This is kind of a radically condensed appendex N. If you had to recomend 3 books to a non-fantasy reader to get kind of a feel for Fantasy what would they be. They have to be good so you don't lose your audience. And if they need the course they really aren't that interested in Fantasy so they will be easy to lose. They have to be short or short ish, so again so you don't lose them and so they can finnish the course in a reasonible amount of time. And they have to be IMPORTANT, or Broad, or arch, so they can have a feel for it after only 3 books.
My list.
1/ The Hobbit. But not the lord of the rings. Fun easy to read, short, and it spawned the whole everything.
2/ Sheep-farmers Daughter - Great read, short, and if they like it there are two more books but they don't have to read them, probably the best military fantasy book.
2/ or Dragons of Autumn Twilight. Not good but fun and it moves quick, easy, and it's really a perfect example of D&D fantasy.
3/ The Finnavar Tapestry? Guy Gaviral Kay. Very well written, touches on all the tropes, all the fantasy stuff. Cons really big. Unlike the two above I don't think you can just read one of them, you need all three to get the story.
I'ld like to put Zelaznys Lord of light on here, since it's my favorite book but I don't think it belongs. Maybe Nine princes? Yeah, maybe nine princes in Amber, its great, it's short, you don't have to read the rest of them but you can.
Something by David Gemmell could kick anything but the Hobbit of the list, if I knew which single book to pick.
Thoughts? I am only sure of the Hobbit. It's only partly an academic question.
It's much easier for Sci-Fi. Enders game. The moon is a harsh mistress, Hienlien. and either Snow crash, or Neuromancer.
oh maybe Glory Road, Hienlien belongs on the fantasy list, I forgot about that one.
So you're referring to a narrow sub-genre of fantasy... because something like The Twilight Zone is fantasy as well.
I'd just hand them some Grimm's fairy tales, Lord Dunsany, and Arabian Nights stories.
I'd probably go with some conan and some elric action, given the particular rules you listed. On a more open list I might pick some vlad taltos or myth,inc.
Vlad taltos, Myth inc. Conan, and Arbian Nights all appropriate for the list. The others probaly are too. I just haven't read them.
I will cheat and use these recent anthologies by Del Rey:
(1) The Coming of Conan the Cimmerian
(2) The Conquering Sword of Conan
(3) The Bloody Crown of Conan
That's all I need. Tolkien is okay, too, but you said three and I don't much care for elves, dwarves, and hobbits.
REH, Tolkien, Moorcock... in that order. Lloyd Alexander in 4th.
But if I had to give one short book, it would be The Broken Sword by Poul Anderson. Published in 1954, the same year as lord of the rings (so it wasn't influence by it), it combines all of Tolkien's tropes of elves, dwarves, trolls, and giants with REH's style sword and sorcery prose and, pace, is heavily influenced by Norse mythology and set in "historical" Britain. I don't know how he squeezes it into 180 pages, but it is basically a crash course in fantasy lit.
Edit: It's a helluva great story too.
So...I have never read any Michael Moorcock books and keep hearing "Elric! Elric! Elric!" I saw some books and anthologies on Amazon; it seems a lot of the books are not even in print. It also appears the books were published out of (fictional) chronological order, much like the Conan stories by Robert E. Howard. I don't really care if I read them in the order the stories "happened" unless it matters or doesn't make sense otherwise, but can someone tell me: if I were to seek out an Elric book to start with, which one should it be? And why?
Darkness Weaves by Karl Edward Wagner. While I wouldn't say it does Conan better than Howard, but beats the hell out of anything Moorcock wrote and I say that as someone who has read almost all Moorcock's work.
The Book of the Three by Lloyd Alexander, first of the Prydain books. Sort of the Harry Potter of its day, kinda forgotten now, but I re-read the whole series a year or so ago and was struck by just how good they were
The Tale of Satampra Zeiros (http://www.eldritchdark.com/writings/short-stories/208/the-tale-of-satampra-zeiros) by Clark Ashton Smith. Comical adventure explaining why you shouldn't try to loot a temple of Tsathoggua. I don't think Smith gets enough credit for his fantasy tales which were remarkably good. His Hyperborean tales (like this one) were darkly comical, his Zothique tales were just dark as heck, his Averoigne stories are charming.
