...I hadn't noticed it was third printing.  Holy crap.

Quote from: RunningLaser;1001077I wish I had one or two of them laying around...

Okay fun story related to that line of thinking only A few years ago back in 2008ish I was big in to the PlayStation line of gaming consoles and still am any way and I had finally saved up enough money to buy A PlayStation 3. While I was at the gamestop I saw A game that had just came out for the ps2 called Rule of rose and being as the ps2 was dieing hard and fast as far as gamestop and Sony where concerned they had all ready marked them down to try and get rid of them. Now even though I thought the game looked cool I didn't have the money to get it and the ps3 so I went with the ps3 (I specifically remember thinking I'll have to pick up A copy of that game later). Now to day Rule of rose is A 100$ dollar game just for the disc and you will pay 200-250$ for A complete copy 400$ + for A new copy. Now the clerk had made it very clear that they where willing to make A deal if I wanted A copy or multiple copy's. Now I don't need to tell you at this point why I feal like kicking my self when I think about this.

Quote from: GameDaddy;1001175I didn't get a brown box. My first book set was a very early Whitebox set, However book one, Men & Magic had the rider on horseback on it, even though the fighting man was on foot on the box cover. The monsters book had the Tolkien stuff in it, Hobbits and Balrogs... I literally played so much I wore out the box in just a year and a half or so, and sold the loose books ...then bought a second whitebox in 79 and was very surprised and dismayed that the books had changed, and the Tolkien stuff taken out of the books.   I have one whitebox set now which I do use for play, as well as a second set of books, loose without a box, and all four supplements, of course. These I use almost every time I play D&D, however I'm very careful about moving and storing the box. My third White box had the collector's edition red stamp on it, and was at least a fourth printing.

Pretty soon, I'm going to probably just scan the books and play from printed copies of my scans, because a white bookset in good condtion with the box is typically going for $250-300 these days. that's 25-30x its original price and far greater than inflation would account for.  As fewer originals remain, I expect the price will rise, ...well just about astronomically. I really do enjoy the look on players faces though, when they sit down at the table, and they realize we are playing with the original D&D edition books and supplements. Anything from the 70's is appreciating very nicely and gaining value.

Average price of a brown bookset sold publicly this year, about $12,000, or 1200x it's original $10 price tag. I wish our original house would appreciate like that, in 1977 we paid $27,000 for it, so it would be worth a cool 2.7 million about now.

Question what printing had the LOTR stuff pulled out and or how soon did it happen?

Quote from: grodog;1001264Looks like the woody didn't sell afterall:  https://www.acaeum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=277959#p277959

Allan.

That's very interesting. There were three separate new bidders in the last hour and six minutes of this auction. Let's see... with bids of;

$ 6,155
$ 6,055
$ 4,201

The second highest bid was received eleven seconds after the scheduled end of the auction so might (at the discretion of Ebay) be automatically be disqualified unless it was in fact the highest bid, In which case Ebay has recently announced a new policy where the bidding may be extended for thirty seconds to allow for all the bids to get through that were in fact made before the actual end of the auction, but because of Internet routing delays and such, are not received at Ebay until after the end of the auction. Ebays' fudge factor for this is thirty seconds, so bidding may continue almost indefinitely (at the discretion of Ebay)  these days on hotly contested items, so long as new high bids continue to be received within a thirty second window of the previous bid. I received the official notification of this bidding policy change, from Ebay, in just the last couple of weeks.

Now the highest bid was received at Ebay and timestamped three seconds before the end of the auction.

If the item didn't sell, it's on account the high bidder reneged on their bid.

It is customary then, that the next highest bidder is then obligated to purchase the item being bid upon.

In this case, it's very clear that the second highest bidder also reneged on their bid, because the seller is currently over on Acaeum hawking the woodgrain boxed set for $5,400 (I'll have a few choice comments on this shortly, however, ...back to the matter at hand, the failed Ebay sale of a woodgrain boxed set).

