Just for comparison's sake:

Epic RPG describes "hit points," which it terms "life points," simply as the "physical damage a character can sustain before succumbing to unconsciousness and death." In Epic, life points do not normally increase after character creation unless some magical augmentation or increase in the Vital Attributes that affect it (Build and Vitality) occurs. Instead of life points increasing as characters gain experience, game mechanics portray "higher level" characters as more resilient in combat through improved ability to dodge, parry, shield block, use of magic for protection, etc.

Further, "Damage taken by the character represents degradation of the body. This could be described as cuts, bruises, minor sprains, muscle pulls and so on, depending on the how the area was harmed."

A typical character has 4 life points. All characters have 6 Injury Levels.
These are "represented by boxes on the character log, each of which can contain up the character's LP. When damage is taken, the player adds the damage to the IL box furthest to the left on the log. When it gets full, the remainder is written in the next IL box over. When all six IL boxes are full, the character dies. In essence then, the character can take up to six times his LP (24, if his life points=4)." Look here to see how this is tracked on a character sheet.

There's a little more about how IL's affect character's actions as they become more wounded, but this is the gist of how Epic RPG handles the "hit point" conundrum.

-Andrew
//www.epicrpg.com

Shouldnt this post be in development area? Eh whatever.

I have master time and space, and other stuff with my intergalatic bong, and oh yeah hit points. Platry things.

#1. Players HATE having to record boxes of damage at specific locations. Pluss it gets things way to complex. OUT

#2. Players LIKE the simplicity of hit points BUT hate that a ninja assassain cant take your ass out becuase of your but load of hp. 3.X tried to fix this porblem with coupe's but really... its lacking in its aproach. HP in, lame helpless rules, OUT

in the game im developing (woot ) Ive called hit points, Hope.
They function as regular hit points would in any dnd game. However you can go into negatives. at 0 hp to -3 you get -1 to every thing (including damage) but you can still fight. You do however start to bleed out. Only rest, healing or what have you will stop this. At -4 hit points or worse youve got to make a save on 3d6 to not die = to your current negative hope, but you can still opt and fight if you save, which is wicked cool.) normaly at -10 you die. However in this system you die ony when you fail your roll (which is an average 12) and your hp is -10. Else you bleed out as normal. Note that this allows you to fight to possibly -18 hp.

This allows for awesome fight till all hope is lost (get it huh? eh eh?) and maybe survie, or have a super cool death.

Secondly, what i'm doing on the case of back stabbage is that weapons classes and talents can cause you to make a fight to survie roll as if you were negative hit points. For example. A 22 cal to the head has the concequence of at getting over 5 to hit on your defence score of automatic roll to live = to the damage delt. You lose hope normally, but it phantom jumps you to 0 hp's to trigger the save or die roll = the damage on 3d6. (this is a 3d6 system)

simularly if you coup some one in bed it triggers the same response. In essence its just like the 3.x version, but with a little more flair to it.

"You loose all hope as the rogue stabs you in the neck with his dagger, make a save or die!"
"A 15"

"That was a close one, your bleeding badly from the neck but it just missed your major viens. You got lucky, what do you do now as hope returns to you that you might live?"

Additionaly, with the systems you get bennies for rolling over the target number to hit and im working out a hit location system for the number you rolled for people who have got to know where they have hit. Typically the lower the number is the more dead on it was, becuase well if it takes a low number to hit you your not very agile, now are you?

just my two creds

Quote from: sithson Shouldnt this post be in development area? Eh whatever.

No, see, you missed the point of the thread - which was really to answer an issue in another thread (the place your bets on 4ed thread) without sidetracking it.  It's not about design, it's simply a recitation of the way D&D handled hit points (as well as some other games).

Other people then used the opportunity to discuss the way other games handle the concept. Whether or not that falls into Design and Theory is pretty subjective.  If you have an issue, take it up with the mods.

