From another thread Tenbones offered to share his insights into Cyberpunk and Interlock Unlimited (maybe with a dash of SWADE?).

Given that I respect too much his knowledge to let the opportunity pass this thread is born.

For starters, I've NEVER liked the hacking rules in ANY Cyberpunk game I've read/Played (Still going through CWN opinion pending), it's a minigame within a game that leaves the other players out and honestlky it makes no sense for anyone that KNOWS how hacking is really done:

The vast majority of hacking is done by social engineering not by typing furiosly on your keyboard.

Having said that I'll leave the floor and mic to Tenbones and will only interject to ask questions.

The idea of cyberspace from Neuromancer just won't die.  Almost every Cyberpunk game tries to do it and fails.  The only time I've seen it kind of work was with Netrunner integrated into Cyberpunk 2020.  (Netrunner was the best CCG ever, IMO.)

Most games I played, the hacker was an NCP that was usually off-site for the messy stuff that we could be in contact with via whatever comms the particular setting had.

The best hacking I've seen at the table has been home brew stuff all the way.  My favorite was that in combat, hackable items had "digital" hit points that the hacker could hit with his hacking skills and tools.  Once the hacker got through, there was a menu of things that the hacker could do depending on the actual thing being hacked.  this was usually basic stuff like causing a shutdown or downloading all the available files.  A hacker could have scripts ready to go for things like altering the IFF of a turret flip the targeting parameters.  More complicated things would require more time and therefor not an "in combat" action.

In the most enduring CP2020 game I was ever in, entire multi-session missions were dedicated to hacking by way of facility infiltrations, direct physical patch-ins, social engineering, and dumpster diving.

As for Interlock Unlimited, it's complete enough that you can literally run the entire game completely free of any R Talsorian material.  It's best just to use it as a collection of house rules and to pick and choose what parts you like though.

Quote from: BadApple on September 11, 2023, 05:11:36 PM
The idea of cyberspace from Neuromancer just won't die.  Almost every Cyberpunk game tries to do it and fails.  The only time I've seen it kind of work was with Netrunner integrated into Cyberpunk 2020.  (Netrunner was the best CCG ever, IMO.)

Most games I played, the hacker was an NCP that was usually off-site for the messy stuff that we could be in contact with via whatever comms the particular setting had.

The best hacking I've seen at the table has been home brew stuff all the way.  My favorite was that in combat, hackable items had "digital" hit points that the hacker could hit with his hacking skills and tools.  Once the hacker got through, there was a menu of things that the hacker could do depending on the actual thing being hacked.  this was usually basic stuff like causing a shutdown or downloading all the available files.  A hacker could have scripts ready to go for things like altering the IFF of a turret flip the targeting parameters.  More complicated things would require more time and therefor not an "in combat" action.

In the most enduring CP2020 game I was ever in, entire multi-session missions were dedicated to hacking by way of facility infiltrations, direct physical patch-ins, social engineering, and dumpster diving.

As for Interlock Unlimited, it's complete enough that you can literally run the entire game completely free of any R Talsorian material.  It's best just to use it as a collection of house rules and to pick and choose what parts you like though.

Those houserules sound like my own rules for hacking, the hacker is an NPC offsite far, far away from danger. I still dislike hackable cyberwear but those mechanics do sound kinda fun.

Quote from: GeekyBugle on September 11, 2023, 05:22:02 PM
Those houserules sound like my own rules for hacking, the hacker is an NPC offsite far, far away from danger. I still dislike hackable cyberwear but those mechanics do sound kinda fun.

Nothing says that everything has to be hackable.  It's real to have critical computational equipment air gapped.  I have multiple devices that can only be accessed when there's a physical connection.  A security turret on the network for IFF updates? Hackable.  The multilayered medical monitoring computer keeping a patient alive? Air gapped.  Easy Peasy.

Quote from: GeekyBugle on September 11, 2023, 01:27:04 PM
From another thread Tenbones offered to share his insights into Cyberpunk and Interlock Unlimited (maybe with a dash of SWADE?).

Given that I respect too much his knowledge to let the opportunity pass this thread is born.

For starters, I've NEVER liked the hacking rules in ANY Cyberpunk game I've read/Played (Still going through CWN opinion pending), it's a minigame within a game that leaves the other players out and honestlky it makes no sense for anyone that KNOWS how hacking is really done:

The vast majority of hacking is done by social engineering not by typing furiosly on your keyboard.

