestic economic policy but I still like Lion & Dragon and I totally agree that ACKS is one of the best incarnations of D&D period.
There is nothing objectionable about the game within the rules themselves, so why would anybody give you weirdness about playing it.
If they should do, ask them if they consume Nestle products or shop at Walmart or Amazon.;)
You could even ask if they had bought clothes from Gap and if they say yes, then ask them to justify facilitating child labour.
If they give you shit about ACKS' authors' Libertarian politics ask them to inform themselves about the politics of the CEO of Wholefoods, John Mackey.
And while they are at it, tell them that they are under investigation for 45 violations of federal labor law, including physically threatening immigrant workers in California who were trying to form a union.
Quote from: fixable;1055782Maybe you all want to call me crazy. I'm a what you would call a SJW... if being a SJW means that I want EVERY human being on this planet to be treated with respect. I Will fight for that. That's my definition of a SJW.
Quote from: S'mon;1055793That's our definition of Classical Liberal, which most of us are at least to a large extent.
Yeah, that sounds more like a Classic Liberal to me also.
I'm more of a Heinlein Libertarian and honestly do not care how you sort yourself, as long as you do not act like an asshole about it.
(Yes, yes I know. The Gall of Me saying that. Yet have you noticed that I'm only an asshole to those that are an asshole to me first?)
Not even twelve hours later after hitting the hay and there's already MORE mentions of SJW/OSR politics.... ah fuck it, it's TheRPGSite, of course that would happen.
Quote from: jeff37923;1055812(Yes, yes I know. The Gall of Me saying that. Yet have you noticed that I'm only an asshole to those that are an asshole to me first?)
One of the beautiful I've started to appreciate while I'm here in LA (and CA as a whole -- maybe it's different in other states?) is how polite people are here. And other than simple manners (which compared to the UK are in abundance!), as far as I can tell its because there's the very real chance if you act an ass or decide to lose your mind on someone, there's a very real possibility that you'll just get a slug put through your head. It's a pretty effective antidote to human nature, I think.
Ah, and for you Jeff, I'm sure you'll appreciate the message of this video, your being a self-confessed asshole to other assholes. I remember seeing this back in uni years ago. I like to think of it as the "Concealed Carry Philosophy". (Now, I
am sharing with you and this site some Black Culture, so just making sure that's clear and respect is maintained)
[video=youtube;_Fzq2YXhuLk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Fzq2YXhuLk[/youtube]
Quote from: fixable;1055782I'm a what you would call a SJW... if being a SJW means that I want EVERY human being on this planet to be treated with respect. I Will fight for that. That's my definition of a SJW.
If you believe that every human being deserves to treated with respect
just because they are an individual human being, that's not what I'd call a SJW (and not what I've heard any other self-proclaimed SJW's believe). Rather, other SJWs appear to believe that some human
groups on this planet should be treated with respect (groups based on arbitrary lines drawn between different skin colors , genders, etc.) and that others should not.
Quote from: PrometheanVigil;1055850One of the beautiful I've started to appreciate while I'm here in LA (and CA as a whole -- maybe it's different in other states?) is how polite people are here. And other than simple manners (which compared to the UK are in abundance!), as far as I can tell its because there's the very real chance if you act an ass or decide to lose your mind on someone, there's a very real possibility that you'll just get a slug put through your head. It's a pretty effective antidote to human nature, I think.
Robert E. Howard agrees!
Quote from: REHCivilized men are more discourteous than savages because they know they can be impolite without having their skulls split, as a general thing.
Let's be sure to keep this on the subject of the RPG hobby!
Quote from: RPGPundit;1054480What's the gaming scene like where you live? Vibrant? Dead? Somewhere in between? Full of 5e newbies? Lots of Old School? What?
Quite vibrant, from what I've seen.
In Birmingham, UK, we have a couple of Games Stores (Wayland's Forge, Forbidden Planet), a twice-yearly convention (Spaghetti Conjunction), a gamers' cafe (Geek Retreat), a few RPG clubs and a smoking RQ Group. I know of probably 20 people who play RPGs in the Birmingham area, that doesn't sound much, but I probably only know a handful of people in the area outside work and RPGing.