Quote from: Dumarest;958407So...I have never read any Michael Moorcock books and keep hearing "Elric! Elric! Elric!" I saw some books and anthologies on Amazon; it seems a lot of the books are not even in print. It also appears the books were published out of (fictional) chronological order, much like the Conan stories by Robert E. Howard. I don't really care if I read them in the order the stories "happened" unless it matters or doesn't make sense otherwise, but can someone tell me: if I were to seek out an Elric book to start with, which one should it be? And why?
Like Howard, Moorcock didn't write his Elric stories in chronological order, but he later strung them together, filled in the gaps, and wrote a conclusion. I would read the original six (very short) books, which combined are shorter than a GRR Martin volume. That will give you the story and all of the canon, setting and tropes - and the stories don't make much sense without them. Moorcock has written a bunch of Elric stories since (because of the way the multiverse works, time isn't an issue, and there is really no limit to the amount of stories that can be squeezed in).
I devoured these books when I was teen. Re-reading them I am less impressed (more jaded?). The ideas and stories are truly original and fantastic, but the writing... well, lets just say MM doesn't have REH's natural flair for prose or Tolkien's mastery of language. It is more heroic fantasy, like Conan, than high fantasy because the focus is on a single sympathetic character. Betwixt the break-neck action, it's much about getting to know Elric, a tragic anti-hero, as a character, as well as exploring Moorcocks very strange existential and dramatic view of the universe in conflict. Its really quite good, if you can get past the sometimes sophomoric writing.
He also wrote a ton of stand alone books. I don't think they are as good as the original series though. Most of them, Like the Revenge of the Rose, are better within the context of the saga. A few, like The Fortress of the Pearl, can stand on their own wobbly legs but will seem like a bizarre LSD dream without knowledge of the Million Spheres, the Young Kingdoms, the concept of the eternal champion, or the forces of Law and Chaos.
Quote from: Madprofessor;958415I would read the original six (very short) books
If you can spare the time for two more questions: which six are those, and in what order?
Quote from: Headless;958401. . . Genera . . .
Christ Kristofferson, go to the Help forum and get an admin to fix your fucking thread title.
Quote from: Dumarest;958417If you can spare the time for two more questions: which six are those, and in what order?
Going from memory here:
Elric of Melnibone
The Sailor on the Seas of Fate
The Weird of the White Wolf
The Vanishing Tower
The Bane of the Black Sword
Stormbringer
I think they have been collected into some two volume sets as well.
As I believe I was the first to mention Elric, I feel compelled to point out that I didn't put it up there because it was the very bestest fantasy out there, but because
A: it meets the criterion of being a fast intro to swords and sorcery
B: God damn if it ain't all D&D an' shit! Magic swords and memory stealing mirrors, potions to do just about anything you need, ruined kingdoms and mysterious places dropped all over the landscape like sprinkles on a fucking cupcake! For Fucks Sake, Elric is, for most of his literary career, a murder-hobo!
C: Its actually pretty easy to get into. A typical Elric book, at least according to my recent adult forays, was a short bit, maybe 180 pages at the top end, and actually contained a good half dozen loosely linked mini-stories.
Quote from: Madprofessor;958405REH, Tolkien, Moorcock... in that order. Lloyd Alexander in 4th.
But if I had to give one short book, it would be The Broken Sword by Poul Anderson. Published in 1954, the same year as lord of the rings (so it wasn't influence by it), it combines all of Tolkien's tropes of elves, dwarves, trolls, and giants with REH's style sword and sorcery prose and, pace, is heavily influenced by Norse mythology and set in "historical" Britain. I don't know how he squeezes it into 180 pages, but it is basically a crash course in fantasy lit.
Edit: It's a helluva great story too.
I just got around to The Broken Sword a couple of years ago - that was a great story!