Even with both off of the table, then the third highest bidder would then be obligated to purchase the item, because... auction. With a bid of $4,201 he/she would then automatically win the auction, pay for the books, and received the goods. That's the way it works at most of the auctions I observe and participate in, Like say for example, from Christie's, Sotheby's, and my personal favorite Bonham's. More than once I have found myself obligated to fulfill my bid during an auction after the high bidder(s) reneged, so this entire process right now, is under a red flag from me, ...and should be for you as well, ...as not only did the two highest bidders renege, but the seller also reneged on selling to the third highest bidder. I understand his motive (greed), I don't think it is right though, because a minimum reserve price had not been set for this original woodgrain boxed set prior to the auction.

...except in California it would seem (where Ebay has their Headquarters, and where the server farms are located controlling the E-bay auctions), where auction laws concerning the buyer allow this to actually be legal. The statute that covers bidding during auctions is California Code, Commercial Code, Section 2328 which is as follows:

(1) In a sale by auction if goods are put up in lots each lot is the subject of a separate sale.

(2) A sale by auction is complete when the auctioneer so announces by the fall of the hammer or in other customary manner.  Where a bid is made while the hammer is falling in acceptance of a prior bid the auctioneer may in his discretion reopen the bidding or declare the goods sold under the bid on which the hammer was falling.

(3) Such a sale is with reserve unless the goods are in explicit terms put up without reserve.  In an auction with reserve the auctioneer may withdraw the goods at any time until he announces completion of the sale.  In an auction without reserve, after the auctioneer calls for bids on an article or lot, that article or lot cannot be withdrawn unless no bid is made within a reasonable time.  In either case a bidder may retract his bid until the auctioneer's announcement of completion of the sale, but a bidder's retraction does not revive any previous bid.

(4) If the auctioneer knowingly receives a bid on the seller's behalf or the seller makes or procures such a bid, and notice has not been given that liberty for such bidding is reserved, the buyer may at his option avoid the sale or take the goods at the price of the last good faith bid prior to the completion of the sale.  This subdivision shall not apply to any bid at a forced sale.

I'm also sure there are some California criminal statutes that may apply to individuals who deliberately and fraudulently bid on items to artificially inflate their price or perceived value during an auction. One thing for sure, if an item is fraudulently sold at auction, and shipped over state lines, it automatically becomes a case under federal jurisdiction, and the penalties for wire fraud (selling stuff illegally over the internet with goods being transported across state lines) or mail fraud (mailing it via US Postal Service) , are subject to a million dollar fine (for each instance) and thirty years hard time in a federal penitentiary. This is in addition to any other penalties for conspiracy and racketeering charges that DoJ will dream up for anyone who just might be organizing illegal interstate auction rings.

How do I know all this? Back in the day when I did security work, I was temporarily teamed up with a U.S. Postal Inspector who was hot on the trail of some folks that were violating both the wire fraud statutes (illegally selling counterfeit merchandise online and then shipping the merchandise across state lines), as well as the postal statues (they were actually shipping the merchandise via the U.S. Mail, of all things), and the course of his investigation brought him to one of my clients who were the manufacturers of the authentic merchandise, that the counterfeiters were illegally re-selling. So I got to help my client, and worked with a U.S. Postal Inspector for a few weeks who was part of an organized crime task force. The criminals got caught, were charged, and thrown in jail. I didn't keep track of the case after that or not, so don't know how long they were sentenced for, or whether they ended up paying the hefty fines, but I did learn the relevant law regarding such activities from the Postal Inspector. Any racketeering charges, and anything you own may get auctioned by the Fed.

BTW, Government auctions are like forced auctions, so if other bidders renege, you may end up obligated even though you weren't the high bidder. There's, of course, another story behind that, and whenever you meet me in person, feel free to ask about the time I almost ended up as the owner of a tramp freighter, for somewhere in the neighborhood of $78,000, after I attended a DEA auction in Miami back in the 90's.

Also, hopefully, this pattern of bidding and reneging on high value vintage gaming items is an isolated incident, or anomaly.

