Quote from: McrowBy time all of the characters and the World is burned, the adventure for the game basically falls right into the GM's Lab. The way the character creation works tells the GM " hey, this is what kind of game i want to play". So it is very important for the GM to know the PCs very well since much of the adventure is generate directly from the traits ans such of PC.

See, now that sounds very promising. How does this work, in a nutshell? Anything ripe for plucking in use in other games?

Right now, for an upcoming Spycraft game, I am contemplating doing something like a little "pre game quiz", querrying players on things like how they like various genre shows and game to try to get a feel for what they like. Anything that can improve this process?

Quote from: VellorianOkay.

I'm really impressed with your collective knowledge of minutiae regarding a specific game mechanic.  I apologize for redirecting the thread down this path of inquiry.

Hehe.  Sorry, I let it get a bit off track.

QuoteThat was then, this is now: May we please return to a discussion of Burning Empires, since I'm very curious about it?  

Well it isn't Synnibar. At the very least it isn't a particularly dry, boring read.

It is however fairly 'crunchy'. An obvious offshoot from the requirement of having more encompassing, objective rules than many RPGs. It also covers a fairly wide range of tech in 4 catagories of advancement ranging roughly from mid 20th century to late 20th century-21st century and then into quatum level computing and large space ships and then up into force fields and blackhole powerplants.  The combat system also covers from personal through squad based ground battlefields up to space battleships.  The personal combat is sort of the exception, and is covered by a rule literally called I Corner Him and Stab Him in the Face.

A large balancing factor in multiple players against the one GM is that every character is built with self limiting relationships. Because of the Vaylen invasion the characters get put in a bind of likely choosing between their lifelong friends and family and winning a war. This isn't just an exersize in method acting though, it is supported and enforced by the underlying game mechanics.

Quote from: Caesar SlaadSee, now that sounds very promising. How does this work, in a nutshell? Anything ripe for plucking in use in other games?

Right now, for an upcoming Spycraft game, I am contemplating doing something like a little "pre game quiz", querrying players on things like how they like various genre shows and game to try to get a feel for what they like. Anything that can improve this process?

If you are just looking to lift that basic technique then Burning Wheel is not only cheaper but is a shorter read and gives it in more general terms.  Burning Empire is more a specific instance of the general plus with the setting added in. And prettier pictures.

I recall reading something about a Dune version of Burning Wheel.  Was that an official setting or fanservice?  I rather liked Dune and would love to see a game developed in the universe (although I've heard there are licensing issues).

Quote from: VellorianI recall reading something about a Dune version of Burning Wheel.  Was that an official setting or fanservice?  I rather liked Dune and would love to see a game developed in the universe (although I've heard there are licensing issues).

Burning Sands: Jihad

Quote from: blakkieIf you are just looking to lift that basic technique then Burning Wheel is not only cheaper but is a shorter read and gives it in more general terms.  Burning Empire is more a specific instance of the general plus with the setting added in. And prettier pictures.

Well, I'm probably going to be buying BE Friday one way or the other. So I am not so much looking to be "sold" on it as details and potential impact in game design.

Quote from: VellorianI recall reading something about a Dune version of Burning Wheel.  Was that an official setting or fanservice?  I rather liked Dune and would love to see a game developed in the universe (although I've heard there are licensing issues).

I'm not sure about the Dune version, it would likely be  a fan conversion.

could you be refering to the Burning Sands setting for BW?

Because of the obvious licensing issues it is called Burning Sands:Jihad.  It is a shareware style 88 page offical download from the site. I haven't played it or even read it though since Dune isn't really my thing. It is also, I've been told, probably a good idea to have played some Burning Wheel first to learn those rules before layering that extension on top.

I also know that there are a number of fan created setting stuff, including some Star Wars things. But you have to go through their message board for that.

[L=http://QUOTE=Caesar Slaad]See, now that sounds very promising. How does this work, in a nutshell? Anything ripe for plucking in use in other games?

Right now, for an upcoming Spycraft game, I am contemplating doing something like a little "pre game quiz", querrying players on things like how they like various genre shows and game to try to get a feel for what they like. Anything that can improve this process?[/QUOTE]

in short:

each character has beliefs,Lifepaths,Circles,Reputation,and instincts.

Beliefs:basically a description of how the character views the world. It should include a goal.

Lifepaths: basically the life experiences of the character. somewhat like a career.

Circles: represents the influence the charcter has in his community or professions.

Affiliations:organizations or people you have a connections with.

Reputation: your standing with in your circles and Affilitations.

Instincts: this is basically a truism for your character. An instict is something like "when traveling alone, I always carry my gun". So no matter what the situation, if the character is alone they will always have access to there weapon.

Between this and the world burner the majority of what is needed to start playing is already there.

[URL="[url="http://www.burningempires.com/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page%5Dhttp://www.burningempires.com/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page"]http://www.burningempires.com/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page]http://www.burningempires.com/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page[/url][/URL]

It's sounding more and more like Burning Wheel is really more of a "collaborative game" than a "role-playing game."  Would that be an accurate summation?  

Players gather to collaborate in the creation of a gameworld, characters and minute details about the setting and interaction, then they work together to create the gameplay and determine success or failure against various obstacles.

I'm not getting a real "okay, you meet in a tavern..." feel from this at all.  But, I'm also not getting an "ongoing campaign" feel, either.

Quote from: Caesar SlaadWell, I'm probably going to be buying BE Friday one way or the other. So I am not so much looking to be "sold" on it as details and potential impact in game design.

The impact I think depends a lot on how you currently GM. If you are already looking to do that sort of thing then it can probably help you avoid some pitfalls and give some pointers to help you get where you already want to go. Obviously though not using the rules in play is going require that you sift out and translate a lot of things.

So, and this is just a guess, I don't think the direct immediate impact is going to be huge for you. But I think you'll experience a lot of lightbulbs come on as you say "yah, that's kinda what I was shooting for". Although it might go further than were initially looking.

Quote from: VellorianIt's sounding more and more like Burning Wheel is really more of a "collaborative game" than a "role-playing game."  Would that be an accurate summation?  

Players gather to collaborate in the creation of a gameworld, characters and minute details about the setting and interaction, then they work together to create the gameplay and determine success or failure against various obstacles.

I'm not getting a real "okay, you meet in a tavern..." feel from this at all.  But, I'm also not getting an "ongoing campaign" feel, either.

BW is made for an ongoign campaign, no doubt about it and its a very traditional RPG.

I am going to get together with some buddies this winter and go through the Slave Lords series with BW, if that's any indication.  I won't be running the modules right out of the book but I wouldn't do that anyway.

Quote from: VellorianIt's sounding more and more like Burning Wheel is really more of a "collaborative game" than a "role-playing game."  Would that be an accurate summation?

It is more collaborative than many role-playing games. But it is still squarely a role-playing game in any sense.

QuotePlayers gather to collaborate in the creation of a gameworld, characters and minute details about the setting and interaction, then they work together to create the gameplay and determine success or failure against various obstacles.

I'm not getting a real "okay, you meet in a tavern..." feel from this at all.  But, I'm also not getting an "ongoing campaign" feel, either.

Likely because this is primarily the character and world burning parts that are being talked about.  Plus Burning Empires, moreso than Burning Wheel, has a fixed termination to the campaign.

Indeed the idea is that you don't end up with an odd collection of characters whose single defining common shared goal and trait is that they happen to all "meet in a tavern". The campaign all ties into the characters, and to do this characters must each have some tie to the others. Otherwise you'd have a multiple-personality campaign.