Are you actually going to address the fact that even if your premise that video gamers don't know what tabletop RPGs are is correct (which I think is inaccurate to begin with), that isn't even brand confusion?

You conveniently sidestep any points people make and just insult them instead. How about addressing what people are saying? Could it be because you can't?

Also, aha, really? You are going to make fun of me for stating what I do for a living, as its actually relevant, and pointing out that I market a product that sells huge amounts, and that I'm one of the primary people in charge of running the campaign that made it successful, when you were throwing around your "Yeah, people keep throwing me money, yeah, I'm rolling in it" bullshit earlier. What a fucking hypocrite you are. At least the fact that I work in the field is fucking relevant.

Quote from: Emperor Norton;708866You conveniently sidestep any points people make and just insult them instead. How about addressing what people are saying? Could it be because you can't?

Not at all, I just don't think anyone who claims there's no problem with brand confusion between RPGs and RPGs has much to say worth listening to on the matter.

Quote from: Emperor Norton;708866Also, aha, really? You are going to make fun of me for stating what I do for a living, as its actually relevant, and pointing out that I market a product that sells huge amounts, and that I'm one of the primary people in charge of running the campaign that made it successful, when you were throwing around your "Yeah, people keep throwing me money, yeah, I'm rolling in it" bullshit earlier. What a fucking hypocrite you are. At least the fact that I work in the field is fucking relevant.

You forgot to challenge me to a fist fight.

Quote from: The Traveller;708850I fear you may be underestimating the pervasive popularity of WoW.

No. No I'm not.  Outside of the nerd circles, it is almost entirely unknown. AND, those who DO, know that they heard of D&D BEFORE Wow.

Which was my point.  Leave the mktg to professionals.  

Quote from: Arduin;708879No. No I'm not.  Outside of the nerd circles, it is almost entirely unknown. AND, those who DO, know that they heard of D&D BEFORE Wow.

Which was my point.  Leave the mktg to professionals.  

So... about that poster saying that WoW was advertised during the NFL games and D&D wasn't...

Here's that advert by the way, looks completely fucking epic.

I'm not even arguing whether people are confusing one for the other (I disagree, but that isn't even what I'm talking about right now), if you would read the actual post I made, you would know that.

Also, seriously man? I'm not the person who was running around from topic to topic calling a guy a Nazi, and you think I'M pulling an internet tough guy act? I called you a hypocrite because you are one. You dish out trash to everyone else, and the moment anyone insults the way you act you want to act like its a failing in them? Look in the mirror.

Quote from: Arduin;708879No. No I'm not.  Outside of the nerd circles, it is almost entirely unknown. AND, those who DO, know that they heard of D&D BEFORE Wow.

Which was my point.  Leave the mktg to professionals.  

Warcraft had TV ads running for a while. (Dont know if they still do.)

If WOTC has had TV ads up for D&D I've missed them. Not counting the Hulu advertisements.

So depending on timing. People do know about Warcraft in some minor way.

Quote from: Omega;708909Warcraft had TV ads running for a while. (Dont know if they still do.)

If WOTC has had TV ads up for D&D I've missed them. Not counting the Hulu advertisements.

So depending on timing. People do know about Warcraft in some minor way.

"Hi, Im William Shatner....and I'm a shaman!"

Mr T one was the best one.

Quote from: Emperor Norton;708942Mr T one was the best one.

"Night Elf Mohawk" is still one of the running gags in the community when talking about new classes, albeit a faded one nowadays.

Quote from: Omega;708253This is actually a good suggestion. But other companies would not accept it.

Other companies might not "like" it, though from a business standpoint they might have more to gain then lose by identifying their products as "D&D." The "d20 boom" of the early aughts may be proof of this. I can't say for sure as I'm not privy to any of the participants' financial info.

Quote from: JRT;708268Not to mention that turning a Trademark into a generic term is something Hasbro (or realistically any major company) would fight tooth and nail.

Yes, and WotC is the only one that would have standing to raise a stink about it anyway.
IANAL, but as far as I know, absent misrepresentation or confusion, competitors who want to emulate an established brand and release their own competing product have the right to tell consumers just whom they are emulating and with whom they are competing.
In other words, describing a competing RPG as "our version of D&D, only e.g. wherein John Constantine, Kwai Chang Cain, and Doctor Emmett Brown join forces against the Terminator" (Mage: the Ascension), seems like perfectly acceptable comparative advertising.
See Smith v. Chanel, 402 F.2d 562 (9th Cir. 1968) if you want a fuller explanation. Still not a lawyer, so please nobody take my word for it.
All that said, the complete and utter genericide of the D&D brand would be amusing, at least for anyone sharing my morbid fascination with impotent nerd rage.

Quote from: Dan Vincze;708969Other companies might not "like" it, though from a business standpoint they might have more to gain then lose by identifying their products as "D&D." The "d20 boom" of the early aughts may be proof of this. I can't say for sure as I'm not privy to any of the participants' financial info.

There was some effort to identify 3rd ed as "d20" and for years thats about all I ever heard anyone refer to 3rd ed as. That seemed to fade out when 4th ed came along.

Quote from: Dan Vincze;708969IANAL, but as far as I know, absent misrepresentation or confusion, competitors who want to emulate an established brand and release their own competing product have the right to tell consumers just whom they are emulating and with whom they are competing.

In the broader sense of the thread rather than specifically commoditising D&D, I wouldn't view MMOs and TTRPGs as competitors in any sense other than say MMOs and golf tournaments are competitors.

Although the D&D brand is pretty much what I was talking about, a clearly differentiated product, is it really representative enough to be supported as identification for the whole hobby?

Quote from: Omega;708992There was some effort to identify 3rd ed as "d20" and for years thats about all I ever heard anyone refer to 3rd ed as. That seemed to fade out when 4th ed came along.

Yes, the hobby tends to take its cues from the top. That's why a grassroots movement wouldn't be the best way to tackle the issue.

Quote from: Omega;708992There was some effort to identify 3rd ed as "d20" and for years thats about all I ever heard anyone refer to 3rd ed as. That seemed to fade out when 4th ed came along.

Yeah 3rd edition is when D&D tried to be GURPs. I think due to the OGL, the impression that was fostered was that D&D was a variation of D20 and not the other way around.

Quote from: TristramEvans;709040Yeah 3rd edition is when D&D tried to be GURPs. I think due to the OGL, the impression that was fostered was that D&D was a variation of D20 and not the other way around.

Seems like they are trying that again with D&D Next.
Though keeps making me think of the old Avengers Next comic...

So maybee in 2020 they can call 6th ed Ultimate D&D, 2025 7th ed D&D New Universe, and 8th ed D&D 2099 (Even though its only about 2030)... :rolleyes:

I'd rather play Fallout 3 on the computer than as a tabletop RPG, doing everything manually.  See Exodus.