Quote from: jeff37923;1055772So the state of the hobby in your neck of the woods is that you are experiencing schedenfreude over something posted by a guy who isn't even here any more? That axe must be razor sharp after being ground for so long.
I already answered that part of the topic. I didn't want to start a brand new thread to engage in schedenfreude, so I thought this spot was fine. He's a poster here, and has said the same things here, and it was a prediction about what he thought the state of the hobby would be in a post-5e world that we've arrived at now and are discussing in this thread. Wasn't sure where to put it really. Sorry if it distracts from the topic. Happy to erase it if it bugs people. Then you (as in the collective you) can go back to discussing SJW and classic liberals...in a topic about the state of the hobby in your neck of the woods.
Quote from: Mistwell;1056131I already answered that part of the topic. I didn't want to start a brand new thread to engage in schedenfreude, so I thought this spot was fine. He's a poster here, and has said the same things here, and it was a prediction about what he thought the state of the hobby would be in a post-5e world that we've arrived at now and are discussing in this thread. Wasn't sure where to put it really. Sorry if it distracts from the topic. Happy to erase it if it bugs people. Then you (as in the collective you) can go back to discussing SJW and classic liberals...in a topic about the state of the hobby in your neck of the woods.
OK, you got your dig in on FrankTrollman and The Gaming Den, you proved them wrong.
My question for you is, when has FrankTrollman and The Gaming Den ever been right?
Here in Columbus The Guardtower opened second location in the suburbs, bringing the number of game stores to a dozen or so. From what I have noticed about other cities, Columbus is some sort of mecca for game shops. 5th Edition is by far the most popular RPG, Warhammer 40k is very popular, Magic is everywhere, there are a couple DCC RPG weekly's at game stores. Lots of people playing RPGs that don't fit the stereotype, which is nice. I keep getting invited to play in groups from people I have passing acquaintances with after they find out I game, which sucks because I always have a scheduling conflict. Although it is nice to know that once I quit my job, I'll have lots of gaming options!
Quote from: jeff37923;1056169OK, you got your dig in on FrankTrollman and The Gaming Den, you proved them wrong. My question for you is, when has FrankTrollman and The Gaming Den ever been right?
LOL touche.
This is all interesting to me in the sense that I think in North America (and maybe England) the vibrancy of local gaming communities seems very dependent on the condition of Local Gaming Stores.
Whereas in places where the hobby emerged without the availability of Local Gaming Stores, the gaming community doesn't depend on them.
Quote from: RPGPundit;1056444This is all interesting to me in the sense that I think in North America (and maybe England) the vibrancy of local gaming communities seems very dependent on the condition of Local Gaming Stores.
Not in London, no. We typically play in pubs, & the two real gaming stores in all of London are not particularly important. They're not gathering or social spaces. At most they're places where newbies can be told what D&D books to buy.
Maybe in the North where land is cheaper and the bar culture is less conducive to playing games than in southern English pubs, the FLGS may be more important. There is a bit of that in Edinburgh. I might run a D&D game in a Sheffield pub, but any further north (Newcastle/north-east England, Scotland, Northern Ireland) I don't think the culture would be conducive, it's closer to US bar culture.
Quote from: RPGPundit;1056444This is all interesting to me in the sense that I think in North America (and maybe England) the vibrancy of local gaming communities seems very dependent on the condition of Local Gaming Stores.
Where I live, which has quite a few retail game stores, there is also a new phenomena of Game Cafes. Which are businesses that provide food and beverages and tables, and some of them rent games, but they don't
sell games. While there are several of these cafes here, I've only been to one and it was nice; much nicer than playing in a game store. And it was packed with people of all ages and backgrounds playing RPGs, boardgames, and CCGs. And there were some (not many) people who were just there to hang out with their friends and talk over coffee and empanadas (this particular store makes and sells empanadas), but they may have just been waiting on more people to show up before playing a game.
In my lifetime, right now is the best time period for playing RPGs. Not only is it easier than ever to find people to play games with, but it's a lot easier to find decent people to play games with. Socially terrible body odor dorks are out, regularly showering normies are in.
