Quote from: Armchair Gamer on January 09, 2023, 01:06:49 PM
Full text can be found here: http://ogl.battlezoo.com/

A direct download link:
https://www.enworld.org/attachments/open-game-license-1-1-leak-pdf.271809/

Reading the new license it's clear that their goal is a total monopoly, like all the big corporations out there. The old OGL is out forever, and that includes the things their consider their IP (like owlbears, kobolds as they appear in D&D and so on).

If you play a game barely resembling D&D in any of its iterations, they want you to play official D&D (and pay a monthly fee for updates and a VTT). And they will destroy anyone else. The only way to be safe is to publish your own system, or write for CoC, Fate or a completely different game.

Yes, they're that evil.

Quote from: S'mon on January 09, 2023, 08:03:55 AM

Quote from: Armchair Gamer on January 09, 2023, 07:38:41 AM
  1 and 2 are correct, but WotC seems to be claiming the right to negate the older OGL either entirely or for any new product, and the original draft was going to go into effect Friday, January 13, 2023. Hence the concern.

Yes. They don't seem to have any good legal basis for this claim given the structure of OGL 1.0, but they have put many many game authors & publishers into a panic. This might conceivably result in many or even most OSR games vanishing.

Which would be a terrible shame.

Literally, from the leaked document:

X. TERMINATION. This agreement may be modified or terminated.
A. Modification: This agreement is, along with the OGL: Non-Commercial, an update to the previously available OGL 1.0(a), which is no longer an authorized license agreement. We can modify or terminate this agreement for any reason whatsoever, provided We give thirty (30) days' notice. We will provide notice of any such changes by posting the revisions on Our website, and by making public announcements through Our social media channels.

You may claim that the 1.0a is still valid, and it probably is, but do you have the money for litigation against Hasbro?

Quote from: Frey on January 09, 2023, 02:15:15 PM
Literally, from the leaked document:

X. TERMINATION. This agreement may be modified or terminated.
A. Modification: This agreement is, along with the OGL: Non-Commercial, an update to the previously available OGL 1.0(a), which is no longer an authorized license agreement. We can modify or terminate this agreement for any reason whatsoever, provided We give thirty (30) days' notice. We will provide notice of any such changes by posting the revisions on Our website, and by making public announcements through Our social media channels.

You may claim that the 1.0a is still valid, and it probably is, but do you have the money for litigation against Hasbro?

*Someone* will. It only takes one. Some of the bigger companies may decide it's in their best interests to not be a subsidiary of WotC for the rest of time, no matter how "favorable" their backroom deals might sound.

Unless you completely rewrite your osr game I don't see how the game is safe. Yes you can't copyright mechanics but ..

About the only hope in regards to the OGL, and I'd say its slim at best, is that this is the full leaked document and the official one has not been released, meaning if the outrage and pushback is severe enough might cause them to blink... particularly if it looks like backlash is going to put their couple hundred million dollar investment into a D&D film (that they want to use to launch it as a lifestyle brand) into jeopardy.

And basically, that's that. If you don't have the money to fight, you'd best brace yourself to transfer your products to something non-OGL because if Hasbro actually puts this out as is then it is simply not financially safe to do otherwise (nor, given the abusive language and ability to modify at will, is the OGL1.1).

Quote from: Chris24601 on January 09, 2023, 02:30:30 PM
About the only hope in regards to the OGL, and I'd say its slim at best, is that this is the full leaked document and the official one has not been released, meaning if the outrage and pushback is severe enough might cause them to blink... particularly if it looks like backlash is going to put their couple hundred million dollar investment into a D&D film (that they want to use to launch it as a lifestyle brand) into jeopardy.

And basically, that's that. If you don't have the money to fight, you'd best brace yourself to transfer your products to something non-OGL because if Hasbro actually puts this out as is then it is simply not financially safe to do otherwise (nor, given the abusive language and ability to modify at will, is the OGL1.1).

Abandon all hope. They will not blink. EA, Activision-Blizzard, etc are still multibillion dollar companies who treat their fans like crap and monetize above all else. 

They are kicking the OSR to the curb in favor of freelance content creators willing to work in their walled garden.

What has Hasbro-WotC done recently to give anyone any hope?

Quote from: Frey on January 09, 2023, 02:15:15 PMan update to the previously available OGL 1.0(a), which is no longer an authorized license agreement.

