New update on the pdfs and the slight delay...

QuoteGreetings, Shadowdark RPG backers!

I hope everyone had a wonderful weekend!

I have an update for us about surveys (which haven't been sent out yet, so don't worry if you thought you missed it). Here's the news:

1. Paying Backerkit! I got the Kickstarter funds (yay!), but my bank didn't allow me to wire any of it to Backerkit on Friday (not yay). In order to proceed with the Backerkit surveys, I need to have my bills paid with them.

Thankfully, I rose with the dawn to assail the bank's dark fortress the moment their hellish, iron gates re-opened for banking hours. After much struggle, I triumphed. Backerkit should be paid by the end of the day today!

2.  Review and Smoke Test! Once Backerkit is paid, they'll allow me to submit our survey for review. This usually takes 1-2 business days.

When Backerkit says we're good to go, I'll launch the smoke test that was originally planned for Friday. A random set of 5% of backers from each tier will get the survey and their PDFs.

Once 60% of them have responded, Backerkit will allow me to send surveys and PDFs to everyone else.

3. Surveys and Emails! My best guess is we'll be ready to send all surveys + PDFs between Tuesday and Thursday of this week, depending on how long all of the above takes.

I know folks were worried about missing the email, but don't be! I'll post numerous updates on here, social media, and via email when they're live, especially as we encourage stragglers to respond in the coming weeks.

4. Preorder Store! It will go live the same day the surveys are sent to all backers. So, by my most reasonable guess, between Tuesday and Thursday of this week.

Thanks, everyone, for your patience as we get all the little gremlins defeated. I'm excited to get surveys out, get those PDFs into your hands, and get our YouTube livestreams spun up in the coming days!

-Kelsey

PDF's are out. Books up for preorder now.

Quote from: THE_Leopold on April 21, 2023, 02:10:16 PM
PDF's are out. Books up for preorder now.

Compared to the quickstart how much is in the full thing?

Quote from: Slambo on April 21, 2023, 02:11:06 PM

Quote from: THE_Leopold on April 21, 2023, 02:10:16 PM
PDF's are out. Books up for preorder now.

Compared to the quickstart how much is in the full thing?

Player and GM quickstarts are 68 pages each.  Main pdf of the book is 332 pages.  So about 196 pages more of stuff, adjust for repeat pages in the QSs like covers, credits, etc.

Quote from: Slambo on April 21, 2023, 02:11:06 PM

Quote from: THE_Leopold on April 21, 2023, 02:10:16 PM
PDF's are out. Books up for preorder now.

Compared to the quickstart how much is in the full thing?

Both DM and Player QS was about 120 pages combined. This is  pdf is over 300+. 

all the monsters, all the spells upto tier 5, etc. a considerable amount more off content such as randomly creating monsters on the fly, tons of random tables. 

Let me post the index

Quote from: THE_Leopold on April 21, 2023, 02:43:51 PM

Quote from: Slambo on April 21, 2023, 02:11:06 PM

Quote from: THE_Leopold on April 21, 2023, 02:10:16 PM
PDF's are out. Books up for preorder now.

Compared to the quickstart how much is in the full thing?

Both DM and Player QS was about 120 pages combined. This is  pdf is over 300+. 

all the monsters, all the spells upto tier 5, etc. a considerable amount more off content such as randomly creating monsters on the fly, tons of random tables. 

Let me post the index

Thank you.

Sounds like Leopold and his crew had fun, and that's what really matters.

I thought that no creature had "night vision", was I misinformed, or was that  rule changed from the QuickStart set?

What lead me to this thread (and to reading—mostly—thirty-seven pages of comments) was the aforementioned weirdness of the hype for Shadowdark.

One YouTuber was even saying that the author is now the "king" of OSR—that whatever designers preceded her only wish they could sit where she now reposes. Something to that effect, and that is the sort of attitude that causes a thirty-seven (and counting) page thread.

Because it isn't true.

Now, one of the best explanations for the hype that I've seen in this thread is that a lot of 5e players are being exposed to old school style play. That isn't true of, say, Professor DM, but his channel appeals to 5e players as well as those who like earlier editions and non-D&D games. So, when he says, "you're going to love this game", my initial reaction is, "you ain't the boss o' me", but then I remember that he is addressing other people.