I wouldn't buy what the seller has for sale now, even if I had the money to spare, as, ethically speaking, he should have made the woodgrain boxed set available to the next highest bidders (in this case the third bidder at $4,201, and then the fourth bidder after that at $2,500 or so) if he really meant to auction the D&D set instead of, you know, ...price gouge some eBay rubes.


References:
For the gentle readers here I'm going to put in a link to the law library of Cornell Universities Law School, as a reference concerning these  discussions, of some of the additional details that flow around auctions in general, and interstate auctions in particular, especially where items are subsequently delivered by U.S. Mail, UPS. FEDEX and/or via commercial cargo delivery companies or freight forwarding companies here in the United States.

U.S. Code, Title 18, Part 1, Chapter 63 MAIL FRAUD AND OTHER OFFENSES
Section 1341 - Frauds and Swindles

Whoever, having devised or intending to devise any scheme or artifice to defraud, or for obtaining money or property by means of false or fraudulent pretenses, representations, or promises, or to sell, dispose of, loan, exchange, alter, give away, distribute, supply, or furnish or procure for unlawful use any counterfeit or spurious coin, obligation, security, or other article, or anything represented to be or intimated or held out to be such counterfeit or spurious article, for the purpose of executing such scheme or artifice or attempting so to do, places in any post office or authorized depository for mail matter, any matter or thing whatever to be sent or delivered by the Postal Service, or deposits or causes to be deposited any matter or thing whatever to be sent or delivered by any private or commercial interstate carrier, or takes or receives therefrom, any such matter or thing, or knowingly causes to be delivered by mail or such carrier according to the direction thereon, or at the place at which it is directed to be delivered by the person to whom it is addressed, any such matter or thing, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 20 years, or both. If the violation occurs in relation to, or involving any benefit authorized, transported, transmitted, transferred, disbursed, or paid in connection with, a presidentially declared major disaster or emergency (as those terms are defined in section 102 of the Robert T. Stafford Disaster Relief and Emergency Assistance Act (42 U.S.C. 5122)), or affects a financial institution, such person shall be fined not more than $1,000,000 or imprisoned not more than 30 years, or both.


Section 1343 - Fraud by wire, radio, or television
Whoever, having devised or intending to devise any scheme or artifice to defraud, or for obtaining money or property by means of false or fraudulent pretenses, representations, or promises, transmits or causes to be transmitted by means of wire, radio, or television communication in interstate or foreign commerce, any writings, signs, signals, pictures, or sounds for the purpose of executing such scheme or artifice, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 20 years, or both. If the violation occurs in relation to, or involving any benefit authorized, transported, transmitted, transferred, disbursed, or paid in connection with, a presidentially declared major disaster or emergency (as those terms are defined in section 102 of the Robert T. Stafford Disaster Relief and Emergency Assistance Act (42 U.S.C. 5122)), or affects a financial institution, such person shall be fined not more than $1,000,000 or imprisoned not more than 30 years, or both.


Section 1349 - Attempt & conspiracy
Any person who attempts or conspires to commit any offense under this chapter shall be subject to the same penalties as those prescribed for the offense, the commission of which was the object of the attempt or conspiracy.


Some more interesting reading for you...

U.S. Code, Title 18, Part 1, Chapter 96,  RACKETEER INFLUENCED AND CORRUPT ORGANIZATIONS
https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/part-I/chapter-96

Quote from: kosmos1214;1001407Question what printing had the LOTR stuff pulled out and or how soon did it happen?

Umm... I think it was in a fourth printing, which is what I initially bought, however received some third printing books in my whitebox set.

Quote from: GameDaddy;1001425Umm... I think it was in a fourth printing, which is what I initially bought, however received some third printing books in my whitebox set.

Ah thank you.

Quote from: GameDaddy;1001425Umm... I think it was in a fourth printing, which is what I initially bought, however received some third printing books in my whitebox set.

That's not quite correct. The 4th printing (November 1975) is when the boxed changed from wood-grain to white, and the cover art on the box and volume 1 changed, but the interior of the books was still the same. I used to own a copy of this printing.

