Quote from: tenbones;1140312... there has always been *something* about Talislanta that seems like a 'bridge too far' because Earthdawn, in particular, is *far* more popular in its heyday than Talislanta ever was...

My personal guess at this is that it comes down to Talislanta's lack of humans in the game setting. In making a game absolutely brimming with exotic races and cultures, there's very little in any of them for people to relate to. Not that there's nothing to relate to, mind, but what's there is something you have to work a little bit harder at. For people who "get" Talislanta right away and go all-in, I'd wager that comes easier than for most other people.

Quote from: Mercurius;1140343One good reason to do a new edition would be to bring it up-to-date with contemporary publishing quality. Savage Lands (which I only own in PDF) is so far ahead of the previous editions, and I'd love to see classic Talislanta re-done in similar fashion.

100% agree. The whole team wanted this. But there is a "content value" issue that is a valid point to not doing 6e covering the modern era. It's a little sketchy to do a whole new edition with no intention of delivering meaningfully different content with a new paintjob (however awesome - as the Savage Lands dead-tree copies are excellent) while *five-editions* have covered largely the same material with just rules tweaks (and very little updating to the art). So it only makes sense to explore other possibilities.

Quote from: Mercurius;1140343But yes, great ideas. I haven't delved in Talislanta for some years, but this is making me want to hit the books again.

Speaking of which, do you know if and when a print copy of Savage Lands--with the original game system--will be available? As I said, I backed the kickstarter via PDF only, but haven't read through it because I dislike PDFs. Would love to pick up a print copy, but everywhere I look says "pre-order."

EDIT: it seems like Chaosium picked it up and will be publishing it? I can't find an announcement but it shows up in online stores as pre-orders from Chaosium.

I have *no* idea when print copies will be made available to the public. It's a real shame too. The ones that were produced are excellent quality. But given that after Stewart passed, the publishing almost evaporated in mid-process (despite all the production being mostly done) - it's a miracle Nocturnal pulled it out. So hats off to them.

Since Chaosium is picking up the banner... it remains to be seen if it'll happen. I'm confident it will... but unfortunately I don't really know.

Quote from: tenbones;1140364100% agree. The whole team wanted this. But there is a "content value" issue that is a valid point to not doing 6e covering the modern era. It's a little sketchy to do a whole new edition with no intention of delivering meaningfully different content with a new paintjob (however awesome - as the Savage Lands dead-tree copies are excellent) while *five-editions* have covered largely the same material with just rules tweaks (and very little updating to the art). So it only makes sense to explore other possibilities.

The obvious solution, then, would be to "revive" either 4th or 5th edition. Not unlike how Chaosium did with "Runequest Classic". Then start pumping out new setting / lore targeted to it.

Oh - and by the way - I picked up The Savage Land (original edition) last night, and have been slowly making my way through it between work meetings today. So far - absolutely loving it! I'm not sure I like the introduction of the other polyhedral die, but it really won't bother me either. I love the layout work and how readable it is, too.

Quote from: tenbones;1140364100% agree. The whole team wanted this. But there is a "content value" issue that is a valid point to not doing 6e covering the modern era. It's a little sketchy to do a whole new edition with no intention of delivering meaningfully different content with a new paintjob (however awesome - as the Savage Lands dead-tree copies are excellent) while *five-editions* have covered largely the same material with just rules tweaks (and very little updating to the art). So it only makes sense to explore other possibilities.




I have *no* idea when print copies will be made available to the public. It's a real shame too. The ones that were produced are excellent quality. But given that after Stewart passed, the publishing almost evaporated in mid-process (despite all the production being mostly done) - it's a miracle Nocturnal pulled it out. So hats off to them.

Since Chaosium is picking up the banner... it remains to be seen if it'll happen. I'm confident it will... but unfortunately I don't really know.

I could be wrong but it looks like Chaosium printed the Original Rules edition and D&D 5e editions for the Kickstarter.  Mine both have Chaosium logos and number system on them.  Oddly the d6 version has neither so maybe that was done by someone else.

Quote from: SavageSchemer;1140366The obvious solution, then, would be to "revive" either 4th or 5th edition. Not unlike how Chaosium did with "Runequest Classic". Then start pumping out new setting / lore targeted to it.

Well there is absolutely nothing preventing Steve Sechi (the creator/owner) from doing that. But a couple of issues arise..

1) From his perspective "it's been done to death". As in - all the material currently free from Talislanta.com literally comprises about 97% of the content ever produced about the modern era of Talislanta outside of Savage Lands. And he's not wrong, as I said all the editions already cover a tremendous amount of ground. Much like post 2e Forgotten Realms has been done to death, largely. The issue is to pick something about the setting that hasn't been done and present it in the edition you prefer. He's a fulltime musician and has no interest in doing RPG publishing full-time on the side.

2) Publishing reality. Talislanta has always been lauded by its fans, and generally patted on the head by the rest of the gaming community that largely have ignored it. There already is a *hardcore* group of designers/writers/artists willing to push on (I'm one of them) but the realities of selling the idea and getting a publisher willing to do it to the approval of those involved is "tricky". If it were about doing it purely for the love of the game and not other "considerations popular in the current zeitgeist"* then there is a very good chance 6e would be happening (at least with me as part of it). But it might still happen... but I can't speak about what it would look like.

