I just got a copy of Shadowdark and am wondering what people here think of it so far? I am wondering if it will dethrone Old School Essentials as my OSR game of choice.

I play in a game and it is fun, not terribly deep, yet not a bad game.

The general feel I get is Shadowdark is good, not great.

I'm warming up to it.  I dislike Vancian magic, so that's a plus.  However, what turned me off was the lack of classes to play.  That's less of an issue now.

This latest kickstarter may do even more good for class choices, but I'm still in a wait and see mindset.

Quote from: weirdguy564 on March 19, 2025, 10:14:22 PMThis latest kickstarter may do even more good for class choices, but I'm still in a wait and see mindset.

The new Kickstarter page has a link to preview files, which give you 8 new classes (and 1 new race, the Half-Elf) for free.  You can download them right now and add them to your game.  More classes will be in the finished product.

As for the game itself, it is good, solid, basic D&D with a few unified and modern mechanics.  Obviously, based on its success, many gamers want that in their "D&D".  Other gamers might want a more innovative and complex "D&D", so Shadowdark isn't for them.  But for good basic D&D, its a solid choice.

My only real complaints about Shadowdark are the following:

- hard to get my players to buy in when shipped to Canada it is $100 from the Arcane Library or over $100 from the only shop I can find online in Canada

- I wish the talent choices in the core rules were a larger table either a d10 or d12 to offer some more options and randomness

Other than that, I like the game and for DnD style games it is up there with BX (my personal favourite, as I own 5 copies plus OSE).

I run "long-form" campaigns. While I could do that with Shadowdark, I think it's fundamentally designed as a dungeoncrawling flavor of D&D that doesn't really do anything for my style of game.

I think there's some tiny novel mechanics in it, it's clean in presentation, but it's low-octane for what I need.

Looks interesting. I hear good things. I'm broke. It's on my list.

I know people like it. It's just not for me.

I quit "chasing" other systems long ago seeking some perfect game (this is just me speaking, not projecting on others). I'm not a collector for cool rpgs. AD&D2e is perfect for me and my group. I does what I want it to do. Loads of class/race/kit options that I can veto/allow like the tyrant DM I am.

I won't hate on Arcane Library......I just don't need it. People will say cleaner layout/mechanics/no THAC0....which is ridiculous, IMO. But I guess if you're that hung up on it.

An in print game is not an excuse. Older editions are in print with pod through drivethru.

And besides, minus a real short list of creators.....I'm real leery of creators and them telling me on social media they don't want my money. Not that Kelsey has done so....just a general mistrust I have.

Quote from: Thorn Drumheller on March 20, 2025, 10:54:27 AMI know people like it. It's just not for me.

I quit "chasing" other systems long ago seeking some perfect game (this is just me speaking, not projecting on others). I'm not a collector for cool rpgs. AD&D2e is perfect for me and my group. I does what I want it to do. Loads of class/race/kit options that I can veto/allow like the tyrant DM I am.

I won't hate on Arcane Library......I just don't need it. People will say cleaner layout/mechanics/no THAC0....which is ridiculous, IMO. But I guess if you're that hung up on it.

An in print game is not an excuse. Older editions are in print with pod through drivethru.

And besides, minus a real short list of creators.....I'm real leery of creators and them telling me on social media they don't want my money. Not that Kelsey has done so....just a general mistrust I have.

^^All of this.

Shadowdark, which might be a cool game, is mostly successful because of its marketing. It's the new shiny red ball aimed directly at those suffering Gamer ADHD.

Quote from: tenbones on March 20, 2025, 09:55:58 AMI run "long-form" campaigns. While I could do that with Shadowdark, I think it's fundamentally designed as a dungeoncrawling flavor of D&D that doesn't really do anything for my style of game.

I think there's some tiny novel mechanics in it, it's clean in presentation, but it's low-octane for what I need.

Do you just use Savage Worlds for all your long-form fantasy campaigns or something else?

Another dungeon-crawling fantasy game...no thank you.

While I bought the digital version of the initial release, I don't foresee actually playing it. There's not enough new to replace the things I can already do and the torch shtick is likely the first thing I'd drop.

Quote from: PencilBoy99 on March 20, 2025, 12:26:35 PM

Quote from: tenbones on March 20, 2025, 09:55:58 AMI run "long-form" campaigns. While I could do that with Shadowdark, I think it's fundamentally designed as a dungeoncrawling flavor of D&D that doesn't really do anything for my style of game.

I think there's some tiny novel mechanics in it, it's clean in presentation, but it's low-octane for what I need.

Do you just use Savage Worlds for all your long-form fantasy campaigns or something else?

I have to actively move against the gravitational pull of Savage Worlds to do 90% of the games I run. The reason why are precisely due to the things that I can't readily get from OSR products: fast conversion turnover WITH fidelity.

This has as much to do with me in my experience (i.e. I know what I want) vs. the time-cost of tweaking mechanics so they do what I want them to do, not just at the start of the campaign, but contextually to what's possible. My campaigns shoot for the bleachers. So my basic "thieves guild" campaign may start with the PC's starving and skulking through the sewers in order to become worthy to be accepted in the Thieves Guild. But it can eventually shift to them taking over the Guild, and the Guild taking over the city, and the PC's becoming Pirate kings, or national rulers - or whatever.

Savage Worlds has massive adaptability advantages. Whereas if I go OSR, I'd have to spend far more time making sure I "get it right". Most importantly, Savage Worlds scales to far higher power-levels that OSR mechanics struggle with past a certain point.

If I were to use an OSR product, it would be ACKS(2e) or Pundit's stuff- with the caveat that Pundit's stuff is very historically inspired which has a different tone than "standard" D&D, which is precisely what I'd use it for.

But I openly try to use things outside of Savage Worlds these days. And frankly there are systems I think that do some genres better than Savage Worlds - MSH for Supers (with DC Heroes also in this camp). I would *never* use an OSR system for Supers. I also dearly love the Talislanta system - which ironically would work *insanely* well as a setting for Savage Worlds, but I run it native until I get around to translating it.

I'm gearing up to run Barbarians of Lemuria in the very near future. I have to *actively* talk my players out of playing Savage Worlds now... (which is my fault as I introduced it to them... grrr).

Shadowdark is the best roleplaying game I can justify financially supporting. In summary, it's a stripped-down 5e with an OSR presentation, inclined towards dark fantasy dungeon-crawling. Is it perfect? No, but it's also very customizable, something I will be taking advantage of with the release of my Setting Guide in the near future.

Also, Kelsey Dionne herself is a cordial, humored delight who "keeps her eye on the ball", that is to say, she is focused on positively engaging as many potential consumers as possible, and has done absolutely nothing to make anyone feel chastised or unwelcome as far as I have seen.

I have virtually no interest in a "5E Lite" dungeon crawler.