However! People don't seem to play a range of games here. 5th Edition, Pathfinder, and Fate seem to be the go-to RPGs. Warhammer is by far the main army game (not surprising). Back in the day, Vampire and Rifts were really popular, but no one plays either of them anymore. While Magic used to be the moneymaker for game stores, boardgames seem to have eclipsed CCGs. In my last post on this thread, I mentioned that one of the game stores here opened a second location; the second location sells mainly boardgames, Warhammer, and various minis and paint. But the boardgames fill the most shelves. RPGs were only on one shelf that I remember, and that was mostly 5th edition and Pathfinder. I asked if they could get DCC RPG dice sets and was told that their distributor doesn't carry them. I was deeply saddened by that news.
So I guess while the tabletop gaming hobby is active and healthy, it is also changing.
Quote from: RPGPundit;1056444This is all interesting to me in the sense that I think in North America (and maybe England) the vibrancy of local gaming communities seems very dependent on the condition of Local Gaming Stores.
Whereas in places where the hobby emerged without the availability of Local Gaming Stores, the gaming community doesn't depend on them.
Agreed with S'mon here, 'cept my perspective is even stronger as stated below.
The South American continent and the African continent have a Southern culture so any RPGs that grow there is going to be homegrown and based on imports, that's why (I mean hell, you've gone on at length about that partially before, specifically with Uruguay obvs). The USA has a very well-ingrained gaming culture, it is the fatherland for all nerds, even in the UK we do take after the USA in gaming tastes (even if we won't admit it) although it's the other way 'round when it comes to Warhammer since it was born here. Tangentially, they don't have the Games Workshop in Covent Garden anymore -- they've done up the one on Tottenham Court Road though.
Quote from: S'mon;1056451Not in London, no. We typically play in pubs, & the two real gaming stores in all of London are not particularly important. They're not gathering or social spaces. At most they're places where newbies can be told what D&D books to buy.
Maybe in the North where land is cheaper and the bar culture is less conducive to playing games than in southern English pubs, the FLGS may be more important. There is a bit of that in Edinburgh. I might run a D&D game in a Sheffield pub, but any further north (Newcastle/north-east England, Scotland, Northern Ireland) I don't think the culture would be conducive, it's closer to US bar culture.
Pub gaming is generally crap in the UK, it was the #2 biggest reason LDRC did so well (#1 was consistent, regular games). They're noisy, crowded and the people are nosy and are not gamers generally -- and of course, there's booze, which magnifies every other problem ten times over. It's shame because pubs towards Kent and Essex are some of the nicest ones you'll visit, they way they are now is quite close to your traditional D&D tavern 'cept without errant drunken magic missiles. There are board game cafes but they are generally strictly board games (and are usually quite casual -- so I'm told, my only TT hobby is RPGs) are cozy/hipster places than somewhere serious gaming happens. I've already gone over the others potential venues in my previous post but other than that, I'm with you on this one S'mon.
Quote from: everloss;1056501So I guess while the tabletop gaming hobby is active and healthy, it is also changing.
CCGs have always had a weird history. They've been massive money makers but then they have huge fall-offs because they're marketed to kids up to teens. Warhammer has always been fairly consistent, not as much as CCGs but enough to operate dozens of stores and franchise them -- it helps that they're marketed to teens and young adults who actually have the cash to spend.
Quote from: PrometheanVigil;1056514Pub gaming is generally crap in the UK, it was the #2 biggest reason LDRC did so well (#1 was consistent, regular games). They're noisy, crowded and the people are nosy and are not gamers generally
Well, obviously I have the pub give me a dedicated function room for my Meetup, I'm hardly going to be in there gaming alongside the hoi poloi right? :D
Seriously, many pubs have decent to great function rooms they are happy to let an RPG group book out for free. And even without booking, it's been many years since I've played with nosy drunks looking over my shoulder. Basically there are so many hipsters now, the idea of pub gaming isn't unusual at all. Often when I play on a weekday evening - when I don't book the room out since it's just my group - there are one or two unrelated games going on in the function room, and gamers are the only people there. Usually RPGs not board games, too.
Quote from: S'mon;1056525Well, obviously I have the pub give me a dedicated function room for my Meetup, I'm hardly going to be in there gaming alongside the hoi poloi right? :D
Seriously, many pubs have decent to great function rooms they are happy to let an RPG group book out for free. And even without booking, it's been many years since I've played with nosy drunks looking over my shoulder. Basically there are so many hipsters now, the idea of pub gaming isn't unusual at all. Often when I play on a weekday evening - when I don't book the room out since it's just my group - there are one or two unrelated games going on in the function room, and gamers are the only people there. Usually RPGs not board games, too.
