Good evening everyone,

my name is Henning Hommel and I am currently writing my master thesis at the SRH Hochschule Heidelberg. In my thesis I compare the rules of tabletop RPG systems and answer questions like: How have tabletop RPGs changed over time? Are there trends that can be found in the rules? Can we find general tendencies in the changes of the rules as systems grow older? And what can we learn from all of this as Game Designers?

To validate (or disproof) my findings, I need experienced players who have played several if not all of the tabletop RPG systems I compare, and who can be seen as experts in this field (meaning they know many different tabletop RPG systems and have experience playing these games). In short, I need YOU to give me your answers and opinions in the survey I created. The focus of the survey is the difficulty and player experience when playing these systems.

The rules systems I am writing about are the following:

    Dungeons&Dragons (the original one with the Chainmail rules)
    Basic Dungeons&Dragons
    Advanced Dungeons&Dragons 1E
    Advanced Dungeons&Dragons 2E
    Dungeons&Dragons 3E
    Dungeons&Dragons 3.5E
    Dungeons&Dragons 4E
    Dungeons&Dragons 5E
    Pathfinder (only the first edition, the release date of the second edition is too close to my deadline)
    Shadowrun 1E
    Shadowrun 2E
    Shadowrun 3E
    Shadowrun 4E
    Shadowrun 5E


The survey is open until the 9th September and you can find it here: https://www.soscisurvey.de/tabletopRPGRulesSurvey/

Thank you in advance for your participation and input. Feel free to share this link with anyone you think has the knowledge and experience to help me with my work. If you would like to have a digital copy of my thesis once it is done (which should be around the end of September), please tell me so at the end of the survey.

Thank you again and game on!

I think you will find that overall RPGs have not changed all that much mechanically since their inception.

What has though changed is the jargon and depending on the game in question the overall scope of the rules.

Example BX D&D is just a better organized and clarified OD&D. The rules are overall the same.
But AD&D is effectively a huge collection of rules ideas, many originating in Dragon magazine and a rules overhaul while still being overall the same game.
2e Takes the AD&D rules and re-organizes them. Some functionality was lost in the process. But overall its the same game.
3e though is a new system. It still uses the foundations of the D&D system. But it is no longer backwards compatible without some effort. It is still enough D&D as it were.
4e was just about a totally new system and format with only a few nods to the original system. It reads and plays very much more like a board game than an RPG in places. It was not till the 4e D&D Gamma World set that the system was formatted to be more like D&D. Though the semblance was still rather remote even then. Essentials apparently tried to do the same. Too late.
5e rolls things back to something more akin to 2e and shares more with it than 3 or 4. Though it does draw on elements from all editions. It is a bit more backwards compatible with AD&D and 2e. Though still takes some work as the EXP system for example is very different. It is still enough D&D as it were.

Same with Shadowrun apparently. My experience is limited to 1 and 2e. 2e seems to try and fix some problems with 1e and overall seems to have worked. Though at the same time it feels oddly like something was lost in the process. Various overhauls while still being Shadowrun. Not sure on 3e and up.

Quote from: Esgaroth;1054721X

I'd recommend you head on over to The Gaming Den (tgdmb.com). The posters on there... specialize in the type of in-depth, mechanical and setting breakdown you're requesting. On here, you'll mostly get anecdote-based replies.

I did your survey - I know all the D&D editions (and have GM'd all extensively except OD&D) but not familiar with Shadowrun at all sorry.

Why would you do a Master's Thesis on something that won't get you a job?

Your Master's Thesis is your calling card, either for positions in business or advancement in academia.

Unless you are a trust fund kid. If so, carry on.

Quote from: PrometheanVigil;1054750I'd recommend you head on over to The Gaming Den (tgdmb.com). The posters on there... specialize in the type of in-depth, mechanical and setting breakdown you're requesting. On here, you'll mostly get anecdote-based replies.

Thank your for the advise, I'll check it out. Nevertheless, as the survey is mainly about player experience with the systems, I think anecdote-based answers will fit right in.

Thank you for your answer, too, Omega. I agree that (on the surface) RPGs haven't changed much, but nevertheless they have changed in the way they feel and the way they are being played. Contrary to digital games however, designers can't do this by little tweaks and balancing patches, as it would mean to put out a new, printed version of the rules every time. Sometimes this is and was done in magazines, or rules were changed in sourcebooks, but none of those would reach all players and therefore the game itself would stay the same as perceived by the masses. So instead these changes have accumulated until it was time to make a new version. This in turn then means that there are quite many changes from version to version, and that these changes come from very careful and concius decisions by the designers.

For example, as you yourself pointed out, 4e feels a lot different than the previous D&D versions (hence the still raging discussions about which one is preferred). But again, this was brought on by concius rule changes, and my aim is to find out which changes exactly brought this major shift. So again, yes, on the surface there haven't been a lot of changes, you still use dice and pen and paper, but underneath I argue there is a lot to discover.

Quote from: Spinachcat;1054766Why would you do a Master's Thesis on something that won't get you a job?

Your Master's Thesis is your calling card, either for positions in business or advancement in academia.

Unless you are a trust fund kid. If so, carry on.

Thanks for your concern about my future The point is I am actually studying game design and development and am already working in the digital game industry on a project basis. After my master thesis I will found my own company together with a friend, and I will keep teaching in the bachelor course at my university. But you are right, it's hard to get (and keep) a job in the gaming industry.

Quote from: Esgaroth;1054773Thanks for your concern about my future The point is I am actually studying game design and development and am already working in the digital game industry on a project basis. After my master thesis I will found my own company together with a friend, and I will keep teaching in the bachelor course at my university. But you are right, it's hard to get (and keep) a job in the gaming industry.

I do think having an in depth understanding of tabletop RPGs and their history is potentially valuable to video game development. I bet Todd Howard of Bethesda Elder Scrolls was at least somewhat familiar with open world D&D play from the earlier years of the hobby, rather than just the linear play that became dominant for RPGs in the 1980s.

I agree S'mon. Having a wide range of expertise across all forms of games is beneficial. No different than reading lots of varieties of books before becoming an author.

Quote from: Esgaroth;1054773But you are right, it's hard to get (and keep) a job in the gaming industry.

It's easy to get shitty jobs in the gaming industry. In LA, there are constant streams of entry level positions available. People get burnt out on the gross reality of "fun jobs" pretty quickly.

Good jobs with stability in the game industry? Now that's hard to get. And most of those have shitty pay.

The bad jobs are the ones I already got, so I will found my own company to be able to do even more shitty jobs with having to pay myself from my nonexistant money... wait, I might have found a flaw in my plan

Good luck with this.