Romance was never a part of D&D and Earthdawn at our tables. The only relationship in ED didn't even involve the PCs, it was a love between the human Luke Branford and the elf Lilandra Silvertongue as NPCs in my ten year Epic campaign of Earthdawn. Lilandra broke it off, having no wish to watch Luke grow old and die while she stayed young (Human lifespan average 70, elves 400 in ED), but not before she became pregnant with Luke's child which she hid from Luke. Luke went on to have a relationship with a fellow human Fiona Flamehair, a princess of a small human city state in the Throal Mountains called Lasael. But none of this really involved the players and they ignored the background details. But these little details directed how I roleplayed Luke as the campaign went on. Why he was overprotective of Lilandra during the early game and then Fiona later. Why does this matter? Well this is it from the first 20 years of our roleplaying (mostly D&D 1-3.5 and ED 1-3) when it comes to romance. As in a PC-NPC relationship never happened.

Savage Worlds the last three years has been completely different. Possibly because our gaming group has a 50/50 women to men ratio most of the time, especially Deadlands. We also use the Adventure Deck, which has a Love Interest card that can spark a romance with an NPC. The women in our game group love playing this card.

There have been a lot of PC to PC loves in the various SW games. But the topic is specific to PC/NPC romance interactions. Bobbie played Love Interest, gaining the huge Orc Grundy Vhash's attentions in my Shaintar game. Kevin played Contact and I filled him in on Grundy and Kevin's character, Salden, being in a gang together in Camden, the Snake's Den, before they were scattered by his Wanted Hindrance group, the Bloody Whips. Salden convinced him to join the Grayson's Grey Rangers to get close to Dru-Karra, Bobbie's female Orc character.

Grundy tried to impress her with his combat prowess and woo her. Bobbie's character Dru-Karra feigned disinterest but eventually fell for his charms (Some impressive combat feats included taking an enemy's arm clean off and then using his own arm to beat him unconscious. Think Groot here smiling as he does this at Rocket Raccoon but replace it with a burly, green Orc smiling at a fit, female Orc).  After they fell for each other, they had each other's backs for the longest time in combat. Grundy would fall in battle, but Dru-Karra would save him. But over time, she began to doubt his strength.

Then in the second to last session, Grundy lost his arm in combat to the Ratzin and Dru-Karra gained a massive burn scar across her chest from the fires of the village they saved. Even through this, Grundy lifted his two-handed Chuktar and managed to slay the Ratzin leader. Grundy's arm was healed by Camille's healing device, but had become scarred where it was chewed and burned by the Ratzin.

Their physical appearances had changed and they each disparaged each other for their scars in our last session, leading to Dru-Karra throwing out Grundy from their inn room. Grundy headed to a local brothel for the night (following his Vengeful trait) to be discovered by the rest of the group the next day in the arms of a female Orc. Grundy refused to tell Dru-Karra where he had been that night, infuriating her with the rest of the party unwilling to tell Dru-Karra what they had discovered (Loyal Hindrances).

After a day of travel, Grundy set up a separate tent from Dru-Karra which she kicked down. Grundy ended up sleeping in Camille's tent after a brief fist fight with Dru-Karra.

Another day of travel had them meet with some friends where Dru-Karra came up and kissed an Orc warrior NPC to make Grundy jealous. His face stayed a permanent scowl.

Finally Dru-Karra told him to leave or she would kill him. As his last act as a Grey Ranger, Grundy promised to get a message to Galea and the Grey Rangers about the Unchained base moving before quitting. Grundy would return to Camden and create a new gang to oppose the Bloody Whips he vowed to Salden.

It was one heck of a NPC character arc from the beginning to the end. All thanks to the Love Interest card and excellent roleplaying from Bobbie.

So of course, I say go for it, because it can enrich your game with some excellent roleplaying opportunities.

Quote from: slayride35;832513Romance was never a part of D&D and Earthdawn at our tables. The only relationship in ED didn't even involve the PCs, it was a love between the human Luke Branford and the elf Lilandra Silvertongue as NPCs in my ten year Epic campaign of Earthdawn. Lilandra broke it off, having no wish to watch Luke grow old and die while she stayed young (Human lifespan average 70, elves 400 in ED), but not before she became pregnant with Luke's child which she hid from Luke. Luke went on to have a relationship with a fellow human Fiona Flamehair, a princess of a small human city state in the Throal Mountains called Lasael. But none of this really involved the players and they ignored the background details. But these little details directed how I roleplayed Luke as the campaign went on. Why he was overprotective of Lilandra during the early game and then Fiona later. Why does this matter? Well this is it from the first 20 years of our roleplaying (mostly D&D 1-3.5 and ED 1-3) when it comes to romance. As in a PC-NPC relationship never happened.

