Running AD&D but never played it

Gronan of Simmerya · September 16, 2017, 08:44:55 PM

Quote from: saskganesh;992970You don't have to do anything except role play.

LG types are generally well liked, especially the Paladin (check out loyalty/reaction bonuses - and Pally's CHA starts at 17). It follows that many people will naturally want to help and reward them, more so than a bunch of wandering graverobbers. Good takes care of good, something non good types find hard to believe.

Plus, in OD&D evil clerics CANNOT heal, period. Amazing incentive to be pals with a few good types, even if you yourself are neutral.

Also, once the undead start showing up, the Good cleric is everybody's best pal!

GrabtharsHammer · September 16, 2017, 09:59:17 PM

I'm looking through my materials and can't wait to get our game going. Thanks everyone for their input, I'll update as I go even though no one gives a shit because evil clerics can't heal. Or whatever.

Dumarest · September 16, 2017, 10:13:15 PM

Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;992953Pedantry is the recourse of those who have nothing to say but cannot bear to remain silent.

You realize the irony of responding with that, I assume!

Willie the Duck · September 16, 2017, 10:28:19 PM

Quote from: Armchair Gamer;992901I really need to sit down one of these days and work out modifications and alternatives for those of us who actually like the Lawful/Good default, heroic epic quest model.

You could always get a copy of 2e AD&D for flavor, and use whichever ruleset you prefer (and/or mix and match in basic).

Quote from: Armchair Gamer;992960Possible, yes, by all means. But are the as-written rules of OD&D, Basic, or AD&D the best for it, or could they be tweaked to better encourage and support it?

Honestly, other than xp=gp vaguely incentivizing a practical mercenary quality over focusing on doing the right thing at all times, there's very little in the rules to discourage heroic play (cautious heroic play). And as Gronan points out, certain incentives to at least be within 'good-will-do-business-with-you' range of heroism.

Armchair Gamer · September 16, 2017, 10:50:07 PM

Quote from: Willie the Duck;993057You could always get a copy of 2e AD&D for flavor, and use whichever ruleset you prefer (and/or mix and match in basic).

I have 2E--original and Premium editions.

Plus the RC and the BECMI boxes.

QuoteHonestly, other than xp=gp vaguely incentivizing a practical mercenary quality over focusing on doing the right thing at all times, there's very little in the rules to discourage heroic play (cautious heroic play). And as Gronan points out, certain incentives to at least be within 'good-will-do-business-with-you' range of heroism.

XP for GP was the big one I was thinking of, along with reducing the lethality curve and maybe tweaking classes a bit. The major question is whether 2E, BECMI, or C&C works best as a baseline for the lighter and more traditional approach. (For heavier rules, there's Hero; for more over-the-top, BESM or 4E.)

Gronan of Simmerya · September 16, 2017, 10:51:46 PM

Quote from: Willie the Duck;993057Honestly, other than xp=gp vaguely incentivizing a practical mercenary quality over focusing on doing the right thing at all times, there's very little in the rules to discourage heroic play (cautious heroic play). And as Gronan points out, certain incentives to at least be within 'good-will-do-business-with-you' range of heroism.

And take a look what happens in OD&D when a Patriarch gets a stronghold. He/she gets TONS of extra goodies for being a good cleric.

You can easily be a lawful good-guy type in OD&D. Just set up a world where NPCs will respond favorably.

The default world of Greyhawk as Gary ran it, alas, is WAY too inspired by Dying Earth. It's one thing for somebody to betray you for advantage, but on DE about 95% of the people will fuck you over just because.

Voros · September 17, 2017, 01:59:02 AM

Quote from: Armchair Gamer;993073I have 2E--original and Premium editions. Plus the RC and the BECMI boxes.

XP for GP was the big one I was thinking of, along with reducing the lethality curve and maybe tweaking classes a bit. The major question is whether 2E, BECMI, or C&C works best as a baseline for the lighter and more traditional approach. (For heavier rules, there's Hero; for more over-the-top, BESM or 4E.)

To me it is BECMI but I'm biased as that's my favourite edition.

Willie the Duck · September 17, 2017, 08:19:20 PM

Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;993074And take a look what happens in OD&D when a Patriarch gets a stronghold. He/she gets TONS of extra goodies for being a good cleric.

I see they get strongholds full of Heroes, superheroes, Ents, and Hippogryphs (as opposed to the evil high priest's trolls, vampires, spectres, and wild apes) and may demand 10% carried wealth as a tithe. Were you thinking of anything else?

QuoteYou can easily be a lawful good-guy type in OD&D. Just set up a world where NPCs will respond favorably.

The default world of Greyhawk as Gary ran it, alas, is WAY too inspired by Dying Earth. It's one thing for somebody to betray you for advantage, but on DE about 95% of the people will fuck you over just because.

I think Vance underestimates the value that such a world would have for a reputation for not screwing people over left and right. But regardless, it fits the fiction (which is still awesome). We just don't have to be beholden to that when creating our world.

Willie the Duck · September 17, 2017, 08:23:49 PM

Quote from: Armchair Gamer;993073I have 2E--original and Premium editions. Plus the RC and the BECMI boxes.

XP for GP was the big one I was thinking of, along with reducing the lethality curve and maybe tweaking classes a bit. The major question is whether 2E, BECMI, or C&C works best as a baseline for the lighter and more traditional approach. (For heavier rules, there's Hero; for more over-the-top, BESM or 4E.)

The lethality curve is your call. TSR D&D really is not set up for you to just tilt at every windmill and challenge every evil-doer (I have my serious doubts about being able to play the 1e Cavalier as written, as an example).

Xp=gp is certainly not something you need to keep if you want to incentivize non-profiteering behavior (although I've seen plenty of noble actions in my BECMI games, which are gp=xp). IMO, the rules exist to get you the DM to the point where you don't need them, so if you can fairly arbitrate an xp-for-heroic-task system, go ahead, and it should work well with either 1e or 2e (or b/x, becmi, etc.).

Philotomy Jurament · September 17, 2017, 11:38:27 PM

Vance is an interesting D&D influence. I embrace the "Vancian magic" thing in D&D with no restraints. I find the most D&D-ish inspiration in his earlier stuff like The Dying Earth. What great characters (and names)! Chun the Unavoidable (and Liane the Wayfarer), Turjan, Mazirian the Magician, Pandelume and his vats, et cetera. I enjoyed reading the Cugel stuff, but I don't draw much inspiration from it. YMMV, of course.