Quote from: TristramEvans;512274WTH is Cthulhutech?

It's an RPG that combines call of Cthulhu and Robotech. If you get that genre mash, you will probably like it. If you don't, you will not and would best looking elsewhere.

It's been moderately successful for a first time RPG, with impressive production values and something like 6 or 7 supplements. It has had possibly the worst history of publishing partners of any RPG I know. It took the brunt of Mongoose's in house printing debacle as well as being actually being defrauded twice, meaning the profits from several supplements were never received. The last almost killed the RPG but the line seems revived again against the odds with a new supplement due in PDF in April.

In its later years it got a bad reputation regarding the inclusion of rape, particularly due to a group of very vocal RPGnet fans that built a snowball of hate that that site has unfortunately become renowned for.

Quote from: Rincewind1;512596It did work for Evangelion, though.

I suppose that's true.

Quote from: TristramEvans;512586Yeah, but since when have RPGs EVER appealed to the "average" members of society?

RPGs are a hobby for the smart people. One of the reasons it will always be a very small hobby. "Average students" spend their free time playing sports and videogames and chasing girls. It takes a certain kind of person to say "hey, you know what I'd like to spend my Friday night doing? Pretend to be an elf fighting monsters!"

I still don't buy this bullshit.  People don't do it because it's regarded as dorky.  It's easy to get into this hobby.  It's hard to convince people it's worthwhile.  Giving into the Dork Side does not make you more intelligent than "regular folk" or who-the-fuck-ever.

Quote from: Skywalker;512598It's an RPG that combines call of Cthulhu and Robotech. If you get that genre mash, you will probably like it. If you don't, you will not and would best looking elsewhere.

It's been moderately successful for a first time RPG, with impressive production values and something like 6 or 7 supplements. It has had possibly the worst history of publishing partners of any RPG I know. It took the brunt of Mongoose's in house printing debacle as well as being actually being defrauded twice, meaning the profits from several supplements were never received. The last almost killed the RPG but the line seems revived again against the odds with a new supplement due in PDF in April.

In its later years it got a bad reputation regarding the inclusion of rape, particularly due to a group of very vocal RPGnet fans that built a snowball of hate that that site has unfortunately become renowned for.

What does "the inclusion of rape" entail? Actual rules for raping someone via FATAL, or is it simply mentioned at some point in the text?

Quote from: TristramEvans;512602What does "the inclusion of rape" entail? Actual rules for raping someone via FATAL, or is it simply mentioned at some point in the text?

Deep Ones rape camps.

My personal issue with CthulhuTech is more of an absurd notion that humanity, thanks to Mecha, may actually stand a sliver of a chance against The Old Ones (not to mention also an open conflict wit the GOO, which is BLERGH)

Quote from: TristramEvans;512602What does "the inclusion of rape" entail? Actual rules for raping someone via FATAL, or is it simply mentioned at some point in the text?

Nothing like that. Deep Ones begin to breed hybrids as a part of its war on humanity. It's debatable that this sort of activity is sourced from Shadows in Innsmouth.

There is a servant of Shib Niggurath (the Mythos fertility goddess) that is like an evil Pan, that is capable of using pheromones to seduce people and impregnating them with evil stomach bursting babies.

There are some vague references of rape taking place in a war in China, though this presentation is based heavily on a number of recent real world conflicts.

Finally, there was a poorly executed inclusion in one adventure to emphasise the evilness of a bad guy.

IME it's not particularly unusual given other RPGs that deal with this kind of darkness. Masks of Nyarlathotep has similar scenes for example. I think the issue was more that it ended up on RPGnet with a few posters wanting to take a beef with the RPG.

Innsmouth would never have happened if the monsters weren't copulating with humans. Something tells me people aren't that interested in mating with fish monsters.

Quote from: Rincewind1;512603Deep Ones rape camps.

The entirety of the reference in the rulebook is:

QuoteNow, the Esoteric Order has come out into the world. They take towns by force and set up rape camps to increase their numbers.

This follows several paragraphs describing how the Deep Ones bred with humanity, almost entirely from references from Lovecraft's own Shadows over Innsmouth.