The 5th printing (c. 1976) has the same box and cover art as the 4th printing, but the text inside has been re-set from Futura to Helvetica. There were some other minor changes to the text (some old errors corrected, some new ones introduced, etc.) but the Tolkien references are all still there. I still own a copy of this printing.

The 6th & 7th printings (c. 1977-79) are where the Tolkien references were taken out. These are the printings that have the starburst on the box cover that says "Original Collector's Edition" (to differentiate them from the D&D Basic Set and AD&D hardbacks that were on the market at the same time; as the guys at the GenCon Auction used to say whenever one of these sets came up: "it says that it's the 'Original Collector's Edition' which is how you know that it's NOT"). Most copies that you'll find for sale are of these printings because a lot more of them were made - they were on the market for 3 years at the time when D&D's popularity was growing by leaps and bounds).

The Acaeum goes into excruciating detail on the differences between printings: https://www.acaeum.com/ddindexes/setpages/original.html

Quote from: T. Foster;1001666That's not quite correct. The 4th printing (November 1975) is when the boxed changed from wood-grain to white, and the cover art on the box and volume 1 changed, but the interior of the books was still the same. I used to own a copy of this printing.

The 5th printing (c. 1976) has the same box and cover art as the 4th printing, but the text inside has been re-set from Futura to Helvetica. There were some other minor changes to the text (some old errors corrected, some new ones introduced, etc.) but the Tolkien references are all still there. I still own a copy of this printing.

The 6th & 7th printings (c. 1977-79) are where the Tolkien references were taken out. These are the printings that have the starburst on the box cover that says "Original Collector's Edition" (to differentiate them from the D&D Basic Set and AD&D hardbacks that were on the market at the same time; as the guys at the GenCon Auction used to say whenever one of these sets came up: "it says that it's the 'Original Collector's Edition' which is how you know that it's NOT"). Most copies that you'll find for sale are of these printings because a lot more of them were made - they were on the market for 3 years at the time when D&D's popularity was growing by leaps and bounds).

The Acaeum goes into excruciating detail on the differences between printings: https://www.acaeum.com/ddindexes/setpages/original.html

Thank you for the info and the link.

Quote from: Headless;1001200Some peoples houses did appreciate like that.  In Toronto and Vancouver.

Were I live as well.  Location, Location, Location.

My house here has gained about $20-30K in value over the last three years.

I own some 50g (or 2 oz) tins of discontinued tobacco that have sold for hundreds of dollars in auctions.

But I can't see the REPRINT D&D wood-box set being all that rare yet. It's crazy it'd sell for so much. Makes me wish I'd asked WoTC to send me one of those, instead of the 5e books!

...and the brown box from Hawaii just sold again for $4,750.

I would be very surprised see this sale fall through as the high bidder is a frequent bidder on high value gaming collectibles. This was about $500 less than the buyer was looking to sell the set for after the last (failed) auction.

This is just crazy.

Quote from: GameDaddy;1000945$6,155

For the love of Big Gygax.

Quote from: RPGPundit;1004695This is just crazy.

The brown-box collectors have huge amounts of money and apparently little sense.

I mentioned to one that I still had my original brown box that I used when I played with Gary.

He said "I have this guy's, and that guy's, and that guy's..."

To which I replied, "So you have the rubbers JFK and Joe DiMaggio used when they screwed Marylin Monroe.  I have the rubber I used when ** I ** screwed Marilyn Monroe."

Yeah, but we're still talking about the reprint here, not the original set??

It's not the modern WoTC reprint, it's one of the first series of printings.

The brown-box sets are all extremely rare:  the first printing, Dec 73/Jan 74, was 1000 copies, the second printing, Jan 75, was also 1000 copies, and the third printing, April 75, was either 2000 or 3000 copies.

If you're a collector, it's all about the rareness.  By contrast, the first white-box version was printed in 25,000 copies.

But I still think collectors are nuts.  It's a game, not a religious artifact.  Or a sex toy.