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The New PHB is Morbidly Obese

Started by RPGPundit, June 20, 2024, 11:36:37 AM

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RPGPundit

June 20, 2024, 11:36:37 AM
The latest news about the new #Onednd Players Handbook makes it clear that it will be full of bloated rules additions that will only ruin the premise of #dnd5e game design.
#dnd #ttrpg #osr


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LouProsperi

#1
June 20, 2024, 05:08:19 PM
Hello,

Based on this article on D&D Beyond, most of the Weapon Mastery properties in the new PHB are more like the example you cited from DCC than just physical maneuvers:

https://www.dndbeyond.com/posts/1742-your-guide-to-weapon-mastery-in-the-2024-players

Granted, a couple of them (Push in particular) do seem to be little more than physical maneuvers that anyone should be able to attempt, but it looks most of them are cool bonus things that can happen under specific circumstances.

The question of "system mastery" is a tough one. On the one hand from a pure game play standpoint it's good to reward players as they learn and understand the intricacies of the game system, but clearly some games and some editions of D&D have gone too far.


Take Care,

Lou Prosperi

Brigman

#2
June 21, 2024, 12:59:25 AM
I'm so not interested in buying this drek.

My main group really loves 5e, and I like running it.  I've gotten them to try out Lion & Dragon and ICONS, too. 

But I have no desire or interest in switching/updating my 5e Saltmarsh game to this. 
PEACE!
- Brigs

Man at Arms

#3
June 21, 2024, 02:54:17 AM
Quote from: Brigman on June 21, 2024, 12:59:25 AMI'm so not interested in buying this drek.

My main group really loves 5e, and I like running it.  I've gotten them to try out Lion & Dragon and ICONS, too. 

But I have no desire or interest in switching/updating my 5e Saltmarsh game to this. 

Well, put a few of the earlier books on the table; and tell everyone that you'll run that, but nothing after that.  It has to be in your books, that you already own.

Or they can give your preferred alternative system a chance.....

Brigman

#4
June 21, 2024, 12:11:43 PM
Yeah, they've been good sports about trying new systems, and loved both ICONS and Lion & Dragon.  I think after 2 years of play, they're attached to their 5e Saltmarsh characters & that campaign; but I don't plan to overhaul everything just because WoTC decided they want more money and wanna cram an agenda down our throats. 

Two games I definitely want to try with them are Gamma World (or Mutant Future) and Baptism of Fire!
PEACE!
- Brigs

RPGPundit

#5
June 24, 2024, 08:02:49 PM
Quote from: Brigman on June 21, 2024, 12:11:43 PMYeah, they've been good sports about trying new systems, and loved both ICONS and Lion & Dragon.  I think after 2 years of play, they're attached to their 5e Saltmarsh characters & that campaign; but I don't plan to overhaul everything just because WoTC decided they want more money and wanna cram an agenda down our throats. 

Two games I definitely want to try with them are Gamma World (or Mutant Future) and Baptism of Fire!

Awesome!
LION & DRAGON: Medieval-Authentic OSR Roleplaying is available now! You only THINK you\'ve played \'medieval fantasy\' until you play L&D.


My Blog:  http://therpgpundit.blogspot.com/
The most famous uruguayan gaming blog on the planet!

NEW!
Check out my short OSR supplements series; The RPGPundit Presents!


Dark Albion: The Rose War! The OSR fantasy setting of the history that inspired Shakespeare and Martin alike.
Also available in Variant Cover form!
Also, now with the CULTS OF CHAOS cult-generation sourcebook

ARROWS OF INDRA
Arrows of Indra: The Old-School Epic Indian RPG!
NOW AVAILABLE: AoI in print form

LORDS OF OLYMPUS
The new Diceless RPG of multiversal power, adventure and intrigue, now available.

honeydipperdavid

#6
June 25, 2024, 11:35:34 AM
Quote from: Man at Arms on June 21, 2024, 02:54:17 AM
Quote from: Brigman on June 21, 2024, 12:59:25 AMI'm so not interested in buying this drek.