Having said that I'll leave the floor and mic to Tenbones and will only interject to ask questions.

Okay so let get it out of the way... BadApple is spot on: Cyberspace as attempted by CP2020 and Shadowrun as conceptually cool as it was - its complete ass as a game design. As we all know it splits the group into entirely different games where the only people that get to play are Netrunners*. For purposes of nomenclature I will use CP2020 terms.

*TECHNICALLY... other people *can* Netrun with the Netrunners, they simply can't use the "Menu" which which allows manipulation of the various programs and defenses that Netrunners use. However, they can run programs they themselves create with the Programming skill - which is not the sole province of Netrunners. Anyone that knows anything about modern computers knows this is a bunch of bullshit, but Pondsmith wanted to create "role armor" for the Netrunners... which ironically wasn't necessary. Give non-Netrunners a nice penalty and let them go along and help out. It actually allows for "team play" albeit very dangerous team play, in the Net.

But anyhow... yeah it was a great idea conceptually, but failed as a game-design since it was inherently segregating the party who had no other reason to go, other than to be targets for potentially *nasty* shit in the Net.

Currently CPRed steamlines it down and lifts almost directly from SWADE's Interface Zero. Conceptually abandoning the Net's Gibson Johnny Mnemonic/Neuromancer's romantic digital wonderland, for real-time Augmented Reality where the VR space which they narratively destroyed in the last big Corporate War in 2020, is now using Virtuality Goggles you wear and see Augmented Reality overlayed on real-space. What this means is simple: you're in real-time, doing real-time magic, with your party like a technological magician.

The narrative shift that ultimately taking control over a car, working a remote drone, hacking someone's cybernetics etc. shouldn't be a trip down the rabbit hole where a single player does a single-person virtual dungeon-crawl against Network Defense Monsters and take up an hour, when it should just be like "casting a spell" where your skill + gear + program effect against the skill + gear + defense score has a desired effect... while your friends are shooting pistols to give you cover-fire, or doing other things in real-time with you.

This doesn't technically change the fact that old VR universe exists - it's just super-dangerous, and frankly unnecessary unless you really want to bore your other players. However they cooked in a lot of narrative reasons to NOT use the old neural interface where you're now exposing the meat-drive to all manners of nasty shit that has propagated throughout the shards of the Net... what's left of it.

That's another story entirely.

SWADE's Interface Zero did the same thing from the start. Basically using your programs offensive/defensive/utility is effectively like casting a spell. Only your Netrunning is your Arcane Skill, and you're spell effect is dependent on your degree of success.

CPRed's netrunning system *needs* to be brought into CP2020's rules. It's pretty easy to do once you convert all the roles over, which is also pretty easy to do since the core values are largely the same.

The biggest issue is reframing the Stats from CP2020 to CPRed as they made some choices that seem... odd? I understand why they did it, becaus Reflex was a god-stat to many players in CP2020, now they added Dexterity for hand-eye-coordination, just to *force* you to split your Stat points.

I'm of two minds... I never had a problem with Reflex being a "god-stat" in the minds of my players. You know why? Because a fucking gun will kill you dead, no matter how fucking high your Reflexes are. The narrative point of Solos in CP2020 are that they're *supposed* to be the WTFbadass killers of the setting. They're *supposed* to go first... theoretically. But if you are the type of GM that doesn't curate spending caps on PC's at character generation... you're asking to give yourself a headache. I normally cap everyone at 7 across the board.

So sure, Solo players are going to want to have 7 in their Combat Sense (this gives them +7 to Initiative!!!!) but the reality is yes, they're likely going to go first, it doesn't *always* mean that's the case. For instance... I never played Solo's because *anyone* could be good at combat, Solo's just tended to go first (and in CP2020 going first *usually* means you're going to win) but there are options - like using a Speed Holster (+3 Initiative), Kerenzikov+2 or Sandevistan+3 respectively, plus doing Fast Draw manuevers (which many players seem to forget about) I could get my Fixer up to +7 Initiative with his pistol, which sure, Solos could do this too - if they thought about it, most don't because they're into the Maximum Metal lazy thinking. And of course you shouldn't be GOING UP AGAINST Solos in the first place... subtlety is KING. But when push comes to shove - you *can* do it.

Anyhow I digress...

