I've narrowed it down to three possibilities, I think. Either a rogue, as dissimilar to the duelist class as I can get, since I think the other rogue in the group is heading that way. A barbarian type, multiclassed as needed with fighter, or ranger. Or a specialist wizard, I'm open to pretty much any school, though I'm probably throwing out evokation (since that's our sorcerer's forte anyway).

Quote from: CyberzombieTell your DM that he SUCKS.  UA is better balanced than most of the stuff in the splat books.  

I think it's mostly about consistency. The others didn't have UA available when they made their characters, so he doesn't think I should either. Or something like that. I could possibly argue a case for any specific rule in UA, but it would be a bit of a battle I'm not sure I want to bother with.

Quote from: Dr_AvalancheEither a rogue, as dissimilar to the duelist class as I can get, since I think the other rogue in the group is heading that way.

Hmm.  Well, I don't know if a social rogue will be the way to go -- doesn't sound like your group has much social interaction.  I'll have to think about this one.

Quote from: Dr_AvalancheA barbarian type, multiclassed as needed with fighter, or ranger.

Power Attack, Cleave, Great Cleave, Improved Sunder.  Brute strength is the obvious way to munchkin a barbarian.

Or you could be sneaky and do a halfling barbarian/rogue.  A halfling greataxe does 1d10 damage.  Couple rage and sneak attack and you've got a pretty deadly little bastard.  

Quote from: Dr_AvalancheOr a specialist wizard, I'm open to pretty much any school, though I'm probably throwing out evokation (since that's our sorcerer's forte anyway).

Well, you've also rejected conjuration -- not that they're worth playing without the UA mods.  Illusion and enchantment are usually too unreliable.  Necromancy is fun, but necromancers are weak compared to clerics.

That leaves abjuration, divination, and transmutation.  Abjuration is powerful, but tends to move you into a support role.  Divination you already know about.  Transmutation is a good all-around choice -- though with the dumbassed duration nerfing of 3.5, some of the best spells have been seriously weakened.

Oh, be sure to check out the Arcane Disciple feat in Complete Divine if you go this route.  You pick a god and then you get to add one of their domains to your spell list.  Divination is a good one if you go the diviner route -- you get spells like augury and commune, which are really useful for an arcane diviner.  And it even gives you a "valid" excuse to go into divine oracle.  :heh:

Quote from: Dr_AvalancheI think it's mostly about consistency. The others didn't have UA available when they made their characters, so he doesn't think I should either. Or something like that. I could possibly argue a case for any specific rule in UA, but it would be a bit of a battle I'm not sure I want to bother with.

Well, that would be okay, I guess.  It's at least not *as* lame.  

How are the new base classes in Complete Adventurer? I see I could play a NINJA!!! :ninja:

Unpredictable or not, make an enchantment spec. wizard. Ya might drop the ball sometimes, but when ya catch it, serious fun ensues. Just do everything ya can to max your enchantment save dcs and keep a defensive and offensive spell handy just in case Improved invis is reall handy for an enchanter too

Quote from: Dr_AvalancheHow are the new base classes in Complete Adventurer? I see I could play a NINJA!!! :ninja:

Ninjas seem okay, though I haven't played 'em or even really analyzed 'em.  From what I remember, they look like a great class for a halfling -- the abilities come together in wonderful munchkiny synergy.  

I have had players in my group try out the scout and ninja classes. The scout is definitely pulling his own weight and then some, while the ninja seems kinda weak in comparison to the rogue. The ninja's Sudden Strike is a lot more limited than the rogue's Sneak Attack (it doesn't work while flanking), though they do have their "go invisible" ability to compensate. However, going invisible can only be used a handful of times per day. IIRC, they also get fewer skill points.

I've always wanted to try a support character specializing in buff spells.  Probably a cleric would be the fun way to go with this, since your combat abilities won't suck.  That way, the NPC healer wouldn't be redundant.

-O

Quote from: DackeI have had players in my group try out the scout and ninja classes. The scout is definitely pulling his own weight and then some, while the ninja seems kinda weak in comparison to the rogue. The ninja's Sudden Strike is a lot more limited than the rogue's Sneak Attack (it doesn't work while flanking), though they do have their "go invisible" ability to compensate. However, going invisible can only be used a handful of times per day. IIRC, they also get fewer skill points.

What abilities of the scout has made it particularly useful?

The Skirmish ability has been pretty useful (my game is kinda combat-heavy). Sure, it doesn't do the massive damage that sneak attack does, but on the other hand it's totally under the control of the player - you move, you get bonus damage. The character in question has also taken quite a few archery feats, which lets him snipe from the sidelines while the other characters tie the opponents up in melee, and his speed is exceptional (he took a level of barbarian as well, in order to get the +10 movement bonus - total base speed 50).

He also has quite a few skills that prove useful a lot, as befits an 8 skill point class.

A bit of an update: In the end, I decided to make a diviner, with a strong secondary emphasis on enchantment and evocation. The character survived for a whole three hours before an invisible monk/assassin stabbed him dead.
 
Now, that campaign is going to be put on ice for a bit (until the end of summer, probably), in order to get back to the "main campaign", where I've been told to make a lvl 9 character. It looks like another wizard might be what the group needs, but I've been told that they're fine with everything, though the cleric presence is already strong.
 
The party as far as I understand it:
 
Dwarven Defender/Fighter/Ranger
Cleric
Cleric/Paladin/Fighter? with Diviner Cohort
Rogue/Thief-acrobat
 
The healing role looks covered. From what I understand the group has gone through many character deaths, so being the backup-anything is really a viable choice, especially since I'm starting at one level lower than everybody else.
 
Maybe simply go fighter-rogue? Straight ranger? Barbarian-fighter-rogue? A warmage perhaps?
 
Sorry for the inane babbling, but if you don't mind acting as the voices in my head, I would appreciate the input.
 
And if it's any help, I'm getting temple of elemental evil vibes from the game description. I expect dungeons...

Well, you could always go the evoker/spellsword route for this one.  By 9th level, you could have quite a bit of munchkinizing under your belt, even without access to Unearthed Arcana.  You could have pretty darn good spellcasting abilities and a decent defense by that level.

Of your other choices, fighter/rogue sounds the best, especially if dungeons are involved.  Evasion is your friend.