Quote from: MeganovaStella on July 12, 2022, 07:10:21 AM
How would you fit something like the Berserk Eclipse in your current campaign? A quick explanation of what the Eclipse is:

The Eclipse is an event that happens every 216 years. During that time, evil spirits swell en masse. What kicks it off is the activation of a crimson Behelit- which turns a human into one of the Godhand, 4 extremely powerful demons. The Godhand tries to sway the human to the side of the Godhand using their powers. If the human accepts, they must mark a sacrifice- people dear to them. The sacrifice(s) will be hunted down by an infinite swarm of demons until they die.

The crimson behelit activates when the human is in an utter state of despair. Say, all of your friends are dead, your limbs gone, and you are starving. That would be a good cause to make the Behelit activate.

Fitting all that into a setting depends alot on the setting and mechanics of the game.

For example this is actually a minor problem in say Forgotten Realms or Greyhawk for example where these sorts of things tend to happen about every other week.

Otherwoldly being granting tempting powers to mortals and throwing open the gates for hell on earth happens again and again. Hate to say it but these guys would be mostly annoyances in FR when you've got literal gods and demon lords being let loose left and right.

The Godhand and the behlits are simplistic to drop into a campaign as a threat major or minor as you see fit.

You just need to lay down the rules of how everything works. You dont even need mechanics for it past the baser requirements and just stating X does Y when Z happens. Ravenlofts demiplane of dread setting fits perfectly. 

Quote from: Chris24601 on July 12, 2022, 11:41:08 AM

Quote from: MeganovaStella on July 12, 2022, 10:39:47 AM

Quote from: Chris24601 on July 12, 2022, 10:18:42 AM

Quote from: MeganovaStella on July 12, 2022, 10:03:27 AM

Quote from: Chris24601 on July 12, 2022, 09:01:36 AM
I'd ignore it entirely as;

A) I've never heard of it before and it sounds like some new age anime* BS.
B) it's entirely incompatible with the setting I'm running. ENTIRELY.

* ETA: specifically badly translated anime that uses literal translations that fail to account for cultural differences... ex. the Godhand are demons, whatever the heck a Behelit is...

Also this is a Behelit

Okay, so it's made up shit from the Berserk manga which is pretending to tell a story supposedly set in Medieval Europe, but comes off like a twisted funhouse mirror because it's been filtered through late 80's Japanese cultural lens and then translated (badly) back to English. You can feel the fatalism dripping off the concept.

Hard pass.

If I want dark Medieval plot hooks I can just go to the actual myths and legends of Europe, not culturally distorted manga.

I think the Japanese perspective gives an interesting twist on Medieval European culture. But if you don't like it, it's fine, I cannot change your tastes.

The concept of behelits does work in a campaign about slaying evil monsters combined with horror. Imagine if one of your friends gives in to one of these things and becomes a demon? Or what if you give in to one of these things? The storytelling potential is outstanding.

Then you die horribly to the infinite demon swarm that nothing can prevent because it's a fatalistic bullshit setting (coming from the same existential angst that led Japanese filmmakers to create stories of unstoppable radioactive monsters rising from the sea to obliterate them).

There's nothing interesting there unless you're a nihilistic navel gazer trying to imagine all the horrible ways the cosmos could unfairly screw you over (for some reason teen girls seem to love that crap).

Similarly, for me to give into one of those things would require me to abandon my faith in the Christian God and buy into the bullshit lies of some demon. Not going to happen so there's no story there.

Based on your past posts you seem like someone who's entire grasp of storytelling and culture is filtered through recent pop culture/Manga (whose popularity has increased with the degeneration of traditional American comics) and as such have a rather superficial read on what compromises interesting and dramatic conflicts. I suggest reading some or all of the following; Beowulf, Le Morte de Arthur, Song of Roland, the Poetic and Prose Eddas, tales of Robin Hood, The Hobbit/Lord of the Rings, Narnia, etc. if you wish to get a real sense of the foundations of European fantasy and why using Berserk just feels like a shallow nothing in comparison.