Now I know that's not true at all because I've done the business side of running a club (and mannn, I was naive way back when to how shady people are in venue procurement). You are not finding a function room for free in central London (Z1-2) without heavy stipulations: you have to move on command (no reason needed because you're not paying), you need to make sure everyone is buying profit-margin items (especially booze, also food), you cannot be "loud" or "obnoxious" (that was fun to hear from a middle-aged landlord as a not-even-20yr old back in the day), blah blah blah. And that's if they're even willing to CONSIDER it -- I know some groups have done that mess, it's usually gone left (ED: it
always goes left) and they've usually had to move venue at least once. On top of that, function rooms almost always are crap (too small, too old, they have a bar in there, they smell etc...).
In fact, what you're saying sounds kinda suspect. Not in an actual suspect way but in a "I feel like I know what group you're part of".
Quote from: PrometheanVigil;1056533Now I know that's not true at all because I've done the business side of running a club (and mannn, I was naive way back when to how shady people are in venue procurement). You are not finding a function room for free in central London (Z1-2) without heavy stipulations: you have to move on command (no reason needed because you're not paying), you need to make sure everyone is buying profit-margin items (especially booze, also food), you cannot be "loud" or "obnoxious" (that was fun to hear from a middle-aged landlord as a not-even-20yr old back in the day), blah blah blah. And that's if they're even willing to CONSIDER it -- I know some groups have done that mess, it's usually gone left (ED: it always goes left) and they've usually had to move venue at least once. On top of that, function rooms almost always are crap (too small, too old, they have a bar in there, they smell etc...).
In fact, what you're saying sounds kinda suspect. Not in an actual suspect way but in a "I feel like I know what group you're part of".
The pub is in Borough high street, Borough being quite an RPG/D&D Mecca. We occasionally have issues when they get a new landlord but nothing serious. Obviously if there's a big World Cup match on that day we don't play. My Meetup runs Sunday lunchtime when things are nice and quiet. We've never turned up and been kicked out by pub staff, but one time a guy with a Star Wars LARP persuaded us (falsely) that he had booked the room and managed to get us to move upstairs (which was ok). Twice since founding my Meetup at the start of this year when we were booking on days with big football matches I have been required to guarantee a minimum spend and provide credit card details, but I have never had to pay over any money, and don't intend to.
The function room is in a cellar but otherwise pretty nice, and does not smell.
Quote from: S'mon;1056583The pub is in Borough high street, Borough being quite an RPG/D&D Mecca. We occasionally have issues when they get a new landlord but nothing serious. Obviously if there's a big World Cup match on that day we don't play. My Meetup runs Sunday lunchtime when things are nice and quiet. We've never turned up and been kicked out by pub staff, but one time a guy with a Star Wars LARP persuaded us (falsely) that he had booked the room and managed to get us to move upstairs (which was ok). Twice since founding my Meetup at the start of this year when we were booking on days with big football matches I have been required to guarantee a minimum spend and provide credit card details, but I have never had to pay over any money, and don't intend to.
The function room is in a cellar but otherwise pretty nice, and does not smell.
Hah hah, if you mean the London Bridge side of the high street, you did well and may the God-Emperor protect you and your spot. Otherwise... that's not really central London, too suburb-y (and I've done game in Elephant & Castle and that's not really proper central London either). Then again, my members were spoiled from day one because they got to game in Camden Town (and latter Tottenham Court Road) so they had every amenity there for them, hah hah. I used to have to tell them to pick up their Starbucks and Cafe Nero frapp cups, especially when they'd do a snack/drink run for the table!
The fact that you can't play if there's a World Cup match, again, is a reason I just cut pubs and bars straight out of consideration. And I'm sure you know it doesn't matter if you don't intend to spend: as soon as you hand over your details, expect to be charged (even if you're not that booking). And since you're running on the same day I used to host LDRC, if you ever need a suggestion for a place, I can send you a few places you'd probably like (they're room rentals, mind, but nice modern ones).
