Press announcement here (http://www.talesofthefroggod.com/index.php/products/the-tome-of-horrors). It's a 1000 page hardcover, and to be released in two versions - once for Swords & Wizardry (where the shorter stat blocks make room for additional background info and sample lairs), once for Pathfinder.
QuoteThe Tome of Horrors Complete
The Tome of Horrors? But that’s been done already; why do it again? Well, actually it’s been done three times, but never like this. With the advent of the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game as the newest torchbearer for the world’s most popular role-playing game, we need monsters—lots of monsters. That’s where The Tome of Horrors Complete delivers in spades. Starting from the original Tome written with the 3rd Edition rules along with the later releases of Tomes 2 and 3 for version 3.5, Necromancer Games was in the unique position to bring you updates of the classic monsters not formally released by the OGL, as well as, loads of new ones never sprung upon unsuspecting players before. So well received have these monsters been by the gaming community, that this open content has appeared again and again in game publications by other companies including updates to the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game system and even appearances in its own bestiaries.
Why stop there? Never before have all three volumes been updated to the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game in their entirety and released as a single, hardbound tome. Monsters from the aberrant to the yellow musk zombie appear in this book, and everything in between—that’s over 700 monsters. But that’s not all; the appendices bring just as much to the table from templates to hazards to a treatise on poison variations in nearly 50 types of venomous snakes. There are also new feats, planes of existence, strange beings beyond mortal ken, and plenty of charts dividing the compiled monsters by CR, type, and terrain.
But it’s more than just that, because the entire compilation has also been updated to the Swords & Wizardry rules for release as another version of the volume. And in this version, the space freed up by the smaller stat blocks is filled by sample monster lairs and encounters with the hundreds of different monster types featured in the tome. Never before has this massive selection of monsters been updated and brought with these resources all together in one place for use in your own game. And before any Pathfinder players cry foul over the monster lair additions in the Swords & Wizardry version of The Tome of Horrors Complete, this lair information will be available as a free download at the Frog God Games website talesofthefroggod.com for you to use as well.
So you’ve got the monsters—both from the original edition of the game and new,—the templates, the multiple appendices on rules, planes, and the n’gathau, and a truckload of sample encounters and lairs to throw at your players, all together in one easy-to-use book. That’s why we call it The Tome of Horrors Complete!
The Tome of Horrors Complete sample lairs will be included in the Swords and Wizardry volume and as a free download for the Pathfinder volume! This will be comprised of hex-style lairs by a writing team led by John Stater!
(emphases added)
I wanted to buy a 3.5 ToH I for years. The idea to re-release it for S&W is very appealing, actually, and I might look into that.
However, pricing seems prohibitive. The book costs a whopping 90 dollars, and shipping it to Europe adds another 46. That's too much of a deluxe item. I'd rather send Aos some money if he gets round to do his S&W conversion of Creature Collection.
Edit. Greg Vaughan, one of the contributors, added that the PDF will be on sale separately.
Quote from: Windjammer;445104However, pricing seems prohibitive. The book costs a whopping 90 dollars, and shipping it to Europe adds another 46. That's too much of a deluxe item. I'd rather send Aos some money if he gets round to do his S&W conversion of Creature Collection.
Edit. Greg Vaughan, one of the contributors, added that the PDF will be on sale separately.
This is an epic tome. I love the idea on an encyclopedia volume like this. I want the S&W version, but that price and shipping... I'll have to make choices. Can't buy all that good stuff coming out. I'll have to list all the items I really want in the upcoming months and decide what I'll purchase, and what not, from there. I'm getting
Astonishing Swordsmen & Sorcerers of Hyperborea, that's for sure.
Quotewe need monsters—lots of monsters
I actually read that the first time as, "we need money- lots of money"
Hey, at least there were no snides in the press release along the lines of "Remember when monster books were crappy 30 page softcovers with shoddy art? Well, those days are gone. This is not one those pedestrian OSR efforts, this is actual QUALITY STUFF (tm)!".
More generally, I'm pretty sure it contains some very high quality content. But I'm less sure about the idea to release it as one hefty tome. Hefty tomes are fine for prepping stuff at home. But for running a random encounter out of the book?
To be honest, most I was looking for was a reprint of volume I, because that covers some of the most iconic D&D monsters there are. Volumes II and III, while good in their own right, are not only the authors' own devisings, but also considerably more fringe (III got lots of animals, e.g.).
Finally, I'm not sure where they are going S&W wise with their page bloat. First, "Complete Edition", now a 1000 page monster tome. I wonder what's next in their line of S&W conversions.
Perhaps this?
(http://covers.openlibrary.org/b/id/951192-L.jpg)
Really, though, it sounds like a great book. I am just too cheap to spend that kind of cash, especially for S&W WB- the stat blocks are so small that I can usually make something up in extremely short order or convert something on the fly, if I feel the need.
Quote from: Aos;445118Really, though, it sounds like a great book. I am just too cheap to spend that kind of cash, especially for S&W WB- the stat blocks are so small that I can usually make something up in extremely short order or convert something on the fly, if I feel the need.
This.
It would have to be chock full of plot hooks and aventure ideas for every beastie in there to get my money. Stat blocks? Super easy for earlier editions of D&D.
The Pathfinder version will tempt me. But ninety + shipping is a bit much to come up with for a game book, even one that is 1000 pages. I will probably need to see the art first.
They should split the thing into two 500 page volumes.
The S&W Monster Book is one of the best purchases I made. I can't quite put my finger one why it is that much better as it very minimalist. But works great both in print and PDF.