Quote from: Rincewind1;512603My personal issue with CthulhuTech is more of an absurd notion that humanity, thanks to Mecha, may actually stand a sliver of a chance against The Old Ones (not to mention also an open conflict wit the GOO, which is BLERGH)

Mecha are never presented that way. Humanity's only chance against the Old Ones is to become like the Old Ones, which is the game's underlying theme.

Sure mecha are useful when you are fighting a Byakhee or Dhole , or better yet Migou, but humanity is clearly losing the war on all fronts and is on the brink of extinction.

As for an open conflict with a GOO, there isn't one unless you include the Rapine Storm (where Hastur is still not revealed). Open conflict is with other human's, Migou and the Deep Ones, all mortal races.

Quote from: Skywalker;512608The entirety of the reference in the rulebook is:



This follows several paragraphs describing how the Deep Ones bred with humanity, almost entirely from references from Lovecraft's own Shadows over Innsmouth.



Mecha are never presented that way. Humanity's only chance against the Old Ones is to become like the Old Ones, which is the game's underlying theme.

Sure mecha are useful when you are fighting a Byakhee or Dhole , or better yet Migou, but humanity is clearly losing the war on all fronts and is on the brink of extinction.

Oh, I don't have anything ag-...well, I do oppose rape but on a moral level, but in fiction, I can generally tolerate it, especially as it is pointed out, Innsmouth wasn't exactly a very caring environment.

It's the mecha that bother me more. And the fact that Mythos are very much out in the open, even the mortal races, as I'd expect them personally to wake once the GOO had awoken as well.

Quote from: danbuter;512606Innsmouth would never have happened if the monsters weren't copulating with humans. Something tells me people aren't that interested in mating with fish monsters.

Exactly. However, it is clear in Shadows Over Innsmouth much of the breeding was consensual, if due to deception. Cthulhutech suggests that of open war occurred this practice may change. Some people think this moves away from Lovecraft too much (the whole setting does, so shrug). However, I don't think the reference is particualrly objectionable or gratuitous.

Quote from: Rincewind1;512609It's the mecha that bother me more. And the fact that Mythos are very much out in the open, even the mortal races, as I'd expect them personally to wake once the GOO had awoken as well.

That's fair. If the idea of Call of Cthulhu meets Robotech fills you with a chill, then steer clear of the game Its not like it's hiding what it is from prospective purchasers.

As for rape, it is one of the triumvirate of ultimate evil (with mass murder and torture) and can be used to add darkness to a concept. Their treatment needs to be carefully handled. Cthulhutech does have a couple of instances where more care was needed IMO, but overall it's not an issue.

Quote from: Skywalker;512610Exactly. However, it is clear in Shadows Over Innsmouth much of the breeding was consensual, if due to deception. Cthulhutech suggests that of open war occurred this practice may change. Some people think this moves away from Lovecraft too much (the whole setting does, so shrug). However, I don't think the reference is particualrly objectionable or gratuitous.

I don't think Innsmouth was very consensual. It was certainly forced, as a part of Marsh's bargain. Sure, there was the "kids will be immortal", but I can sense quite a bit of women'd not be too good with mating with Fish People.

Quote from: Skywalker;512612That's fair. If the idea of Call of Cthulhu meets Robotech fills you with a chill, then steer clear of the game

More of a sense of sadness that someone butchers Lovecraft this way . At least I have Campbell to pat me on the back in this regard.

Cool. I think I have thread jacked this topic enough

QuoteThe average adult in American society has a fifth grade reading level

A lot of people misunderstand what reading levels mean. A 'fifth-grade reading level' doesn't mean 'like a book for fifth-graders'. It means 'like a comprehension test for fifth-graders', which is much harder.

Quote from: Age of Fable;512583My understanding was that IQ continues to rise every year.

AIR, US SAT scores in maths have been declining - though that could be more people taking the SAT.

The Flynn effect - IQ rising every year - seems to have tailed off in the '90s, in (at least some) Western societies.  Also, it seems to have been concentrated in the left side of the IQ bell curve - fewer people with very low IQ, due to better nutrition & universal education - and it only appears in certain parts of the IQ test, basically areas of analytical skill that are exercised more in advanced technological societies.  

However one would expect to see Flynn-effect IQ rises in immigrant populations from developing countries - the children of peasants from southern Mexico who emigrate to the USA will tend to score higher than their parents did. Likewise as developing countries get more developed, you get environment-led rises in median IQ.