On the other hand, I am a conspiracy theorist, and when I see something like the same guy winning the lottery multiple times using the same exact numbers, I get suspicious. So, I understand the resistance by some to the idea(s)that

1. the hype for this game is organic, based on how amazing the rules are
and/or
2. the hype is a result of the author's mad marketing skills and networking acumen.

If Professor DM and the rest had said, "We have a friend who has written these rules that we think you are going to enjoy using at your table. They are a mixture of new school and old school rules, so we think you are going to feel comfortable whatever your gaming tradition. Here are some of the features we liked..." then, there probably wouldn't be a thirty-seven (and counting) page thread.

Instead, it was "this is sliced bread for D&D, and I was literally stunned for 2d4 rounds after reading them!"

The rules seem fine. The hype is what is suspicous.

Quote from: cavalier973 on April 21, 2023, 06:18:21 PM
Sounds like Leopold and his crew had fun, and that's what really matters.

1. I thought that no creature had "night vision", was I misinformed, or was that  rule changed from the QuickStart set?

What lead me to this thread (and to reading—mostly—thirty-seven pages of comments) was the aforementioned weirdness of the hype for Shadowdark.

2. One YouTuber was even saying that the author is now the "king" of OSR—that whatever designers preceded her only wish they could sit where she now reposes. Something to that effect, and that is the sort of attitude that causes a thirty-seven (and counting) page thread.

Because it isn't true.

Now, one of the best explanations for the hype that I've seen in this thread is that a lot of 5e players are being exposed to old school style play. That isn't true of, say, Professor DM, but his channel appeals to 5e players as well as those who like earlier editions and non-D&D games. So, when he says, "you're going to love this game", my initial reaction is, "you ain't the boss o' me", but then I remember that he is addressing other people.

On the other hand, I am a conspiracy theorist, and when I see something like the same guy winning the lottery multiple times using the same exact numbers, I get suspicious. So, I understand the resistance by some to the idea(s)that

1. the hype for this game is organic, based on how amazing the rules are
and/or
2. the hype is a result of the author's mad marketing skills and networking acumen.

If Professor DM and the rest had said, "We have a friend who has written these rules that we think you are going to enjoy using at your table. They are a mixture of new school and old school rules, so we think you are going to feel comfortable whatever your gaming tradition. Here are some of the features we liked..." then, there probably wouldn't be a thirty-seven (and counting) page thread.

Instead, it was "this is sliced bread for D&D, and I was literally stunned for 2d4 rounds after reading them!"

3. The rules seem fine. The hype is what is suspicous.

1. No PLAYER CHARACTER has nightvision/darkvision/infravision. PC's can't see shit in the dark.  Monsters all have darkvision. Bring a Torch.

2. Kelsey would deny that statement and laugh at how ridiculous that sounds. She give credit where credit is due to those that came before.  She's happy people are excited to try Old School Ideas and to share her work that she spent years making.   That's the vibe I get from the Acrane Library discord where she speaks to everyone. 

3. People wanted something different and the marketing and social media presence paid off. Shadowdark came at the right place at the right time and hit all the buttons people were looking for in something that is NOT WOTC/5E related.   The author was approachable and knowledgable and had a following from earlier 5E hits.  Combine all that together and you have a recipe for success.


We are slowly moving our 5E game to a version of Shadowdark rules that we can integrate with our much larger tactical type play.  We have a good months worth of work ahead of us and many more playtests to iron things out. Our goal is to be off of 5E/DNDBeyond by Q3/23.

I remember what I heard, now; if a monster joins the party, the it loses its night vision ability.

Have lots of fun!

It seems that, if failure to gain a "14" in some ability score triggers a reroll of character abilities, one might try rolling 2d6 and adding 6 to the total for each ability.

Greetings!

YAY! SHADOWDARK has dropped on me now! Fucking outstanding!

And OOH RAH!!!

Geesus, the game is delicious. I love how it remains easy, and simple, and straightforward. It is also fucking SWEET how when I have been reviewing the three Cursed Scroll Zines, each of them includes more rules for climate and travel, new spells, newclasses, new weapons and gear, as well as new monsters.