You insulted what I like. Your opinion is invalid.

Also you seem like you hate Japanese media. How about I keep reading it to piss you off? I will KEEP using Berserk for my settings because I can do whatever the fuck I want with them.

Berserk isn't even shallow, it's one of the best character-driven stories in a while. So you are doubly wrong and should go buy a gun to blow your own brains out

Quote from: Omega on July 12, 2022, 07:49:08 PM

Quote from: MeganovaStella on July 12, 2022, 07:10:21 AM
How would you fit something like the Berserk Eclipse in your current campaign? A quick explanation of what the Eclipse is:

The Eclipse is an event that happens every 216 years. During that time, evil spirits swell en masse. What kicks it off is the activation of a crimson Behelit- which turns a human into one of the Godhand, 4 extremely powerful demons. The Godhand tries to sway the human to the side of the Godhand using their powers. If the human accepts, they must mark a sacrifice- people dear to them. The sacrifice(s) will be hunted down by an infinite swarm of demons until they die.

The crimson behelit activates when the human is in an utter state of despair. Say, all of your friends are dead, your limbs gone, and you are starving. That would be a good cause to make the Behelit activate.

Fitting all that into a setting depends alot on the setting and mechanics of the game.

For example this is actually a minor problem in say Forgotten Realms or Greyhawk for example where these sorts of things tend to happen about every other week.

Otherwoldly being granting tempting powers to mortals and throwing open the gates for hell on earth happens again and again. Hate to say it but these guys would be mostly annoyances in FR when you've got literal gods and demon lords being let loose left and right.

The Godhand and the behlits are simplistic to drop into a campaign as a threat major or minor as you see fit.

You just need to lay down the rules of how everything works. You dont even need mechanics for it past the baser requirements and just stating X does Y when Z happens. Ravenlofts demiplane of dread setting fits perfectly.

I see.

I think you can't do that in a role play game.

Or you can only do it 1 on one.

There isn't any room for other characters  It's a story about 1 edgelord being tormented by a demon.  Edge lords are tedious to play with even when the dm isn't making them the centre of attention.  But worse than being just the centre, the edge lord is swallowing up the whole story (note this is always what edge lords are trying to do that's why they are tedious to play with). 

The only thing the other players get to do in this story is die, but even their own death isn't about them, it's still about the edge lord.

So you can't turn that story into a game for a party.

It also sounds like a terrible 1 on 1. 



But if you want to run it.  The edge lord is has just died.  The demons are loose.  It's up to your PCs to stop the deamons.  If you want to add a part about giving into despair (don't) offer any Player about to die a deal.  Give up, and next game you can come back as a super awesome demon and hunt down the players.  If they defect they get to be super awesome demons too.  Game's over when all the players are dead or demons.  Good job demons now we can't play any more.

Quote from: Headless on July 13, 2022, 12:59:31 AM
I think you can't do that in a role play game.

Or you can only do it 1 on one.

There isn't any room for other characters  It's a story about 1 edgelord being tormented by a demon.  Edge lords are tedious to play with even when the dm isn't making them the centre of attention.  But worse than being just the centre, the edge lord is swallowing up the whole story (note this is always what edge lords are trying to do that's why they are tedious to play with). 

The only thing the other players get to do in this story is die, but even their own death isn't about them, it's still about the edge lord.

So you can't turn that story into a game for a party.

It also sounds like a terrible 1 on 1. 



But if you want to run it.  The edge lord is has just died.  The demons are loose.  It's up to your PCs to stop the deamons.  If you want to add a part about giving into despair (don't) offer any Player about to die a deal.  Give up, and next game you can come back as a super awesome demon and hunt down the players.  If they defect they get to be super awesome demons too.  Game's over when all the players are dead or demons.  Good job demons now we can't play any more.

I see. It'll need some modification, then.

Quote from: Headless on July 13, 2022, 12:59:31 AM
I think you can't do that in a role play game.

Or you can only do it 1 on one.