Interesting. When I ran "Infected" for Earthdawn, I changed the human Thief Maloniel to an elf Thief. The player running the Elf Warrior adept and I talked it out and planned a romantic relationship, a fairly involved courting period (he did just help trash her previous group of Grim Legionaries - but Moltaa was out of control), and then a long term romance as he built a small kingdom in the foothills of the Throalic Mountains.

Carrying the party into the other linked adventures (Blades, etc) and Maloniel was not present very often (mostly just out of sight), but damn she was good an ninja-ing up behind who-ever the warrior was fighting in combat and taking them out. Probably the longest lasting dedicated "henchman" that I've run in Earthdawn. By the end of the campaign, the player was a Circle 10 Warrior & Circle 5 Scout, and Maloniel was a Circle 9 Thief. Scary pair, those two.

I suppose that I am the only one here who has a skill based game with 'flirt' and 'basic carnal' as playable skills?

Quote from: LordVreeg;832526I suppose that I am the only one here who has a skill based game with 'flirt' and 'basic carnal' as playable skills?

No, but I have Endear, Engrace, and Entice.

Quote from: flyingmice;832530No, but I have Endear, Engrace, and Entice.

Heh.  Closer than I thought.

Quote from: Telarus;832517Interesting. When I ran "Infected" for Earthdawn, I changed the human Thief Maloniel to an elf Thief. The player running the Elf Warrior adept and I talked it out and planned a romantic relationship, a fairly involved courting period (he did just help trash her previous group of Grim Legionaries - but Moltaa was out of control), and then a long term romance as he built a small kingdom in the foothills of the Throalic Mountains.

Carrying the party into the other linked adventures (Blades, etc) and Maloniel was not present very often (mostly just out of sight), but damn she was good an ninja-ing up behind who-ever the warrior was fighting in combat and taking them out. Probably the longest lasting dedicated "henchman" that I've run in Earthdawn. By the end of the campaign, the player was a Circle 10 Warrior & Circle 5 Scout, and Maloniel was a Circle 9 Thief. Scary pair, those two.

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Maloniel, as the lonely Grim Legionnaire (Also elf in my game), could have been a PC love interest in the group that eventually ended in Terror in the Skies. But the group wasn't interested. I had an Ork Thief named Bane who was an expert at killing people with a Two-Handed Sword, a stupid Dwarf Warrior that was resurrected by Moltaa as a cadaver man, and a dwarf Nethermancer that learned Dragon with a ridiculous R+W Language roll of 27 to read the Book of Blue Spirits and joined Moltaa and her Grim Legion after proving to Moltaa that Aardelea was a dragon construct and not a Horror construct through RP. None of these characters were looking for love. For Bane it was greed and murder. For the dwarf Nethermancer, he wanted to understand death, constantly casting Experience Death and actually looking up to Moltaa. And the Dwarf Warrior couldn't stand quarantine, leading him to fighting the Grim Legion and his death and "resurrection".  They were a party of war and death not romance. The old RP group of my twenties and the more mature new RP group of my thirties are like night and day.

Quote from: Zevious Zoquis;832506hmm...don't know what that means.


Just to clarify, I wasn't suggesting the GM should outright tell a PC that his character is in love with a given NPC.  It was more along the lines of having it come down to a dice roll - some sort of "romance mechanism" to handle it - to determine if "the spark" is there.  It's the whole "I think it would be interesting for the story if my character and that NPC had a romantic involvement" deal that feels story-gamey to me.  But again this thread isn't really for me since the level of romance I'd generally want would be along the lines of what you might find in a Conan story or something...

i will agree that this seems a bit meta but over the last few months i have been softening to the storygames as i learn to seperate the shit from the bearable.

as for monsterhearts its a game about about teenage romance and monsters its got mechanics for attraction which in itself is fine not something that intrests me but not horrible but then they go full retard and explicitly say your sexuality does not matter for who you are attracted to.

Quote from: tuypo1;832598i will agree that this seems a bit meta but over the last few months i have been softening to the storygames as i learn to seperate the shit from the bearable.

as for monsterhearts its a game about about teenage romance and monsters its got mechanics for attraction which in itself is fine not something that intrests me but not horrible but then they go full retard and explicitly say your sexuality does not matter for who you are attracted to.

ah...well yeah, that's odd.