Quote from: darthfozzywig;958444I just got around to The Broken Sword a couple of years ago - that was a great story!
I'll have to check that out. Never read any of his fantasy books. I'm more a science fiction reader. Love the Van Rijn character and stories.
Elric of Melnibone is definitely a good read. Mind you I've probably read more Moorcock than anyone here. He even sent me this copy of Mother London off his own bookshelf a few years ago. :) [ATTACH=CONFIG]904[/ATTACH]
That said, I'm not sure I'd include Moorcock in a top three list. His writing isn't exactly the easiest to read. Madprofessor might have a point that you should read Tolkien first, because I totally read the Elric Saga (the first six), Howard and Lovecraft before attempting Tolkien and I made it about halfway through the Rings Trilogy before I gave up. It felt monotonous to me. I might be more inclined to recommend Hawkmoon Jewel in the Skull first. Even though it has weird technology, it always felt more like a D&D world to me than the Young Kingdoms.
I'm having a real hard time thinking of three books in the genre because I was always a Science Fiction guy first. Not sure, maybe if you can find the first five Amber novels by Zelazny in one volume that would probably make for a good read. If I was going to pick a D&D novel... Maybe Azure Bonds. The whole Tuigan trilogy was a pretty good read.
One of the Conan collections.
Dreamquest of Unknown Kadath.
Changeling Earth.
Quote from: Spike;958443As I believe I was the first to mention Elric, I feel compelled to point out that I didn't put it up there because it was the very bestest fantasy out there, but because
A: it meets the criterion of being a fast intro to swords and sorcery
B: God damn if it ain't all D&D an' shit! Magic swords and memory stealing mirrors, potions to do just about anything you need, ruined kingdoms and mysterious places dropped all over the landscape like sprinkles on a fucking cupcake! For Fucks Sake, Elric is, for most of his literary career, a murder-hobo!
C: Its actually pretty easy to get into. A typical Elric book, at least according to my recent adult forays, was a short bit, maybe 180 pages at the top end, and actually contained a good half dozen loosely linked mini-stories.
Yeah, Elric is cool as shit!
However, when I recommend it (and I do), I feel compelled to tell people that it is not high literature.
Pretty much the same with Fafhrd and the Grey Mouser.
Fritz Lieber was a pretty good writer, though. Most of the collected F&GM stories are good; just stay away from Rime Isle and The Mouser Goes Below.
Quote from: Arminius;958469The Mouser Goes Below.
????
I think we've discovered the secret identity of Chuck Tingle!
If you just want to cover swords-and-sorcery fantasy, that seems more do-able - but fantasy as a whole is so much broader - and it seems to miss that to take three books to cover it. A Midsummer Night's Dream, The Faerie Queen, The Picture of Dorian Gray, Alice in Wonderland, The Wizard of Oz, Dracula, The Lord of the Rings, A Wizard of Earthsea, etc.
Three books? Agreed on The Hobbit.
A good Conan anthology is necessary, let's go with Del Rey's The Complete Conan (now that's cheating!).
#3 for me would be a toss-up between the first Elric anthology (Elric of Melniboné) or the first Lankhmar anthology (Swords & Devilry).
Quote from: jhkim;958483If you just want to cover swords-and-sorcery fantasy, that seems more do-able - but fantasy as a whole is so much broader - and it seems to miss that to take three books to cover it. A Midsummer Night's Dream, The Faerie Queen, The Picture of Dorian Gray, Alice in Wonderland, The Wizard of Oz, Dracula, The Lord of the Rings, A Wizard of Earthsea, etc.
I assumed by "the genera" he meant the genre ghetto rather than "Literature." But there are no three books that would encompass the scope as it spans from The Wizard of Oz to Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep?
JRR Tolkien, The Hobbit - because elves, dwarves, dragon, caves, treasure: it's the D&D adventure.
Ursula K. LeGuin, Earthsea (and here I'd cheat and go with the German omnibus edition... I didn't find an English one) - because magic and responsibility, non-European lands and peoples, and Harry Potter before Harry Potter.
