Quote from: Headless;985237Still thinking about how to change players from reactive to active.

IMO the trick is for the players to actually care about the outcome.
For example, it is easy to get into an Adventure Path, or video game RPG mindset of "Here's the task/quest/mission/adventure, go do it!" And this will work, since the alternative is not to game at all. (Or flail about when the GM is unprepared and does a poor job of improvising) I'm not above using it.
Usually these tasks are for someone else. Get me some bear asses, or power crystals, or collector's stamps. But if the players want those bear asses, or power crystals or collector's stamps for themselves, they're going to be more engaged with the adventure.
Much better, especially after a first session, is to sprinkle adventure hooks along the way during that adventure. Rumors (Let us take a moment to rememer the very fine idea of rumor tables from old school modules) hints, files, maps (again, remember that treasure maps were once on the treasure tables) The ones the players focus on are the ones they care about, and thus worth fleshing out for the next session. And I've found that asking the players at the end of a session, what rumor things they will want to follow up on next session, works very well for that.

Maybe checkout the PbtA The Sprawl. My understanding is that it is a mission oriented, often one-shot Cyberpunk game. Seems it may have been an influence on Blades in the Dark which is the new hotness these days.

Quote from: Headless;987378Even when they do, the players often don't listen.

Well, if the GM described things clearly, but they chose not to listen, that's their problem.

Quote from: RPGPundit;988585Well, if the GM described things clearly, but they chose not to listen, that's their problem.

?


What am I going to say?  Oh you let the mysterious stranger lead you to a dead end hall way and close the door behind you.  Over the next three weeks you all slowly strave to death.  Now get the fuck out of my house.

Its clearly my problem too.  

In general people don't listen to other peoples deal.  And forget about email.   Lawyers don't even read email.

I've never done it, but I've always thought it would be neat to start a WW2 game in the landing craft just as the ramps are about to drop at Omaha beach. Give each player a half dozen PCs (and probably have another dozen ready to go) and then let the meat grinder begin. I imagine it would give the players some appreciation for the surviving PCs and ramps up the feeling of yes PCs can die since many of the PCs would have been killed by the time the "party" is formed.

I don't see why something similar couldn't be done with other genres. Certainly not going to work for everybody.

Quote from: Headless;987378Even when they do, the players often don't listen.

This is an issue I've often had with the idea of social stats / skills should be based on the player, not PC. It is not always easy to pick up on every nuance of a description, particularly for people who are visual. If in passing you mention that there is an odd patch of moss-less stone near the wall, I might miss it. If I were actually standing there I would probably be thinking, well that is odd.

Just saying sometimes the GM needs to whack the players over the head to get their attention. Give the PCs an INT roll or similar to notice that crucial thing like well isn't that odd that we are being led into an empty room.

Also this

[video=youtube;IJZM3X4dpzo]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IJZM3X4dpzo[/youtube]

Quote from: Headless;988728?


What am I going to say?  Oh you let the mysterious stranger lead you to a dead end hall way and close the door behind you.  Over the next three weeks you all slowly strave to death.  Now get the fuck out of my house.

Its clearly my problem too.  

In general people don't listen to other peoples deal.  And forget about email.   Lawyers don't even read email.

Again, we are first and foremost assuming you gave clear and coherent information about whatever the PCs should know and understand.

If, given the above assumption, the Players still choose not to listen, and the result is a TPK, then the result should be a TPK.
Then you can start another game, and hopefully the players will have learned from their errors.

If they don't learn then you may need a better quality of players.