Netrunning in CPRed *is* lightyears better. I'd ignore the Netrunning rules of CP2020 unless you plan on converting them for some weird exploration into the remnants of the old Net (which was destroyed? but you can't really destroy it... per se), they've designed Netrunning in CPRed to be *practical* and still fun. They've removed most of the romantic VR wonderland stuff out of it, but you can insert as much of it as you want, but also consider the CPRed era is 40-years later, and things have degraded, so much of the network infrastructure is analog, or localized. Like Star Wars. You can't really netrun and hack into the Imperial networks... as they don't connect together on purpose. You have to GO there and actually plug into their network locally. Same is true of CPRed. This is how you should do it in CP2020 too.

One of the failings of the CPRed Netrunning system is that the location of Access Points is not clearly defined and seemingly left to GM arbitration. Want to gain control over a camera node? You might need to sneak PAST the camera, and go fifty meters across the yard to the guard shack. Then "backtrack" through the Net Architecture to find the camera node. It's still a "minigame," it's just a bit more streamlined.

Cities Without Number (which uses a system very similar to CPR) fixes this by turning EVERY device connected to network into an Access Point. Want to hack a camera? Just get in range and sling your spell-program directly at the camera. Once inside, you can navigate to anything else that is connected to that node. This means, depending on which device you initially hack into, you will appear in different areas of the Net Architecture... unlike in CPR, which always starts you off in the "lobby."

For as much as Netrunning in CPRed is better than CP2020, it's still pretty much crap. And that says nothing about all the other problems CPR has with games mechanics and lore alike. CP2020 is the better system, overall, just as long as you fix Netrunning and streamline combat.

Well there could be potential issues with having every single device be an access point. Narratively there are reasons in CPRed for it to not be this way. Much the same in Star Wars.

Having every device be a potential backdoor into your network (much like today) with the assumptions of what the programs of CP2020/Red era Netrunners actually do, is a massive narrative hole, and a mechanical one too.

Narratively it opens up the issue of "Netrunner never actually need to go adventuring" - they can just stay at home and plug in and be safe. Sure this was assumed in CP2020 where AI's and Daemons and SysOps and NetSec can run traces and come kick your doors in while you're jacked in (the ol' Gibson Maneuver). As a mechanical design issue for a TTRPG it didn't technically work because of the other garbage required to do things remotely and seem "actionable" - the VR solo-dungeon which bored everyone to tears.

Doing away with this instantaneous "adventure" where the binary result is success "Here I got your information/opened the lock... etc." of failure "You see smoke coming out of the interface connections on your friends head... his hair catches fire." and turning it into a single roll, or a series of rolls which requires participation in the mission makes for better gaming.

Sure we can say it's meta-design, but it's not like there's not really good reason for it. Star Wars, who the fuck knew how they knew, did that from the start. Whether it was common sense, or someone there really was into network security in the late 70's/early 80's (LOL!) they were certainly forward thinking about it. R2-D2 couldn't just hack the Deathstar from hyperspace network connections, that little blob of grease had to be IN the Deathstar itself.

This smartly carried through all the Knights of the Old Republic and SWTOR as well.

I don't own Cities without Number (it's on the list) it sound very much in tune with what CPRed and to a lesser degree Interface Zero. I agree that overall CP2020 is better. I do like some of the mechanics of CPRed - their roles are better. But it needs hybridization. I'm up to the task, but ultimately I'm busy doing other projects right now.

I'm *more* inclined to finish my Interface Zero project... and effectively do SWADE Cyberpunk with all the bells and whistles.

I'm gearing up a cyberpunk game myself.  I'm going to use Hostile, a Zozer product that uses Cepheus Engine as it's core.  It allows me to do everything I want but it streamlines a lot of stuff that so many other Cyberpunk systems make complicated.

Also, Tenbones, you might take a look at Neon City Overdrive.  I have it and love it.

Quote from: tenbones on September 11, 2023, 07:11:22 PM
Well there could be potential issues with having every single device be an access point. Narratively there are reasons in CPRed for it to not be this way. Much the same in Star Wars.

Having every device be a potential backdoor into your network (much like today) with the assumptions of what the programs of CP2020/Red era Netrunners actually do, is a massive narrative hole, and a mechanical one too.

There are several ways that CWN mitigates this. The first is the way it builds programs. Every theoretical program comes in two halves, termed Verbs and Subjects. A Hacker builds programs on the fly by combining a Verb with a Subject (similar to the old text-based computer games... walk north, kick rock, etc). Each program element takes up one slot on a cyberdeck, so a hacker needs to pick which ones he wants to bring in very carefully.