*I trust given the context of a lot of conversations on threads on this forum you don't need me to explain what that zeitgeist is. Yes, it's in play. And no, I have no acrimony for anyone involved about it. I just refuse to be part of it.

Quit trying to kill the dream, Tenbones! We don't need your level headedness dampening our unbridled enthusiasm!

(am am, of course, kidding)

Makes sense. I totally get where you're coming from.

I contacted Chaosium and they said Nocturnal is still the publisher, but they are "helping with distribution" and most game stores should be able to order a copy.

Quote from: tenbones;1140364100% agree. The whole team wanted this. But there is a "content value" issue that is a valid point to not doing 6e covering the modern era. It's a little sketchy to do a whole new edition with no intention of delivering meaningfully different content with a new paintjob (however awesome - as the Savage Lands dead-tree copies are excellent) while *five-editions* have covered largely the same material with just rules tweaks (and very little updating to the art). So it only makes sense to explore other possibilities.

Yeah, I hear you. It would seem, though, that any treatment of "other possibilities" (e.g. other continents) would require a re-issuing of the rules, at least within the new book.

I could also see a core rules PDF being in order that takes the best of all editions and streamlines it into a quasi-evergreen version of the game.

Reissuing the rules has never been an issue, heh. Most of the core task-resolution rules in Talislanta could fit on an index-card... would be less than tiny part of the book, Magic system not withstanding. It's the actual fluff and new races and cultural stuff that would be the largest change.

I'm have been a fan of Talislanta since its release in the 80s.  I still own most of the original printed books including all of the Cyclopedias and the world books.  I do not own a copy of the core rules book so I must refer to my PDF copy.  I do have a copy of the fourth edition D20 rules but since the publisher of that edition crammed the entire game into one volume it makes for a hefty tome.

I don't know if its been mentioned yet but there was an anthology of short stories released by WotC in 1992 called Tales of Talislanta.  I own a printed copy of the book.  I stumbled upon it in a used book store about eight years ago.

I'd love to get back into table top rpg gaming again but unfortunately I live in southern West Virginia where the rednecks and religious thrive.  RPG culture is to be found only among a few high schoolers who can't wait to graduate and leave the state.  Since a 50 year old man hosting game night with a bunch of teenagers could be considered "creepy" at best, online may be my only option.

Do it publicly.

GM's are the custodians of the hobby. And as a fellow traveler on this road in his 50's, the older I get, the more important I feel it's on us to help out those GM's that coming up so they too go the distance and keep this thing alive, hopefully with whatever wisdom we've gleaned from years in the GM saddle on how to do this thing we do.

My wife has been encouraging me to run "How to GM" classes at my local library (but then Covid hit). I was somewhat open to it... but because of my hectic work schedule kinda poo-pooed it. But given that I'll likely be working remotely forever now... I've warmed to it (aside from my other writing projects eating up my time). Pass it on, old man!

And Talislanta is a great game to start with, especially with younger folks that probably are more open to the exotic presentation of Talislanta. I know I was at that age.

I hear what you're saying.  I'd like to do something to that nature and I plan to introduce my 11-year-old foster son to it when I'm ready.  He's more physically oriented than mentally and so would rather play video games or football than play a game that requires imagination.  Not to mention a decent attention span.  My wife and I introduced him to Settlers of Catan and I just taught him chess so maybe I can get him interested in pen and paper RPGs.

As for other players, I'd like to run a game with some older folks who are interested more in the adventure/roleplay aspects of the hobby rather than hack/slash/loot.  All of my high school buddies that were into RPGs left for college or the military after high school and no longer live in the area.  I myself retired from the Army a few years ago.  I was gone nearly 30 years and beyond two or three guys I see around from time to time, there's no one here.  As I said, most people here are of the redneck bent and beyond hunting, fishing, and NASCAR there's not much that catches their interest.

My other obstacle is the religious sector.  Around here, church people are still betrothed to the old 1980s idea that D&D and role playing in general are tools of the Devil.  Trying to set up an RPG club for youth will be looked at negatively in general.  I know because I lived it in the 80s and was made to burn my boxed D&D set by my mother who bought into the whole lie.  Jack Chick and Patricia Pullman can kiss my a** all the way from hell as far as I am concerned.

But I see I have digressed far away from the original topic of the thread and so would like to relinquish my complaints back to the subject at hand.  Thanks for letting me rant a little.

Quote from: tenbones;1140521My wife has been encouraging me to run "How to GM" classes at my local library (but then Covid hit). I was somewhat open to it... but because of my hectic work schedule kinda poo-pooed it. But given that I'll likely be working remotely forever now... I've warmed to it (aside from my other writing projects eating up my time). Pass it on, old man!

Does that mean you're considering running those classes online, or publishing a video/podcast series? Or both?

I absolutely support more public play. Libraries are a great location. It's an "intellectual space" and open to the public (except during CoronaChan), and nobody would blink about an adult teaching kids a new game.

Quote from: tenbones;1140521And Talislanta is a great game to start with, especially with younger folks that probably are more open to the exotic presentation of Talislanta. I know I was at that age.

Agreed. I'm reading through 2e for Opa's play by post and all the exotic races would be a draw to teens.