I do notice that you take it as an opportunity to tell us, again, about your game - a post which, because it's based strictly on the design of your game, could have been a great opportunity for another thread in the very Design and Theory thread you seem to enjoy so much...

Anyone who starts a long, ranty post with "yawn" is pretty much automatically an asshat in my book.

Don't pretend to be bored by the topic; don't pretend to be cooler than the topic; or actually be bored and/or cooler by staying out.

YMMV.

-O

Y'know, I'd really like to know what game Sithson is doing so I can avoid it like the plague.

I refuse to buy from a writer who can't master the very basics of the craft, and frankly a D&D clone inspired by a cheesy pun for hitpoints is the very definition of lame.

Not that, you know, I ever expect to see this atrocity on a shelf anywhere...

You know, if the bong fuled begining part of that rant wasn't a touch of sarcasim for the yawn portion of that post, I appologise in earnest. I was being silly, and didn't mean for it to sound elitest at all. My bad.

Number two, what do you mean very basics of the craft? This game is still under development so everything about it is still subject to interpitation, or change. I was saying thats the way we have it now, and it could change, also cheesy premise? Life points, hit points, mana points? Common A more thematic name for the way it functions is not out of the question, hope is what we have right now, but that can change, and most likley it will but its not going to sound as dull and drab as hit points. This is not a DnD clone at all, in fact this is more of a back to the roots sort of game, But I wouldn't expect you to understand seeing that you turned me down to help write it spike, even after I offered to pay.  And in fact Im still looking for quality writers, such as yourself to help me develop the game so I DONT end up here being a "asshat". I want to make this a great game, and something you wouldn't want to avoid spike. What could I do to change that?

Finaly the fact that I threw in my "Two creds" was really ment to show this was just an opinon and was to be disregarded. I had no intention to derail/abuse this thread, again I appologise.

Quote from: sithsonAnd in fact Im still looking for quality writers, such as yourself to help me develop the game so I DONT end up here being a "asshat".

I'd offer to help, but I'm too busy trying to get my BRIDGE system to gel for my new "Remains of the End" story game (early play-testing has indicated that the "stoic affection" feedback result is coming up far too often when the bid is low).

Quote from: jgants(early play-testing has indicated that the "stoic affection" feedback result is coming up far too often when the bid is low).

Quote from: jgantsI'd offer to help, but I'm too busy trying to get my BRIDGE system to gel for my new "Remains of the End" story game (early play-testing has indicated that the "stoic affection" feedback result is coming up far too often when the bid is low).

Do you have a link to your BRIDGE system? Id like to read it.

I specifically mean the writing. You previous post was far from the worst I've seen around here, even from someone writing a game, but it was also far from what I'd expect from...well... someone writing anything.

Perhaps I judge too harshly.

Quote from: SpikeI specifically mean the writing. You previous post was far from the worst I've seen around here, even from someone writing a game, but it was also far from what I'd expect from...well... someone writing anything.

Perhaps I judge too harshly.

Honestly I'm not a terrific writer. Thats why I asked you earlier if you would help. Ive only been trying to write as of late and I find my self struggling to covey my message. Also, alot of this stuff is still in the gaping void I call my head, and so very embryonic to put out on paper. I have convinced my self if I type it (Say) it enough that It will some how make sense...eventually. Still trying to get there.

back on subject: Where did Hit point "Kickers" Orginate from?
(I ask since it seems like that this will be the flavor for 4e is using)

Quote from: sithson Do you have a link to your BRIDGE system? Id like to read it.

I discussed some of the mechanics here.

Quote from: jgantsI discussed some of the mechanics here.

Dude, I've said it before, but I'll say it again.  I genuinely hope that you're serious about this, because I'll play the hell out of it if you are.

!i!

Quote from: sithson Shouldnt this post be in development area? Eh whatever.

Hmm, I'll let the bait swim on by. James, obryn and Spike summed it up quite nicely.