The other mitigating factor is "Access Points" (same name as CPR, different concept). When a hacker breaks into a network, they get a pool of points based on their skill + quality of cyberdeck. Each time they take an action in the Net, this pool drops by 1. When it hits zero, the system has "pinged" the hacker and locks them out of the network. So a hacker can't just pussyfoot around; they need to get in, find the paydirt, and get out.

QuoteNarratively it opens up the issue of "Netrunner never actually need to go adventuring" - they can just stay at home and plug in and be safe.

Not a problem. The system follows the "closed-circuit" concept. Each network is an isolated thing. Entire facilities might even have multiple networks, each one segregated from one another. So the exterior cameras, floodlights, and klaxons might be their own network, unconnected to the interior cameras... which themselves are separate from the computer terminals... which (you guessed it) can also be separate from the Chief Executive's computer.

It produces a play-style that requires the team to move in as unit, spoofing the exterior cameras to get to the front door, then cracking the passcode and/or spoofing interior cameras. Then it's a physical hunt through the offices to find the specific network they need to gain access to.

Compare this to CPR, whose Net Architectures are so loosely defined, it's unclear whether the facility is one network or multiple. The few live-play streams I've seen of CPR assumed the former, and the Netrunner just needed to find one Entry Point to get into the whole network. Everyone else just stood overwatch until it was time to leave. Sure, the netrunner was inside the facility rather than home on their couch, but the end result was fairly similar.

Additionally, the old VR net-reality also exists as a concept in CWN. So even if the hacker finds the proper physical computer that stores the file they want, there are still passcode barriers and Demons to contend with. For example, a computer lab with 15 computers might all be on one network. The hacker can jack in from any individual unit, but would need to digital navigate to the node that has the file, contending with whatever might be in network (and spending access points all along the way). If the team did the legwork to discover "oh, shit, it's on terminal 7," the hacker can save a lot of AP, increasing their chance of success (especially if they have trouble de-rezzing the Demon).

Quote from: tenbones on September 11, 2023, 07:11:22 PM
Well there could be potential issues with having every single device be an access point. Narratively there are reasons in CPRed for it to not be this way. Much the same in Star Wars.

Having every device be a potential backdoor into your network (much like today) with the assumptions of what the programs of CP2020/Red era Netrunners actually do, is a massive narrative hole, and a mechanical one too.

Narratively it opens up the issue of "Netrunner never actually need to go adventuring" - they can just stay at home and plug in and be safe. Sure this was assumed in CP2020 where AI's and Daemons and SysOps and NetSec can run traces and come kick your doors in while you're jacked in (the ol' Gibson Maneuver). As a mechanical design issue for a TTRPG it didn't technically work because of the other garbage required to do things remotely and seem "actionable" - the VR solo-dungeon which bored everyone to tears.

Doing away with this instantaneous "adventure" where the binary result is success "Here I got your information/opened the lock... etc." of failure "You see smoke coming out of the interface connections on your friends head... his hair catches fire." and turning it into a single roll, or a series of rolls which requires participation in the mission makes for better gaming.

Sure we can say it's meta-design, but it's not like there's not really good reason for it. Star Wars, who the fuck knew how they knew, did that from the start. Whether it was common sense, or someone there really was into network security in the late 70's/early 80's (LOL!) they were certainly forward thinking about it. R2-D2 couldn't just hack the Deathstar from hyperspace network connections, that little blob of grease had to be IN the Deathstar itself.

This smartly carried through all the Knights of the Old Republic and SWTOR as well.

I don't own Cities without Number (it's on the list) it sound very much in tune with what CPRed and to a lesser degree Interface Zero. I agree that overall CP2020 is better. I do like some of the mechanics of CPRed - their roles are better. But it needs hybridization. I'm up to the task, but ultimately I'm busy doing other projects right now.

I'm *more* inclined to finish my Interface Zero project... and effectively do SWADE Cyberpunk with all the bells and whistles.

CWN is FREE in DTTRPG, of course there's also the more complete paid version.