And--there are always more awesome fucking random tables of stuff.

All of these optional elements really combine to make the basic game *deep*. I am thrilled with contemplating creating new adventures, locations, and more using all of these elements!

The Cursed Scrolls, geesus, are awesome! Cursed Scroll (1) talks about Witches, Warlocks, Demons, and Witchcraft. Cursed Scroll (2) talks about Desert environments, Desert tribes, weird Desert Assassins, and fucking cool Camels. Silver-furry Camels! Cursed Scroll (3) talks about Nordic Sea Raiders! Vikings, baby! Seers, Sea Raiders, sea travel, cold weather, and fucking OLD NORSE Paganism! All kinds of weird curses and Norns spinning fate, and fucking awesome OATHS!

Add all this sweetness to the huge main rulebook, oh, DAYUM!

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Quote from: cavalier973 on April 21, 2023, 06:52:26 PM
I remember what I heard, now; if a monster joins the party, the it loses its night vision ability.

Have lots of fun!

It seems that, if failure to gain a "14" in some ability score triggers a reroll of character abilities, one might try rolling 2d6 and adding 6 to the total for each ability.

Well that's a bit odd for a monster to do but it makes sense since it'll be surrounded by light sources constantly.

3d6 straight down the line is the standard.

You have the OPTIONAL RULE that if you don't get a 14 in a single stat you can, if your DM allows it, to reroll all the stats.   We did the Inverse21 rule where you can take 21-Roll which gives all sorts of wild numbers the opposite way.   Few different ways to do the same thing.

Quote from: THE_Leopold on April 21, 2023, 07:34:13 PM
3d6 straight down the line is the standard.

You have the OPTIONAL RULE that if you don't get a 14 in a single stat you can, if your DM allows it, to reroll all the stats.   We did the Inverse21 rule where you can take 21-Roll which gives all sorts of wild numbers the opposite way.   Few different ways to do the same thing.

My system uses 3d6 straight down the line.  I monkeyed around with all kinds of ways to reroll or compensate for horrible rolls while still keeping the heart of that.  What I ended up with that works really well is: 

3d6 straight down the line.  Swap any two stats.  If you have no score above a 14, set your highest to 14. 

Easy to explain, easy to understand, simple to do.  Gives the player 1 decision with meaning.  So far, it has seemed to take a tiny bit of the edge off of really horrible rolls.  I have no idea if that lines up well with the Shadowdark rules, but given the close match on the surface, thought I'd toss it out there for your house rule consideration.

Quote from: THE_Leopold on April 21, 2023, 06:44:17 PM
3. People wanted something different and the marketing and social media presence paid off. Shadowdark came at the right place at the right time and hit all the buttons people were looking for in something that is NOT WOTC/5E related.   

I think that is a huge factor. WoTC's malevolence, greed & incompetence has created the perfect off-ramp for people to try other games. Without it I'd probably not have looked at Dragonbane and got hooked. I can see why people would go for Shadowdark, and why they'll go for the new Critical Role game, the new Kobold Press game, et al.

Quote from: cavalier973 on April 21, 2023, 06:52:26 PM
I remember what I heard, now; if a monster joins the party, the it loses its night vision ability.

Yeah, that is strange.  Goblin is a PC race in Shadowdark.  So a Goblin PC can't see in the dark, but a Goblin non-PC can?  Is there any explanation for that in the rules?

Quote from: S'mon on April 22, 2023, 03:18:06 AM

Quote from: THE_Leopold on April 21, 2023, 06:44:17 PM
3. People wanted something different and the marketing and social media presence paid off. Shadowdark came at the right place at the right time and hit all the buttons people were looking for in something that is NOT WOTC/5E related.   

I think that is a huge factor. WoTC's malevolence, greed & incompetence has created the perfect off-ramp for people to try other games. Without it I'd probably not have looked at Dragonbane and got hooked. I can see why people would go for Shadowdark, and why they'll go for the new Critical Role game, the new Kobold Press game, et al.

While I think that the game would likely have been a success regardless, it's certainly possible that some of its margin of success was due to having shown up at a great time for people looking for alternatives to WotC D&D.