Spears, Spearmen, and Skirmishers

Tod13 · March 26, 2019, 01:03:40 PM

Quote from: Spinachcat;1079859If you want spears in your fantasy, post-0e is not your friend.

Spears are very popular in my 0e games (and S&W:WB) because all weapons have a base D6 damage (with +1/-1 mods depending on the weapon), therefore players choose weapons not on damage, but based on their other characteristics. Spears can attack from the 2nd rank and you can set a spear vs. charge, and you can throw it or poke stuff too.

Yup. That's why in our homebrew we tied damage and defense to the character, not the weapon/armor. (There are a few minor caveats, unimportant for this point.)

This lets players build the character concept they want, rather than taking the "best" weapon or "best" armor. No, it isn't accurate. Yes, it is fun.

At least for us.

Razor 007 · March 26, 2019, 02:10:04 PM

Give me a strong, yet lightweight 7 foot Spear with a big, sharp spearhead; and I'd gladly use it as a piercing weapon in D&D any day.

Christopher Brady · March 26, 2019, 02:42:35 PM

Quote from: Razor 007;1080940Give me a strong, yet lightweight 7 foot Spear with a big, sharp spearhead; and I'd gladly use it as a piercing weapon in D&D any day.

Then you want a D&D polearm, most spears are 5-6ft weapons in the system.

Kiero · March 26, 2019, 03:11:28 PM

Quote from: Christopher Brady;1080946Then you want a D&D polearm, most spears are 5-6ft weapons in the system.

As we already established, the system is wrong.

Razor 007 · March 26, 2019, 03:45:14 PM

Quote from: Christopher Brady;1080946Then you want a D&D polearm, most spears are 5-6ft weapons in the system.

Well, 6 to 7 feet long would be comfortable for me. 8 feet or more would be cumbersome, and hard to use indoors.

Alexander Kalinowski · March 26, 2019, 04:27:25 PM

When the enemy cavalry comes charging in, 8 ft will seem awfully short to you, trust me.

Razor 007 · March 26, 2019, 04:53:02 PM

Quote from: Alexander Kalinowski;1080962When the enemy cavalry comes charging in, 8 ft will seem awfully short to you, trust me.

Longbows my friend. Longbows.

Alexander Kalinowski · March 26, 2019, 05:25:48 PM

Quote from: Razor 007;1080965Longbows my friend. Longbows.

You better hope there had been heavy rain or that you had time to set up on the battlefield to slow down their charge.

Razor 007 · March 26, 2019, 06:09:29 PM

Quote from: Alexander Kalinowski;1080971You better hope there had been heavy rain or that you had time to set up on the battlefield to slow down their charge.

Spellcasters, for battlefield control.

Christopher Brady · March 26, 2019, 07:55:53 PM

Quote from: Razor 007;1080965Longbows my friend. Longbows.

Not against full plate, that shit's HARD to penetrate.

Quote from: Razor 007;1080984Spellcasters, for battlefield control.

The real way to defeat cavalry.

In a fantasy setting.

Kyle Aaron · March 26, 2019, 10:47:43 PM

Quote from: GameDaddy;1080763You are correct. In WWII The OberCommando Der Werhmacht [made excuses]

Now, about the American Army in Vietnam [who also made excuses]

Yeah, we get the point. "All my successes are to my credit, all my failures are someone else's fault. Also this applies to anyone I think is kinda cool."

The Culture of Defeat examines how this plays out at a country-wide level, and carries on through the generations.

The first swordsman who got stabbed by a spearman would have had some excuses blaming someone else, too, if he lived long enough to speak about it.

GameDaddy · March 27, 2019, 03:02:29 AM

Quote from: Kyle Aaron;1081040Yeah, we get the point. "All my successes are to my credit, all my failures are someone else's fault. Also this applies to anyone I think is kinda cool."

The Culture of Defeat examines how this plays out at a country-wide level, and carries on through the generations.

The first swordsman who got stabbed by a spearman would have had some excuses blaming someone else, too, if he lived long enough to speak about it.

I'll read this soon. In WWI it was not at all certain that Germany would be defeated in it's quest to unify Europe. Before the Americans intervened, they had kicked Russia out of the war, and in 1917 actually initiated a new offensive in France using the troops from the Eastern Front. It will be interesting to see what your book says about this.

In WWII The German OKW knew even before they started that they only had resources for a limited war, and did not have enough ammunition, armor, aircraft, and oil to pursue an extended war, yet ended up doing so anyway.

I'll just read this, and then may have some further comments.

Tod13 · March 27, 2019, 09:30:18 AM

Quote from: Christopher Brady;1081011Not against full plate, that shit's HARD to penetrate.

Depends on the plate.

I really, really need to buy a copy of The Knight and the Blast Furnace by Alan Williams.

RPGPundit · April 02, 2019, 07:40:46 AM

Guys, keep it on topic. Talking about Spears IS on topic in this case, but geopolitics or other stuff is not.

JeremyR · April 03, 2019, 03:01:47 AM

The thread was dead for like a week, I don't think the admonishment was needed.

But I finished reading that Legion vs Phalanx book mentioned and it's quite interesting. While it doesn't really prove anything (beyond the fact that Roman legions with swords consistently beat phalanxes with pikes), it does cite the case of Dioxippus vs Coragus. The latter was one of the Alexander's soldiers and he challenged the other, a Greek Athlete to a duel. Coragus showed up in full battle gear, including a spear, a pike, sword, and a shield, while Dioxippus showed up naked but for a club. Dioxippus kicked Coragus's ass badly, dodging the thrown spear, breaking the pike, and then wrestling with him before he could draw the sword.