I picked up the free OSR-style Flying Swordsman RPG HERE and I am really digging it so far. The way that the martial arts maneuvers work with stunt dice is a neat addition to the core of traditional D&D mechanics. Also, the author's inclusion of setting details and an example of how to set up a campaign are nice icing on the cake.

One thing in the rules that puzzles me so far are the required martial arts maneuvers for the character class profiles. If I read it correctly, these means that the player has no options and MUST take the maneuvers listed. For example, the martial artist must take five listed maneuvers by 3rd level. The advancement chart indicates that the class only gets five maneuvers by third level so the player would have no flexibility in which maneuvers to choose up to that level. I understand that the player can make choices after 3rd level, but this seems a little constricting for low level PCs.

I also wonder if martial arts maneuvers are supposed to have prerequisites. For example, it looks like a player can choose Level 2 Fists of Jade without first choosing Level 1 Fists of Steel. Is this intentional?

Have you contacted Lord Gwydion with your suggestions? He mentioned that he was looking at a revision in the future.

I really liked it on a first read-thru, now I need to sit down and make a couple of characters.

Hi Anthony.

First off, glad you like the game.  Especially the campaign setting, as that's something I came up with 100% by myself.

The game itself started out as a retro-clone of Dragon Fist by Chris Pramas, but morphed into a bit more of its own game.  I made some significant changes (I think, anyway), although the basic game is still the same.

About the restricted martial arts maneuvers for the Profiles, yes, you're pretty much locked into those maneuvers for the first three levels.  This is an artifact of Dragon Fist, where characters started at 3rd level, so those were your starting maneuvers.  Consensus on the internet, along with my own gut feeling, made me change it to starting at Level 1, and I had to make a choice about what to do with the required Maneuvers.

I'm actually considering changing it to a short list of the Level 1 Maneuvers that each Profile gets to choose from at 1st (character) level.  The big benefit of not selecting a profile is carte blanche to choose your Maneuvers.

Secondly, the original had requirements to have the lower level power to select the higher power for the increased martial arts damage Maneuvers, but I got rid of it.  A suggestion from another person was to add a slight bonus to them if you've got the lower powered ones, similar to the way the Stance Maneuvers work.  I'll likely add that in to the revision, too.

So you're reading it right, but these are both areas I've already tagged for possible revision.  If you've got any suggestions, I'd love to hear them.

And Black Vulmea, thanks as always for helping support the game!

Flying Swordsmen is an awesome little game.

Lord Gwydion, have you considered writing a setting book, and maybe a couple of adventures? I want to run this, but my knowledge of wuxia is limited to Hero; Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon; and House of Flying Daggers. I'd gladly buy, read and use a book with more fluff, to better understand how the pieces come together.

Quote from: Lord Gwydion;540176So you're reading it right, but these are both areas I've already tagged for possible revision.  If you've got any suggestions, I'd love to hear them.

I'll have to read and digest it a little more before I try to make any real suggestions! I would definitely like to see some sandbox building tools like those in Red Tide for fleshing out Zhongyang Dalu though. An intro adventure would also be great!

Quote from: Lord Gwydion;540176And Black Vulmea, thanks as always for helping support the game!

My pleasure - it deserves the attention it gets.

Do the basic attributes have any purpose beyond deciding what stunt dice are used, or beyond character creation in general?

Quote from: Ghost Whistler;540324Do the basic attributes have any purpose beyond deciding what stunt dice are used, or beyond character creation in general?

Yes, Ability Score + Level serves as Target Numbers for Stunts performed against a character, when the two characters are not engaged in a Contest (where both characters use the same Stunt type against each other).

So if Wang Chi (Fighter with a d4 Might Stunt Die) wants to knock Lo Pan to the ground with a solid kick, but Lo Pan (Level 6 Wizard with a 7 Dex) is making a Savvy Stunt to cast a Mouthful of Light spell, Wang Chi can make a Might Stunt, rolling d20+d4, and if he beats Lo Pan's Dex + Level TN of 13, Lo Pan is knocked down by the blow.

If Nameless and Li Mu Bai are battling over possession of the Green Destiny Sword, it would be a Contest, and both would roll d20+Acrobatics Stunt and higher roll wins.

Quote from: The Butcher;540179Flying Swordsmen is an awesome little game.