My main group really loves 5e, and I like running it.  I've gotten them to try out Lion & Dragon and ICONS, too. 

But I have no desire or interest in switching/updating my 5e Saltmarsh game to this. 

Might I suggest some early editions of Paranoia or Traveller.

Well, put a few of the earlier books on the table; and tell everyone that you'll run that, but nothing after that.  It has to be in your books, that you already own.

Or they can give your preferred alternative system a chance.....

orbitalair

#7
June 25, 2024, 12:30:01 PM
Another reviewer said your class bonuses come from the Character Background, not the class.

Can anyone say how this works?

So are their background generator tables?  or a section on how to write your 98 page character background?

"Hey Bob, i finally finished my 98 page character background and got 692 Bonuses !!"

Socratic-DM

#8
June 25, 2024, 12:47:21 PM
The Video title is a bit misleading given you say the size of a book isn't really it's problem.

Personally a core rule book that is over 60 pages I consider a bit bloated, which is to say I don't mind bigger books, but if you can't have a full functional system within the first 60 pages and it's not breezy to read I general don't enjoy it.

an advantage to an OSR, or D&D based system there is of course you can figure out a rules-system very easily by merely discerning how it differs from what you've already played.


My biggest gripe with the playtest stuff they put out, plus the things stated about this book (beyond combat wheelchair nonsense) is player front loaded bloat, it's giving me vietnam style flashbacks to 3.5...
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honeydipperdavid

#9
June 25, 2024, 09:18:48 PM
In 5E, fighters do auto attack and the weapon has no meaning.  What 5E is implementing is allowing weapons to do certain extra attack action like a trip for a flail for instance.

Jason Coplen

#10
June 26, 2024, 06:09:16 PM
5E is gay. 6E will be even more so. After 2E, D&D went to total shit.
Running: HarnMaster and Baptism of Fire

Omega

#11
July 23, 2024, 05:45:26 AM
Quote from: orbitalair on June 25, 2024, 12:30:01 PMAnother reviewer said your class bonuses come from the Character Background, not the class.

Can anyone say how this works?

So are their background generator tables?  or a section on how to write your 98 page character background?

"Hey Bob, i finally finished my 98 page character background and got 692 Bonuses !!"


From what I saw its the race bonuses that now come from background. Races no longer give stat bonuses. Because of all the woke bitching and the min/maxer bitching.

Exploderwizard

#12
July 23, 2024, 08:31:44 AM
Quote from: Omega on July 23, 2024, 05:45:26 AM
Quote from: orbitalair on June 25, 2024, 12:30:01 PMAnother reviewer said your class bonuses come from the Character Background, not the class.

Can anyone say how this works?

So are their background generator tables?  or a section on how to write your 98 page character background?

"Hey Bob, i finally finished my 98 page character background and got 692 Bonuses !!"


From what I saw its the race bonuses that now come from background. Races no longer give stat bonuses. Because of all the woke bitching and the min/maxer bitching.

They had all that patched up in Tasha's but they threw it out. Now they have just shifted the min maxing from races to backgrounds. They killed some possible archetypes by assigning what stats can be boosted for the various backgrounds. The noble dueling swashbuckler type for example. Noble cannot use their stat adjustments for DEX or CHA. The noble attributes are STR and INT. Give WOTC half a chance and they will fuck up anything, even issues that had already been addressed.
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Ratman_tf

#13
July 23, 2024, 03:48:03 PM
Quote from: honeydipperdavid on June 25, 2024, 09:18:48 PMIn 5E, fighters do auto attack and the weapon has no meaning.  What 5E is implementing is allowing weapons to do certain extra attack action like a trip for a flail for instance.

I approve of this idea. A bonus aspect for weapons helps to differentiate them outside of damage and possible weapon speed, and gives player more choice and options in combat.
The issue is that it can make combat cumbersome. We saw that in 4th edition with all of the combat powers with tons of conditions and results to track. Weapon effects need to be streamlined and not bog the combat down.
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Monero

#14
July 23, 2024, 08:57:54 PM
Imagine thinking 5e is "bloated" with rules. If anything 5e is rules lite which is why I don't like it.

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