Quote from: PrometheanVigil;1056689Hah hah, if you mean the London Bridge side of the high street
Yes, it's within the area that got cordoned off after the ISIS terrorist attack; just south of Borough market.
Of course today would be the day (evening) my group got told to leave the cellar because they had it booked out! :) And no Reserved notices. But we played upstairs at the back ok.
>>as soon as you hand over your details, expect to be charged<<
Well I haven't been charged the two times I did give details. My players were really good about spending lots of money to meet the target.
>>if you ever need a suggestion for a place, I can send you a few places you'd probably like (they're room rentals, mind, but nice modern ones)<<
I don't charge for my Meetup so there's no money for renting stuff, but thanks.
Quote from: RPGPundit;1056444This is all interesting to me in the sense that I think in North America (and maybe England) the vibrancy of local gaming communities seems very dependent on the condition of Local Gaming Stores.
Whereas in places where the hobby emerged without the availability of Local Gaming Stores, the gaming community doesn't depend on them.
I think vibrancy is not dependent upon the stores in most places. North America is a big place, most of which does not have gaming stores, and even more of which doesn't have gaming stores that handle many games.
Vibrancy is dependent upon local GMs, which can be a crap shoot in any given area.
I live in a tiny little town in central California. It's one of those places where it seems like everyone HAS played but no one IS playing. At least as far as RPGs go. But I might just not be seeing it.
MtG is pretty popular out here, and I think there is a Warhammer 40k community nearby, but it's not really my scene, so u cant tell if it's a big community or a small one.
Quote from: James;1056887I live in a tiny little town in central California. It's one of those places where it seems like everyone HAS played but no one IS playing. At least as far as RPGs go. But I might just not be seeing it.
MtG is pretty popular out here, and I think there is a Warhammer 40k community nearby, but it's not really my scene, so u cant tell if it's a big community or a small one.
Welcome to the RPGsite! As I'm sure you know, we are a lovely bunch here. :D
With FLGSes disappearing, and D&D becoming mainstream-popular again, I wonder if the nature of how the hobby comes together will change now in North America.
This may not be on topic anymore. But I just wanted to apologize for my post earlier in this thread. I was ranting and probably a little drunk at the time. I appreciate that I didn't get a (in my mind deserved) GTFO response, but instead got some insightful responses.
I strive to be inclusive and open with players in the games I run. Especially since I've started running games on Meetup. Everyone is welcome at my table so far as they are not a**holes to others. I don't think it matters what game you play, the conduct you execute at the table is what matters.
I've always thought that once you buy an RPG book and run it, that RPG no longer belongs to the author; it belongs to the DM and the players at the table. You make the game what you want it to be (not that ACKS makes it hard... you are all correct: there is nothing subversive in the game, if anything ACKS' art is more diverse in terms of gender and ethnicity than many other games out there). I've lost sight of that. I guess my frustration was from other forums basically implying that I'm a nazi for liking a certain game.
But to actually answer the OP...
Gaming in my life has its ups and downs. I've brought D&D to a number of people in my building (running 5E with the Intro to the Borderlands book by Goodman Games). I have a long term ACKS game that has been on hiatus due to distance (and an unwillingness to play online) and I have another long term 5E game that has been interrupted by my vacationing.
I've become an organizer for a local Meetup and I've posted games there that have had very healthy responses. I've been letting my gaming get a little bit out of control, so my current plan is to standardize all my games to one system one campaign and just run that for everyone. Right now, I have about 4 groups with 2-3 committed players each... I'm trying to get that to one group with 12 committed players, instead.
Wish me luck.
Quote from: fixable;1058153I've become an organizer for a local Meetup and I've posted games there that have had very healthy responses. I've been letting my gaming get a little bit out of control, so my current plan is to standardize all my games to one system one campaign and just run that for everyone. Right now, I have about 4 groups with 2-3 committed players each... I'm trying to get that to one group with 12 committed players, instead.
Wish me luck.
Good luck! I definitely found it much easier when I switched from running ca 4 different campaigns with different rulesets, to running the one* campaign (Wilderlands with Stonehell Dungeon) for a bunch of different but overlapping player groups. Using the megadungeon format I don't need players to be committed, either, and scheduling a game as a Meetup event ensures lots of demand.
*OK I do still have a Forgotten Realms PBP on the side. :)