Quote from: tenbones on September 11, 2023, 05:50:12 PM
The narrative shift that ultimately taking control over a car, working a remote drone, hacking someone's cybernetics etc. shouldn't be a trip down the rabbit hole where a single player does a single-person virtual dungeon-crawl against Network Defense Monsters and take up an hour, when it should just be like "casting a spell" where your skill + gear + program effect against the skill + gear + defense score has a desired effect... while your friends are shooting pistols to give you cover-fire, or doing other things in real-time with you.

This is how I'd hoped CPR was going to go with their Augmented Reality.

Quote from: Ratman_tf on September 12, 2023, 01:28:37 AM

Quote from: tenbones on September 11, 2023, 05:50:12 PM
The narrative shift that ultimately taking control over a car, working a remote drone, hacking someone's cybernetics etc. shouldn't be a trip down the rabbit hole where a single player does a single-person virtual dungeon-crawl against Network Defense Monsters and take up an hour, when it should just be like "casting a spell" where your skill + gear + program effect against the skill + gear + defense score has a desired effect... while your friends are shooting pistols to give you cover-fire, or doing other things in real-time with you.

This is how I'd hoped CPR was going to go with their Augmented Reality.

Effete has sold me. I'm going to pick up Cities Without Number - sounds cool as hell.

CPR does kinda do it like this now. So does Interface Zero - if you like Savage Worlds. And it's the smart way to do it, but let's face it, one of the BIGGEST known issues of Cyberpunk games - whether CP2020 or Shadowrun is the adage: No Netrunners in the party.

It is known.

Which is a real shame, since we've been trying to square that circle for decades because we want our Johnny Neuromancing Mnemonic jack-off fantasy to work. But alas... It might have been done earlier - but I think Interface Zero was the first time I saw it done practically, and I warmed up to it very fast. I still want to do the Gibson Netrunning thing, or at least make it an option, but the incentives for doing that in a game have to be there.

Frankly the narrative reality of using your brain as a networking device opens up a *lot* possible issues that make game-design around the idea tricky, unless the designer has a lot of IT experience and understands the corollaries of it. It doesn't have to be that rigorous, but CP2020 is outright laughable in its conception of hardware. And the software is just handwavium. But it's one of those things you only know about if you're in the business or you care about such details. Much like being into firearms and martial-arts and watching action-movies and how... "cinematic magic" works vs. reality. But we still love that stuff!

Quote from: tenbones on September 12, 2023, 11:33:10 AM
Frankly the narrative reality of using your brain as a networking device opens up a *lot* possible issues that make game-design around the idea tricky, unless the designer has a lot of IT experience and understands the corollaries of it. It doesn't have to be that rigorous, but CP2020 is outright laughable in its conception of hardware. And the software is just handwavium. But it's one of those things you only know about if you're in the business or you care about such details. Much like being into firearms and martial-arts and watching action-movies and how... "cinematic magic" works vs. reality. But we still love that stuff!

I have some networking experience and fiddling with handshaking to get things to talk to each other.  I also have a reasonable understanding of brain function for someone without a medical degree.

In reality, neurolink tech is going to be very tricky.  Imagine if you will that every single device you're trying to hook up to a network is running on a different OS and a different architecture processor with a different instruction set.  That would give you some idea of how hard it would be to create a true neurolink.  On top of which, the human mind can only consciously focus on so much data at a time. 

Ironically, I think that The Matrix was probably closer to how it might work than anything else we've seen.  There would be some people as "divers" (people on the net via neurolink) and some people as "handlers" (people on a workstation getting an overview to guide the divers) working together.  This would mirror things like modern warfare and large engineering projects. 

Coming back to how this would work in game, I think that VR dives should always be a whole party event.  When the party is lucrative enough to pay them, they should get NPC handlers for more difficult missions.  Angel from Borderlands would be a good practical example of a NPC handler.  (Later iterations where she's a human are less useful for this example.)  I would think that everyone having an in-VR specialty as well as a meatspace specialty would be a great touch.

Finally, how I handle this in my own game is with a kind of AR.  The AR hacker type PC has a large AI core computer with a personality that actually does a lot of the technical and mundane hacking and links to an augmented reality set the PC wears.  The PC can plug in his set to air gapped or firewalled systems to allow his AI to gain access.  Also, the AI can do a lot of net-to-RL mapping using telemetry data and camera feeds from the set and comparing it to various data streams it's detecting.  All of this is already technically feasible today but requires a team of operators and several hundred pounds of gear.  (Look up US Military Intelligence Support Activity Signals Brigade.)