Peter S. Beagle, The Last Unicorn - because it's as much a fantasy love story as it's a deconstruction and commentary on the fantasy genre, tropes, fairy tales, illusion and reality ("that's what heroes are for").
Runners-up:
As much as I adore Jack Vance: Lyonesse is not an easy read, even if it's "the better GoT".
I love love love Patricia McKillipp's prose in The Riddlemaster of Hed but it's maybe too slow to catch someone not yet interested in fantasy.
Rose Bailey, The Sugar House - dark fairy tales, "Robert E. Howard meets the Brothers Grimm - the heroine Sasha Witchblood is a mostly uncaring, reluctant witch in the body of an ogress, a Conan-like character trudging through the East-European forests fighting monsters and curses. (Great inspiration for Warhammer, LotFP, btw.)
For a reader that has to be "lured" into the genre I'd substitute the Last Unicorn with:
Stephen King, The Eyes of the Dragon - because, King. He's a well-known and liked writer, the book is a page turner, and before the reader knows it he is in a fantasy setting with scheming wizards (Flagg is the role model of the evil power behind a throne) and nobles. King's interpretation of the invisibility spell has been in my games ever since. (I like the book so much that I can even forgive that King reuses a plot twist from another one of his works.)
I had thought of Eyes of the Dragon but it had been so long since I read it that I couldn't remember the title.
The thing is, "Appendix N" isn't really a genre. And fantasy is almost too broad a term to summarize in three books.
However, if the goal was to list three books that in a very incomplete and condensed version summarize the most basic and famous elements of fantasy, it would probably have to be Lord of the Rings (or some part of it), Elric, and one of the Conan stories.
And before the Great Fantasy Boom of the mid 80s (tm) (c) (reg us pat off), especially before 1960 or so, a lot of what we would now think of as "fantasy" was often found under "horror."
Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;960116And before the Great Fantasy Boom of the mid 80s (tm) (c) (reg us pat off), especially before 1960 or so, a lot of what we would now think of as "fantasy" was often found under "horror."
Or science-fiction.
Well, if you really want to go that route science fiction and fantasy are the same thing given different names just to make it clearer which subset a book or story might fall under for the convenience of the potential reader.
Quote from: Dirk Remmecke;958637JRR Tolkien, The Hobbit
Peter S. Beagle, The Last Unicorn - because it's as much a fantasy love story as it's a deconstruction and commentary on the fantasy genre, tropes, fairy tales, illusion and reality ("that's what heroes are for").
I love love love Patricia McKillipp's prose in The Riddlemaster of Hed but it's maybe too slow to catch someone not yet interested in fantasy.
The Last Unicorn is strange in that it's a loving satirical deconstruction of fantasy stories but it's also a deconstruction of deconstructionist cynicism. The movie is good but there's so much great stuff that doesn't make it into the movie, like Captain Cully's defense of his band's methods and the untrue ballads he writes about them, or the town in the shadow of King Haggard's castle where there have been no children born for decade, or the princess Molly and Schmendrick run into on the way out of the story.
As for McKillipp, I usually suggest A Song For the Basilisk, Forgotten Beasts of Eld, or The Book of Atrix Wolfe rather than Quest of the Riddlemaster. The first is about the problems endemic in trying to overthrow the evil king (I wish somebody had told us there was more to fighting than swinging a sword around and striking a pose), the second is about why dating a sorcerer's daughter is dangerous business (fear that physically crushes the body), and the third is about a spell book where all the spells are mis-titled and fantastic medieval kitchen scenes of all things.
The Riddle Master is wonderful but it's hard reading and most people need to read it twice to put it all together. Yes Morgon is the chosen one, that's clear from the beginning. But nobody can even tell him what he's been chosen for and he is the Riddle Master learned in deep lore and with the balls to challenge an undefeated undead king in his tower before the story even starts. It's the twists and turns that make it stand out. But it also has that gentleness that J.R.R. Tolkien, Lloyd Alexander, and C.S. Lewis manage and is thematically closer to those than R.E. Howard, Fritz Leiber, or Michael Moorcock.