Two classic megadungeons from which I hear a lot of praise.
For fans of one or the other, tell me what these adventures bring to me as a DM.
The name 'Rappan Athuk' always sounded intriguing to me but nothing I've read about it suggests that there's all that much unique about it besides the size.
Barrowmaze is basically one huge dungeon level with a plethora of entrances from the surface. It's a dungeon very much about the creep factor and the undead. It's got factions and all sorts of fun stuff too. If you like the idea of a cemetery/undead dungeon, you're probably going to like it.
Rappan Athuk is huuuge. The levels are generally small-ish to me, but there are dozens of them included in the current product incarnation (around 50 including some really tiny ones, small-ish encounter focused ones, and a few larger). The surrounding wilderness has grown and could be used for something else on its own merit. I think RA will be too big, too pixelated, too much for quite a few DMs out there, but it's far from impossible to run an epic campaign with it. It might be great to 'cut and paste' bits and pieces into your own campaign, too.
Quote from: Benoist;692433Rappan Athuk is huuuge. The levels are generally small-ish to me...
To me, too. It also lacks a low-level environment. However, didn't Mythmere create some stuff to address both of those points? Maybe in the S&W version? (I have the original 3.0 modules and the 3.5 boxed set, but nothing after that.)
Quote from: Philotomy Jurament;692447To me, too. It also lacks a low-level environment. However, didn't Mythmere create some stuff to address both of those points? Maybe in the S&W version? (I have the original 3.0 modules and the 3.5 boxed set, but nothing after that.)
Maybe the plethora of sub-levels is supposed to address the relative smallish size of most maps. It's sure that taking in considerations all the links between the levels, the whole is really big and gives a ton of choices of paths of exploration to the players. It's not exactly the same thing in my mind, though.
The lack of low level material is addressed in the current Frog God Games version: it notably includes the ruins of a frog-worshipping cult, a kind of homage to Dave, I think, that might bring players up a bit and allow them to tackle the dungeon proper - it was authored by Melan if I'm not mistaken so he might have insights of his own. There's the wilderness around the dungeon that's been greatly expanded upon, with low as well as higher level threats scattered around. It's a very busy environment though and therefore, I imagine, not for everyone, but then what is, right?
Quote from: Philotomy Jurament;692447To me, too. It also lacks a low-level environment. However, didn't Mythmere create some stuff to address both of those points? Maybe in the S&W version? (I have the original 3.0 modules and the 3.5 boxed set, but nothing after that.)
Frog God added a bunch of low-level stuff (wilderness, separate dungeons, extra levels, etc.) to the Kickstarted version, both S&W and Pathfinder. Like you, I own the earlier versions, and I've been debating buying the Kickstarter version for some time now, basically because of the additional material (and it being S&W).
EDIT: D'oh! Ninja'ed by Benoist!
Hm. I should just sell the 3.5 boxed set and replace it with the S&W version.
I was lucky to play in a game with Rappan Athak, or however it is spelled.
It was great fun.
As a more experienced player so many years later, I would say it offers ideas, and a good framework for a high level campaign.
People that hate modules need not apply :)
Quote from: Philotomy Jurament;692480Hm. I should just sell the 3.5 boxed set and replace it with the S&W version.
You should be able to sell it for a bit more than enough to buy the main Kickstarter version book ($100). Rappan Athuk Reloaded (the 3.5 boxed set) goes for between $100-$150 on eBay.
I'm playing in a game using Barrowmaze, and having fun. I suppose the selling point for the GM is content. Including some digressions in play to other destinations, we're 8 or 9 months into a weekly 3 hour game and still mapping the darn place. I'm guessing that's not a bad return on investment for the GM, in prep time as much as money.
The obvious qualification is that you and your players need to like dungeons on some level (and undead, and tomb robbing) for the whole package to make sense.
This is actually my first direct play experience with a mega-dungeon tent-pole to a campaign. From the player's side, I'm enjoying not being on a GM-imposed quest. We're going in for gold and xp, but we don't have to go any particular place, achieve any particular goal, or even clear the place out. (We may yet try to clear it anyway, the group includes that kind of player :o ...but we don't have to.) So I'd say its the kind of thing you can place in your campaign to provide some depth and variety, and even if your players don't "finish" the dungeon, you'll still have gotten a lot of play out of it, and maybe implied a world that's bigger than just the party.
I've never run Rappan Athuk; but I did recently run Barrowmaze. My "Dark Albion" player group who are NOT usually big fans of large dungeons absolutely fucking loved it. It was probably the most positive response to a dungeon that group has ever displayed.
Quote from: Benoist;692453The lack of low level material is addressed in the current Frog God Games version: it notably includes the ruins of a frog-worshipping cult, a kind of homage to Dave, I think, that might bring players up a bit and allow them to tackle the dungeon proper - it was authored by Melan if I'm not mistaken so he might have insights of his own.
That's correct.
Cloister of the Frog-God, while it is not for beginner PCs, has ruins, dungeons and frog-worshipping monks for low-level gaming. It is based on materials I wrote for Tegel Manor so many years ago, although it has been completely reorganised, rewritten and re-tested to suit its new purpose. It has an 'Averoigne' feel if that makes sense.
In hindsight it was probably not a good idea to submit it for Rappan Athuk, since it is a module of its own, and it is buried in a huge tome where it is overshadowed by the core dungeon. A pity, since it is a work I am very proud of - it certainly played well. But that's hindsight.
The new RA also includes a level by Mythmere that's for newly rolled up characters, and more stuff.
One of the best things about Barrowmaze is that it is Plug n Play. There are a few pages in the front that need to be read first, but after that you can just run it without internalizing all the material. That was a design feature (at least of the first one, I have yet to see the second).