Quote from: Zevious Zoquis;832506Just to clarify, I wasn't suggesting the GM should outright tell a PC that his character is in love with a given NPC.  It was more along the lines of having it come down to a dice roll - some sort of "romance mechanism" to handle it - to determine if "the spark" is there.  It's the whole "I think it would be interesting for the story if my character and that NPC had a romantic involvement" deal that feels story-gamey to me.  But again this thread isn't really for me since the level of romance I'd generally want would be along the lines of what you might find in a Conan story or something...

The die roll for attraction made sense to me. It can work that way in Pendragon with passions. I probably wouldn't do it for sexual attraction because it works better to leave appeal up to the player since roleplaying attraction that you don't feel and can't see requires actual acting ability. We did do that for a Sallustan PC and learned he has some strange liking for Gamorrean dancing girls. Everyone mostly went Yech! but the player was a good sport about it.

I frequently do something similar with food and drink. If it is exotic and the player doesn't have an immediate Yum! or Yech! response, I have the player roll to see how much their PC likes/dislikes it. Basically works like the Reaction roll in D&D. It can live up the first meeting with the Mongol Chief as he passes out the kumiss to drink.

Quote from: LordVreeg;832526I suppose that I am the only one here who has a skill based game with 'flirt' and 'basic carnal' as playable skills?

Don Juan or Temptress is an actual career in Honor+Intrigue. Flirt would be social combat maneuver modified by Flair and possibly your career. If opposed you would need to overcome your opponent's Composure to make an impression as it were.

Quote from: Bren;832702The die roll for attraction made sense to me. It can work that way in Pendragon with passions. I probably wouldn't do it for sexual attraction because it works better to leave appeal up to the player since roleplaying attraction that you don't feel and can't see requires actual acting ability. We did do that for a Sallustan PC and learned he has some strange liking for Gamorrean dancing girls. Everyone mostly went Yech! but the player was a good sport about it.

I frequently do something similar with food and drink. If it is exotic and the player doesn't have an immediate Yum! or Yech! response, I have the player roll to see how much their PC likes/dislikes it. Basically works like the Reaction roll in D&D. It can live up the first meeting with the Mongol Chief as he passes out the kumiss to drink.

I do something very similar when it comes to exotic food & drink, and by exgtension, 'things'.

-clash

Quote from: flyingmice;832704I do something very similar when it comes to exotic food & drink, and by exgtension, 'things'.

-clash

Yeah, that seems generally outside the bounds of what I or others know about our characters. Until I tried it how would I know what escargot, pepper crab, or durian taste like.

Quote from: S'mon;832427Romances IMCs have always been NPC/PC or NPC/NPC, not PC/PC. Usually they occur in the background and don't take up much screen time if any.

I suppose it depends on the campaign.  I've been in gaming circles where it's a known thing, if not quite common.  So far, I've had four PCs married to fellow PCs, and a couple other relationships.  Heck, two of those marriages we've wound up juggling children with our questing ... :popcorn:

Quote from: Ravenswing;832730I suppose it depends on the campaign.  I've been in gaming circles where it's a known thing, if not quite common.  So far, I've had four PCs married to fellow PCs, and a couple other relationships.  Heck, two of those marriages we've wound up juggling children with our questing ... :popcorn:

Maybe it's a Massachusetts thing.

We normally end up NPC/PC, etc, but a few times, nope.  PC/PC.  

Some of the major NPCs of the igbar game are actually a PC and his NPC wife and their daughter, who run the alternative school of Magic.

Quote from: LordVreeg;832872Maybe it's a Massachusetts thing.

Couldn't say.  Another factor, of course, may well be the gender composition of the group.  For my part, other than a single semester in the late 70s with the Northeastern University gaming group, I've never GMed a campaign without at least one woman in it, and I think it's been at least twenty years since any group I've run's dropped below 50:50.  I'm trying to think back on the last all-male group in which I've been a player, and I can't think of one more recent than 1985.

Quote from: Ravenswing;833044Couldn't say.  Another factor, of course, may well be the gender composition of the group.  For my part, other than a single semester in the late 70s with the Northeastern University gaming group, I've never GMed a campaign without at least one woman in it, and I think it's been at least twenty years since any group I've run's dropped below 50:50.  I'm trying to think back on the last all-male group in which I've been a player, and I can't think of one more recent than 1985.

Funny, 1985 for myself as well.