Quote from: RunningLaser;803182FORGOTTEN REALMS

When I first got the grey campaign box, I was in love.  As time went by, I began to severely dislike the realms.

Yep. Me too Possibly Dragonlance for the same reasons.

Forgotten Realms for being the dullest dull setting that ever dulled its way into Dulltown. Even thinking about the setting anymore makes me feel like I'm losing creative ideas to the black hole of its horribly uninspired cliche-ridden existence.

Also Dragonlance. Like others, I thought it was awesome when I first read the books. When I was 14.

I suppose both of the above still work well enough for what they are, I just no longer want anything to do with them.

It's not out yet, but I'm apprehensive about the new setting stuff for Earthdawn 4e. I haven't kept up with the metaplot progression at all, and looking at summaries and such I've pretty well come to the conclusion I don't really want to. Assuming I can ever find another group to play with I'm thinking we'll just ignore all the Theran War and Cathay stuff and rewind everything to the freshly-ravaged world of 1e.

Quote from: TristramEvans;803228[BWorld of Darkness[/B] - Anyone part of the hobby in the 90s knows why.

Except for me. Actually curious, what didn't you like? What is this well known failing of which I know not.


To be clear, I haven't ever played or read World of Darkness so I am honestly ignorant.

Eclipse Phase.

Quote from: Doughdee222;803295pages were wasted with junk like songs

Yep. Never did join in and sing those round the table. Does that make me a Roll-player, not a Roleplayer??

Quote from: BarefootGaijin;803398Yep. Never did join in and sing those round the table. Does that make me a Roll-player, not a Roleplayer??

It depends. Did they include music or just the lyrics? Because just providing the lyrics and expecting the GM to write a tune sounds like lazy game design that no one should pay for.

Dragonlance.  The setting seemed cool when I was 14-ish. I now loathe it.
Mystara.  The introduction of Alphatia marked the beginning of the decline.  The Wrath of the Immortals finished the setting.
Forgotten Realms.  The Time of Troubles was annoying, the Spell Plague and the 100-year jump … just horrible.  (Confession: I still like 1e FR, and think that some of the 5e stuff is okay.)
Greyhawk.  The (little) post-Gygax stuff of which I'm aware seemed to suck the flavour out of the setting.

Quote from: Skywalker;803311Yep. Me too

Yet you're running Legacy of the Crystal Shard? :confused:

Quote from: Akrasia;803403Yet you're running Legacy of the Crystal Shard? :confused:

The adventure is great, and FR is so bland a setting its only a very small part of the adventure.

Quote from: Doughdee222;803295Star Frontiers. I still like the game and the original setting wasn't terrible. But like everyone else I wonder where the homeworlds are. I would like to see someone put out a whole new environment for that game.

Dont have the books handy but I believe either Knight Hawks or a Dragon article explained a few of the homeworlds. There were also hints that possibly the whole area was seeded by some Precursor race. I thought White Light was the human homeworld.

I'll have to dig my stuff out and see.

Quote from: Bren;803397Except for me. Actually curious, what didn't you like? What is this well known failing of which I know not.


To be clear, I haven't ever played or read World of Darkness so I am honestly ignorant.

METAPLOT. OWoD are the ones that made that a dirty word. Google "Sam Haite" some time if you're in the mood for a groan-laugh.

I think WW discovered that the majority of their audience were buying and reading their games rather than playing them, so the entire world became an ongoing fanfic collective story that made less and less sense as each splatbook had to make every single supernatural person into a special snowflake, and pretty soon about 50% of the population of the earth was some sort of supernatural creature. Just about every historical person you can think of was revealed to be a vampire of some sort, and then there were the intergalactic space-monsters that the Sabbat were secretly fighting, because every group had to have its own Secret War, and...well, it just got really really silly, but it being 90s gothic angst, it took itself so seriously, so there wasnt the black humour that tied together other kitchen-sink settings like, say, WH40k. WW online games were notorious for instantly devolving into giant flame wars over continuity (as were the LARPS, but from what I heard they had bigger problems).

Quote from: TristramEvans;803414METAPLOT. OWoD are the ones that made that a dirty word. Google "Sam Haite" some time if you're in the mood for a groan-laugh.

I had to look him up, having been knee-deep in the 90s angsty goth phase of WoD.