Not sure what the Tome of Horrors, S&W Edition will bring monster wise but the expanded background and addition of lairs sounds vary interesting. But it largely sounds like a PDF Purchase. I have both the Monster Book PDF and the hard copy and I use the PDF far more. With the ToH PDF I would just print out the things I need for the upcoming session plus keep a printout of common area encounters just in case.
One thing that the Monster Book PDF does right is that the ToC is clickable at the beginning. So it real easy to jump back and forth across different entries.
Somewhere in the mass of text I missed it - What's the MSRP or pricepoint for the PAIZO version?
If we get that puppy at the store it might sell pretty well.
- Ed C.
As far as I can tell by following the link in the op, it's 89.99 usd.
At 1000 pages, I'd want to make sure that the binding was damn good for my $89.99.
Quote from: jeff37923;445166At 1000 pages, I'd want to make sure that the binding was damn good for my $89.99.
Good point. Another reason for two 500 page tomes. Better binding.
A 1000 page book is going to come apart without premium binding.
Quote from: estar;445148The S&W Monster Book is one of the best purchases I made. I can't quite put my finger one why it is that much better as it very minimalist. But works great both in print and PDF.
Not sure what the Tome of Horrors, S&W Edition will bring monster wise but the expanded background and addition of lairs sounds vary interesting. But it largely sounds like a PDF Purchase. I have both the Monster Book PDF and the hard copy and I use the PDF far more. With the ToH PDF I would just print out the things I need for the upcoming session plus keep a printout of common area encounters just in case.
I agree.
Quote from: PaladinCA;445198Good point. Another reason for two 500 page tomes. Better binding.
A 1000 page book is going to come apart without premium binding.
If they use a bookbinding method similar to encyclopedias (or the Ptolus book, in the gaming world, albeit probably with lighter pages), it could be a tome to survive a nuclear apocalypse. But the point is indeed very important: the binding needs to be top notch. That's a requirement for my purchase as well, not optional.
You know, most of us would want to see the book before buying it (to look at binding and other signs of quality) and at that price, I also wonder if many stores will stock it since it may not sell at that high price.
Quote from: jeff37923;445218You know, most of us would want to see the book before buying it (to look at binding and other signs of quality) and at that price, I also wonder if many stores will stock it since it may not sell at that high price.
Monte Cook had made tremendous efforts of marketing with the Ptolus book. This included one of the best campaign of communication with retailers I've ever seen, which basically included tons of information about the product upfront, regular updates about the production posted on the website, deals for customers asking their shops to order the product instead of getting it online, etc etc etc. I mean. That was just beautiful to see. I wish Necro/Frog God would do something similar.
Also, I just posted what follows on Dragonsfoot, and since this is related, I'll just repost it here too:
I would provide a strong caveat to my purchase: the binding needs to be top notch. And by "top notch," I mean encyclopedia strong. I would look towards Ptolus for comparisons.
From the Ptolus FAQ (http://www.montecook.com/cgi-bin/page.cgi?mpress_Ptolus_FAQ):
QuoteWill the binding on a book this big really hold together?
In order to make the binding as durable as possible, we used a process called cambric reinforcement on the first and last signatures of the book. Cambric reinforcement is a process and material similar to medical gauze. Actual gauze is wrapped around the page signatures and is adhered to the case. Normally in casemaking, the binder only wraps craft paper partially around the signatures. This reinforcement is a basic requirement in the library industry, and our printer tells us it's part of the National School Textbook Association's parameters for text book binding. It will make Ptolus' binding more durable and able to withstand more abuse.
See also Ptolus: the White Book (http://www.montecook.com/cgi-bin/page.cgi?Ptolus_whitebook).
(http://www.montecook.com/images/Encyclopedia400.jpg)
For a book at that price with that page count, I expect a binding that lasts
decades.
Matt Finch (Mythmere) answered my post on Dragonsfoot, indicating that "part of [the book's] cost is indeed the binding, because it's going to be smythe sewn. A glue binding on 1000 pages wouldn't just break, it would explode into a billion pieces."
About Smythe sewn binding (http://shopping.netsuite.com/s.nl?c=ACCT107430&it=I&id=84&sc=23&category=), for those who wonder what the hell that is.
Quote from: Benoist;445238Monte Cook had made tremendous efforts of marketing with the Ptolus book. This included one of the best campaign of communication with retailers I've ever seen, which basically included tons of information about the product upfront,
See also Ptolus: the White Book (http://www.montecook.com/cgi-bin/page.cgi?Ptolus_whitebook).
Case in point: he published that picture and info
45 weeks before the book came out!
Quote from: PaladinCA;445198A 1000 page book is going to come apart without premium binding.
In defence of Frog God: They rejected the hard cover binding of the first printing of Swords & Wizardry Complete because it was not up to their standard.
I'm interested, but will have to wait to buy. That's a lot of money for one book.
I wish they'd just done a "best of" all three books, and cut the page count down to 400 or so.
Quote from: Dirk Remmecke;445286In defence of Frog God: They rejected the hard cover binding of the first printing of Swords & Wizardry Complete because it was not up to their standard.
And the second. First was the binding, then was the cover-board material.
Why does the PDF cost as much as the book itself? That's ridiculous.
Quote from: Phantom Black;445431Why does the PDF cost as much as the book itself? That's ridiculous.
I imagine that's an error. Bill's only taking pre-orders for the printed book, and I bet he put the same price down accidentally on the pdf. Pdfs of all the other Frog God products are way lower than for the print copy.