They do realize that's not how contracts work, right? You can't grant someone access to something in perpetuity based on an agreement, then arbitrarily change the terms and revoke the previous agreement. You literally cannot legally do so. This is just pure horseshit and they know it. They are challenging people to dare contest this in court, and they're willing to spend whatever it takes to destroy anyone using the previous OGL.

OSE: DEAD
Swords & Wizardry: DEAD
OSRIC: DEAD
Labyrinth Lord: DEAD
Dungeon Crawl Classics: DEAD
Castles & Crusades: DEAD
Mork Borg: DEAD

UNLESS you bend you knee to WoTC, kiss their ass, and use OGL v1.1

So any SRD other than 5.1 is basically dead now. Any OSR game will have to move off the OGL if they want to continue on, unless they're a 5E OSR game and they like the OGL 1.1 for some reason(I can't imagine how). Basic Fantasy has already finished their audit of the core rules vs SRD and is working to release a new edition that will be under the CC BY-SA 4.0 license. I'm guessing what we'll see is this happening with other OSRs and one of those(maybe OSE since it's so popular and light) will be the branch off point for future OSR style games.

As time goes on there will just be a further split between WoTC D&D and OSR systems since anything Wizards puts out will be radioactive.

Quote from: rytrasmi on January 09, 2023, 02:44:24 PM

Quote from: Chris24601 on January 09, 2023, 02:30:30 PM
About the only hope in regards to the OGL, and I'd say its slim at best, is that this is the full leaked document and the official one has not been released, meaning if the outrage and pushback is severe enough might cause them to blink... particularly if it looks like backlash is going to put their couple hundred million dollar investment into a D&D film (that they want to use to launch it as a lifestyle brand) into jeopardy.

And basically, that's that. If you don't have the money to fight, you'd best brace yourself to transfer your products to something non-OGL because if Hasbro actually puts this out as is then it is simply not financially safe to do otherwise (nor, given the abusive language and ability to modify at will, is the OGL1.1).

Abandon all hope. They will not blink. EA, Activision-Blizzard, etc are still multibillion dollar companies who treat their fans like crap and monetize above all else. 

They are kicking the OSR to the curb in favor of freelance content creators willing to work in their walled garden.

What has Hasbro-WotC done recently to give anyone any hope?

I personally won't be affected other than I'll now be competing using a non-OGL project I've spent years on against other non-D&D lines who are going to have to rapidly retool to remove all their SRD content or go out of business (because accepting the OGL1.1 will lead to the same result... just bleed you out first).

... but its still a crappy thing to do to claim revocation of a license companies have been relying on for over two decades and this version really does say you can't even sell your backstock of 1.0a material after Friday and also entirely removes authorization for the 3e version of the SRD... you can ONLY use the 5.1 SRD from Friday forward.

Troll Lord Games (Castles & Crusades) and Autarch (Adventurer Conqueror King System) have already stated they're pulling the OGL content out of their games going forward, and they have distinctive enough mechanics that they can probably pull it off so long as they're willing to put in the effort with regard to redoing spells, monsters, magic items, etc.

Quote from: blackstone on January 09, 2023, 02:58:09 PM
OSE: DEAD
Swords & Wizardry: DEAD
OSRIC: DEAD
Labyrinth Lord: DEAD
Dungeon Crawl Classics: DEAD
Castles & Crusades: DEAD
Mork Borg: DEAD

UNLESS you bend you knee to WoTC, kiss their ass, and use OGL v1.1

Just remove ALL references to their crap and publish with a different licence, CC By SA for instance with a declaration of what's not under it (art, game name, brand, etc.).

Quote from: blackstone on January 09, 2023, 02:58:09 PM
OSE: DEAD
Swords & Wizardry: DEAD
OSRIC: DEAD
Labyrinth Lord: DEAD
Dungeon Crawl Classics: DEAD
Castles & Crusades: DEAD
Mork Borg: DEAD

UNLESS you bend you knee to WoTC, kiss their ass, and use OGL v1.1

Dead? How so?

Do people play these games because they are the same as D&D TM or because they are different? Smart publishers will innovate away from the OGL and it will be a good thing for the hobby as a whole. "Oh noes! I can't fight a beholder TM in DCC!"

Hasbro-WotC has burnt a ton of goodwill here and the industry will adapt, aside from Stockholm Syndrome idiots who can't or won't learn slightly different mechanics and terminology.