Lord Gwydion, have you considered writing a setting book, and maybe a couple of adventures? I want to run this, but my knowledge of wuxia is limited to Hero; Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon; and House of Flying Daggers. I'd gladly buy, read and use a book with more fluff, to better understand how the pieces come together.

Check out my wuxia movie reviews in the media section. If you can get hold of either, watch: Swordsman 2 and New Dragon Gate Inn. Both are awesome wuia from about 20 years ago. Essentially it's about tragic relationships, oppressive and corrupt politics, withdrawal from the world (into the outlaw/rural world called the Jiang Hu), and bad ass kungfu. Beyond the particular stylings of Chinese culture and the kung fu, the themes are not really alien at all. Every culture has it's own version: just look at robin hood for starters.

Quote from: Lord Gwydion;540346Yes, Ability Score + Level serves as Target Numbers for Stunts performed against a character, when the two characters are not engaged in a Contest (where both characters use the same Stunt type against each other).

So if Wang Chi (Fighter with a d4 Might Stunt Die) wants to knock Lo Pan to the ground with a solid kick, but Lo Pan (Level 6 Wizard with a 7 Dex) is making a Savvy Stunt to cast a Mouthful of Light spell, Wang Chi can make a Might Stunt, rolling d20+d4, and if he beats Lo Pan's Dex + Level TN of 13, Lo Pan is knocked down by the blow.

If Nameless and Li Mu Bai are battling over possession of the Green Destiny Sword, it would be a Contest, and both would roll d20+Acrobatics Stunt and higher roll wins.

So if Cloud and Wind are going at it, righting routinely, it's a contest - both are using, say, Fighting (let's say that's a stunt). But if either wants to get a tactical/narrative advantage either of their player sis going to need to think up a clever stunt (say Cloud wants to jump over the chasm next to them to get to higher ground) and rolls against Wind's Dex (or whatever the stat is) + level.

Is this right?

Quote from: Ghost Whistler;540427Check out my wuxia movie reviews in the media section. If you can get hold of either, watch: Swordsman 2 and New Dragon Gate Inn. Both are awesome wuia from about 20 years ago. Essentially it's about tragic relationships, oppressive and corrupt politics, withdrawal from the world (into the outlaw/rural world called the Jiang Hu), and bad ass kungfu. Beyond the particular stylings of Chinese culture and the kung fu, the themes are not really alien at all. Every culture has it's own version: just look at robin hood for starters.

Thanks, GW. I'll look into it.

The bolded part is particularly helpful, and makes sense of a couple of things that weirded me out in your wuxia space opera RPG project posts.

Quote from: The Butcher;540431Thanks, GW. I'll look into it.

The bolded part is particularly helpful, and makes sense of a couple of things that weirded me out in your wuxia space opera RPG project posts.

Jiang Hu is a phrase that refers to the world where the outlaws live, it's of course not an actual place. It means 'rivers and lakes' - the rural world away from the corrupt world of politics and emperors. A bit like Sherwood forest realy.

Quote from: Ghost Whistler;540428So if Cloud and Wind are going at it, righting routinely, it's a contest - both are using, say, Fighting (let's say that's a stunt). But if either wants to get a tactical/narrative advantage either of their player sis going to need to think up a clever stunt (say Cloud wants to jump over the chasm next to them to get to higher ground) and rolls against Wind's Dex (or whatever the stat is) + level.

Is this right?

If Wind is blocking the way to the higher ground, then maybe.  The GM could just set a TN for the Stunt, since it's not directly affecting Cloud.  It's old school, GM interpretation and rulings are part of the game.  Whatever makes sense should be used.

But there is a purpose to the ability scores beyond simply providing your starting Stunt Die values.  How often they get called up is up to the actions of the PCs and the decision of the GM.

Quote from: Lord Gwydion;540535If Wind is blocking the way to the higher ground, then maybe.  The GM could just set a TN for the Stunt, since it's not directly affecting Cloud.  It's old school, GM interpretation and rulings are part of the game.  Whatever makes sense should be used.

But there is a purpose to the ability scores beyond simply providing your starting Stunt Die values.  How often they get called up is up to the actions of the PCs and the decision of the GM.

Yes that was a poor example since it's not a contested action.

Quote from: The Butcher on May 18, 2012, 02:37:40 PM

Quote from: Ghost Whistler;540427

The bolded part is particularly helpful, and makes sense of a couple of things that weirded me out in your wuxia space opera RPG project posts.

Wait what? Wuxia space opera?!