There isn't any room for other characters  It's a story about 1 edgelord being tormented by a demon.  Edge lords are tedious to play with even when the dm isn't making them the centre of attention.  But worse than being just the centre, the edge lord is swallowing up the whole story (note this is always what edge lords are trying to do that's why they are tedious to play with). 

The only thing the other players get to do in this story is die, but even their own death isn't about them, it's still about the edge lord.

So you can't turn that story into a game for a party.

It also sounds like a terrible 1 on 1. 



But if you want to run it.  The edge lord is has just died.  The demons are loose.  It's up to your PCs to stop the deamons.  If you want to add a part about giving into despair (don't) offer any Player about to die a deal.  Give up, and next game you can come back as a super awesome demon and hunt down the players.  If they defect they get to be super awesome demons too.  Game's over when all the players are dead or demons.  Good job demons now we can't play any more.

Then you havent read the story at all. Bravo on that abject failure.

There is usually more than just the main protagonist wandering around in the series. They tend to die alot. But hows that any different from your average session of older D&D?

You could make him an NPC or have him elsewhere. The idea that there can be no other heroes in the setting is about as ass backwards as it gets. Its like Gronan declaring that no one no where could ever be heroes in a Star Wars RPG because... stupid.

No... really. So no one can ever play in a Hyborian Age setting because... Conan? uh huh. suuuure.

Stop listening to small minded village idiots. You are better than that.

With Berserk you have effectively super versions of various D&D type monsters. An arch lich, a minotaur, a dragon, a deva, naga, and so on. Several with some manner of transformation from a more humanoid form to their monster form. And lots of often themed minions to throw at problems.
Effectively a bunch of demon/devil lords. Nothing complex here kids. Easy to reskin existing D&D demons as needed.

Same for the minions.

Gatz's upgraded sword is effectively your bog standard +x sword vs Demons of I recall right. While his prior sword was just a normal, if very large, sword. The Berserk armour is a bit trickier. Seems to be boosting the users abilities across the board and healing them. But at a massive cost when the battle is over. Theres a few abilities in 5e D&D for example that do similar things. Other RPGs have as well over the years to one degree or another.

If you want an RPG to match the feel of the setting then consider the original Hogshead version of the Warhammer Fantasy RPG.

No.  I haven't read the story at all.  But I did read what the OP wrote.  And that was a story about 1 guy getting tormented.  He explicitly said the dudes friends get killed to make him feel bad. That's the story you can't play with d&d.  It's no fun for the supporting cast.

But the rest of it sure go to town.

Quote from: Headless on July 15, 2022, 03:43:20 PM
No.  I haven't read the story at all.  But I did read what the OP wrote.  And that was a story about 1 guy getting tormented.  He explicitly said the dudes friends get killed to make him feel bad. That's the story you can't play with d&d.  It's no fun for the supporting cast.

But the rest of it sure go to town.

You should read Berserk. Also I'm pretty sure I implied that the guy sacrifices his friends

I would not say Berserk is a great story. But it does cover a broad range of subjects and the main character is alot more than the usual brooding loner. That is in part the guys problem. He very much does not want to be. Problem is he is quite literally a disaster magnet.

The series also goes through several phases. It delves into courtly intrigue, war, demonic temptation, betrayal, recovery and more. And the supernatural elements gradually increase. Then the fey realm gets involved, and this is more like the classical sort of alien fey rather than the charming kids tales fey, and things get worse in an already very bad situation.

In many a way it is effectively WHFRP: the anime once things escalate. Then pretty much overtakes it in a worse case scenario if chaos ever got a major foothold.

Quote from: Headless on July 15, 2022, 03:43:20 PM
No.  I haven't read the story at all.  But I did read what the OP wrote.  And that was a story about 1 guy getting tormented.  He explicitly said the dudes friends get killed to make him feel bad. That's the story you can't play with d&d.  It's no fun for the supporting cast.

But the rest of it sure go to town.

Fair enough.