Quote from: tenbones on September 12, 2023, 11:33:10 AM
Which is a real shame, since we've been trying to square that circle for decades because we want our Johnny Neuromancing Mnemonic jack-off fantasy to work. But alas... It might have been done earlier - but I think Interface Zero was the first time I saw it done practically, and I warmed up to it very fast. I still want to do the Gibson Netrunning thing, or at least make it an option, but the incentives for doing that in a game have to be there.

I think one of the ways to make it work is to offer both options, with each one having very different goals within the setting.

You can have "quick hacking," which would function like spells, described as brute-force peer-to-peer intrusions into devices. These are the things like blinding cameras for X rounds, or jamming a smartgun, or "puppeting" a drone. They are temporary effects meant to serve a purpose and usually leave behind telltale signs of hack (i.e. camera feed goes blank for several seconds).

Then you can have your "deep dives," where the hacker Jacks In to a network, goes limp, and digitally moves around a VR environment. These are designed for more careful intrusions, or for systematically altering what a network can do. It's harder to track the changes unless the hacker royally screws up.

In gameplay, it might look like this:
The entire team moves in on a facility. The "net wizard" slings a program at the camera, blinding it for 30 secs and foiling the automated alarm from triggering as the team rushes forward. Next is the doorpad, but as the crew approaches, a patrol drone sweeps around the corner. The hacker chooses to gain control of drone, which "requires concentration" from their cyberdeck; they cannot attempt to crack the doorlock without releasing control of the drone. The techie gets to work, prying open the case and splicing wires while the hacker uses the drone to recon. Success! The team is inside. Now it's time to find the mainframe and plant a virus at the core. This is delicate work that would cause the hacker's meat to go limp for a minute or two.

Quote from: BadApple on September 12, 2023, 12:20:35 PM

Quote from: tenbones on September 12, 2023, 11:33:10 AM
Frankly the narrative reality of using your brain as a networking device opens up a *lot* possible issues that make game-design around the idea tricky, unless the designer has a lot of IT experience and understands the corollaries of it. It doesn't have to be that rigorous, but CP2020 is outright laughable in its conception of hardware. And the software is just handwavium. But it's one of those things you only know about if you're in the business or you care about such details. Much like being into firearms and martial-arts and watching action-movies and how... "cinematic magic" works vs. reality. But we still love that stuff!

I have some networking experience and fiddling with handshaking to get things to talk to each other.  I also have a reasonable understanding of brain function for someone without a medical degree.

In reality, neurolink tech is going to be very tricky.  Imagine if you will that every single device you're trying to hook up to a network is running on a different OS and a different architecture processor with a different instruction set.  That would give you some idea of how hard it would be to create a true neurolink.  On top of which, the human mind can only consciously focus on so much data at a time. 

Ironically, I think that The Matrix was probably closer to how it might work than anything else we've seen.  There would be some people as "divers" (people on the net via neurolink) and some people as "handlers" (people on a workstation getting an overview to guide the divers) working together.  This would mirror things like modern warfare and large engineering projects. 

Coming back to how this would work in game, I think that VR dives should always be a whole party event.  When the party is lucrative enough to pay them, they should get NPC handlers for more difficult missions.  Angel from Borderlands would be a good practical example of a NPC handler.  (Later iterations where she's a human are less useful for this example.)  I would think that everyone having an in-VR specialty as well as a meatspace specialty would be a great touch.

Finally, how I handle this in my own game is with a kind of AR.  The AR hacker type PC has a large AI core computer with a personality that actually does a lot of the technical and mundane hacking and links to an augmented reality set the PC wears.  The PC can plug in his set to air gapped or firewalled systems to allow his AI to gain access.  Also, the AI can do a lot of net-to-RL mapping using telemetry data and camera feeds from the set and comparing it to various data streams it's detecting.  All of this is already technically feasible today but requires a team of operators and several hundred pounds of gear.  (Look up US Military Intelligence Support Activity Signals Brigade.)

The Matrix but it's not THE Matrix, it's several different ones not connected between. But only if the whole party can go there, so they get equiped with "guns", "Swords", etc that are really programs used against the matrix deffenses which will manifest in different ways depending of the particular matrix (or maybe depending on the party/PC?).

So in one you're figthing "mutants" in another it's "Fantasy monsters", another it's "Aliens", "Tron like robots", etc.

IF you want to have your diving/netruning in your game.