His actual name was Sam Haight and supposedly he was a joke by the designers. Whether that's true or not, he apparently got soul-forged into an ashtray in the Wraith world. Ha Ha!

http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Samuel_Haight

EDIT: his description pretty much reminds me of 80% of the WoD player characters that I met out there from various player groups. People sure LOVED their super-rich 7th generation vampire-mage-vagabonds with dual silver katanas and magical uzis. I gave up that setting when I figured out that it wasn't at all about introspective personal horror but who was the fastest killing machine.

Quote from: Necrozius;803421I had to look him up, having been knee-deep in the 90s angsty goth phase of WoD.

His actual name was Sam Haight and supposedly he was a joke by the designers. Whether that's true or not, he apparently got soul-forged into an ashtray in the Wraith world. Ha Ha!

http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Samuel_Haight

EDIT: his description pretty much reminds me of 80% of the WoD player characters that I met out there from various player groups. People sure LOVED their super-rich 7th generation vampire-mage-vagabonds with dual silver katanas and magical uzis. I gave up that setting when I figured out that it wasn't at all about introspective personal horror but who was the fastest killing machine.

The designers were very bad at telling jokes, in that "we take ourselves incredibly seriously and so should you. Oh look, we made a little funny. See how awesome we are? NO! NO HUMOUR FROM YOU, ONLY WE THE SETTING GODS CAN JOKE!!!!"


That wiki entry also seems to gloss over the many years that he haunted the supplements of multiple gamelines. I swear I remember him being bit by a vampire at some point too.

Quote from: TristramEvans;803414METAPLOT. OWoD are the ones that made that a dirty word. Google "Sam Haite" some time if you're in the mood for a groan-laugh.

Thanks for the explanation. Sam Haite appeared about half way down page two of my search. So maybe his infamy is fading. He sounds like a caricature of the a friendless, orphan loner uber-PC.

Re: Metaplot
Metaplot seems like something that can only work at the micro level not the macro level. By that I mean, you might create a metaplot for one person's campaign (micro level) with some hope of it being useful after the players get involved, but trying to create a metaplot that will be useful for everyone's campaign (macro level) is doomed to failure. The only way it can succeed is to keep the metaplot at a level too high for the PCs to affect it, in which case it may be part of the setting but it isn't all that useful for the PCs since they can't actually interact with it. The pitfalls seem like something any GM who had ever run two different groups of players through the same scenario or even the same dungeon should have been able to anticipate from experience.

EDIT: Scooped. Also I'm not alone in my impression of Sam Haight as a PC caricature.

Quote from: TristramEvans;803296This is the second time I've heard this obliquely referenced, but what exactly did SJG do recently? All I hear is "attitude" and "stunts pulled", but outside of this forum I've never seen anything from them since GURPs 4th limpdicked onto the scene then disappeared, taking with it 3rd's exceptional library of supplements.

Oh I'be bitched about SJG more than twice. You must have been lucky and missed the others...

They have gotten gradually more strict over the years and they have in the past policed and interfered in other folks IP by threatening fan sites. Which was where I first ran into this mess as they indirectly caused some material I and others had released with permission to a fan site to be deleted. Material that was in no way SJGs at all. That set the tone thereafter to adversarial.

I dont mind when they are policing their own stuff. I do mind when they stick their noses in matters not theirs. And even with their own IP they can be a bit heavy handed. Though in one case I have to agree that acting was justified. But they went a bit overboard. Which is the recurring theme now.

So that gradually wears down my interest in any of their product.

Back on topic.
White Wolfs Werewolf setting. Guess I am the only one who got sick and tired of the Nuwisha coyotes trumping about every single other race whos book they make a cameo in. They even pop up in the Hengyokai book.

But overall the shifts in tone of the series turned me off the setting. Too abrupt? Too broad? Maybee I was just unlucky in what points I hit it at.

Not sure if Trinity counts? For me the transition from Aberrant to Trinity was a low point as Trinity reveals that the novas apparently went nuts and then left the Earth. Otherwise was interesting. Convoluted, but interesting. But then one expects convoluted from WW. Id still rather play Aberrant if given the choice.

Quote from: Akrasia;803402Greyhawk.  The (little) post-Gygax stuff of which I'm aware seemed to suck the flavour out of the setting.

That was my feeling too. Same for Mystarra. The Gazetteers.