Quick brutal rundown then.
Starts off as a medieval setting with no magic. I do not recall a single spellcaster. War torn europe setting and at first it could be mistaken for a period piece. The main character Gatz. Rises up the ranks as a fighter and eventually fights and gets bested by Griffith, the leader of a mercenary band and joins them. Griffith has ambitions and the tone shifts to a bit of courtly intrigue. The feel is more of an adventuring group than a lone hero. Here is about where the supernatural starts to creep in and once things go to heck they start to go to literal heck.

Griffith is tempted with vast power by a curt of demons called the Godhand via the necklace, refered to as the behlit. But has to sacrifice his friends to get that power. It is just short of a TPK and here is also where the fey make their first presence known. Gatz gets away maimed, with the behlit, and with his girlfriend and fellow mercenary Caska who is left a complete mental wreck. From there it becomes more the, almost, lone hero - with girlfriend - adventure as he tried to keep her safe and thwart the Godhand whenever they show up. Which is pretty much wherever he shows up.

Then things actually get worse when the fey realm gets overlaid on the physical realm. Magic returns and here Gatz picks up a bunch of companions along the way. At some point his sword gets upgraded to be more effective against the monsters and he acquires the Berserk armour which grants the user tremendous strength and agility, as well as healing wounds. But at a price as the armour has a mind of its own and when the battle is over seems he pays the price as all the healing seems to catch up to him.

Thats where I lost track of the series.

Hence why I say turning that into an adventure or campaign would not be all that much work. Call of Cthulhu: Dark Ages would be another good system for that as theres a horror/sanity loss factor going on. And fits the usual slow burn escalation of many a CoC adventure.

The series is just not my thing though. It is a very violent series. Roll limb loss table is the least of the injuries. But the art is good and I give them points for throwing multiple curve balls and not making the hero your generic angry brooding loner. He does alot of that anyhoo for good reason. But it is not what the core of the character is.

The original anime plays off the slow burn escalation well. And oddly tones down the gore. Saw it first at GenCon back in the late 90s. The CGI series though looks just freaking horrible. CGI by the lowest bidder.

One thing, the berserker armor doesnt heal wounds, it just surpresses pain and controts to allow the wearer to use yheir limbs even if their bones break, it actually makes Gut's injuries worse.

Quote from: Slambo on July 17, 2022, 02:19:14 AM
One thing, the berserker armor doesnt heal wounds, it just surpresses pain and controts to allow the wearer to use yheir limbs even if their bones break, it actually makes Gut's injuries worse.

Ah, hah! Thanks. Its been many a year and just going off memory.

QuoteGriffith is tempted with vast power by a curt of demons called the Godhand via the necklace, refered to as the behlit. But has to sacrifice his friends to get that power 

This is the part that you can't do in D&D. No fun for the other players.

Quote from: Headless on July 17, 2022, 05:52:41 AM

QuoteGriffith is tempted with vast power by a curt of demons called the Godhand via the necklace, refered to as the behlit. But has to sacrifice his friends to get that power 

This is the part that you can't do in D&D. No fun for the other players.

You can actually survive the Eclipse if your PCs are strong enough. You can then turn the guy who started the sacrifice into the BBEG for the other players to fight against.

Quote from: Headless on July 17, 2022, 05:52:41 AM

QuoteGriffith is tempted with vast power by a cult of demons called the Godhand via the necklace, refered to as the behlit. But has to sacrifice his friends to get that power 

This is the part that you can't do in D&D. No fun for the other players.

Id rank Griffith as either an NPC. Or "that easily tempted player". You know. The ones that will put on the hand of vecna and go on a killing spree just for the giggles. D&D is full of these. Hell. One of the 5e playtest modules has an instance where the PCs are put in an a situation where they must sacrifice one of the members to open a door.
Players and their characters get tempted like this sometimes so even that element is very nothing new.
Not to mention the rest of the group can try to stop the crazy characters plotting.

Which is pretty much what happens. At least 3 of the group make it out of the ritual alive. Which I believe meant that Griffith was not able to gain full power when he transformed.

Personally I wonder if he would have gone through with it had he not spent a whole year being tortured and thoroughly broken of body.