Quote from: Ruprecht on February 04, 2024, 07:13:02 PM

Quote from: Grognard GM on February 04, 2024, 04:25:17 PM
Frankly the thread would be long dead without the shit stirring, because Jaquays was a game design footnote.

The bro-ha-ha over the Alexandrian has been fascinating train wreck to watch.

https://thealexandrian.net/wordpress/50588/site-news/a-second-historical-note-on-xandering-the-dungeon#comments

You mean that crap? I say this without a shred of sarcasm, some of those people need help. Like serious help. Crying because a dude wrote a blog post years ago and used the name Paul? Claiming this somehow injures a group of people is the most sad and narcissistic thing I've ever seen.

Quote from: Ruprecht on February 04, 2024, 07:13:02 PM

Quote from: Grognard GM on February 04, 2024, 04:25:17 PM
Frankly the thread would be long dead without the shit stirring, because Jaquays was a game design footnote.

The bro-ha-ha over the Alexandrian has been fascinating train wreck to watch.

https://thealexandrian.net/wordpress/50588/site-news/a-second-historical-note-on-xandering-the-dungeon#comments

Since your comment made me lose S20 SAN points when I scratched the surface, could you explain the gobbledegook of that comments section? It seems like some kind of mad purity spiral, but I have no idea what they're devouring their ally for.

EDIT: Didn't see Brad had posted too, lol. Any ideas, Brad?

Quote from: Brad on February 04, 2024, 08:21:41 PM

Quote from: Ruprecht on February 04, 2024, 07:13:02 PM

Quote from: Grognard GM on February 04, 2024, 04:25:17 PM
Frankly the thread would be long dead without the shit stirring, because Jaquays was a game design footnote.

The bro-ha-ha over the Alexandrian has been fascinating train wreck to watch.

https://thealexandrian.net/wordpress/50588/site-news/a-second-historical-note-on-xandering-the-dungeon#comments

You mean that crap? I say this without a shred of sarcasm, some of those people need help. Like serious help. Crying because a dude wrote a blog post years ago and used the name Paul? Claiming this somehow injures a group of people is the most sad and narcissistic thing I've ever seen.

Quote from: Grognard GM on February 04, 2024, 08:32:30 PM

Quote from: Ruprecht on February 04, 2024, 07:13:02 PM

Quote from: Grognard GM on February 04, 2024, 04:25:17 PM
Frankly the thread would be long dead without the shit stirring, because Jaquays was a game design footnote.

The bro-ha-ha over the Alexandrian has been fascinating train wreck to watch.

https://thealexandrian.net/wordpress/50588/site-news/a-second-historical-note-on-xandering-the-dungeon#comments

Since your comment made me lose S20 SAN points when I scratched the surface, could you explain the gobbledegook of that comments section? It seems like some kind of mad purity spiral, but I have no idea what they're devouring their ally for.

EDIT: Didn't see Brad had posted too, lol. Any ideas, Brad?

I don't think I can help you get your sanity back, Grog, But I can explain.

One of the things that the trans community takes issue with is anyone bringing up their identity before their transition.  Using their pre-transition name is called dead-naming and drags up trauma from their dealing with being identified wrongly.  This goes so far as to have the trans community call dead-naming bullying and even some suicides have been blamed of persistent dead-naming.

Quote from: BadApple on February 04, 2024, 08:46:49 PM

Quote from: Brad on February 04, 2024, 08:21:41 PM

Quote from: Ruprecht on February 04, 2024, 07:13:02 PM

Quote from: Grognard GM on February 04, 2024, 04:25:17 PM
Frankly the thread would be long dead without the shit stirring, because Jaquays was a game design footnote.

The bro-ha-ha over the Alexandrian has been fascinating train wreck to watch.

https://thealexandrian.net/wordpress/50588/site-news/a-second-historical-note-on-xandering-the-dungeon#comments

You mean that crap? I say this without a shred of sarcasm, some of those people need help. Like serious help. Crying because a dude wrote a blog post years ago and used the name Paul? Claiming this somehow injures a group of people is the most sad and narcissistic thing I've ever seen.

Quote from: Grognard GM on February 04, 2024, 08:32:30 PM

Quote from: Ruprecht on February 04, 2024, 07:13:02 PM

Quote from: Grognard GM on February 04, 2024, 04:25:17 PM
Frankly the thread would be long dead without the shit stirring, because Jaquays was a game design footnote.

The bro-ha-ha over the Alexandrian has been fascinating train wreck to watch.

https://thealexandrian.net/wordpress/50588/site-news/a-second-historical-note-on-xandering-the-dungeon#comments

Since your comment made me lose S20 SAN points when I scratched the surface, could you explain the gobbledegook of that comments section? It seems like some kind of mad purity spiral, but I have no idea what they're devouring their ally for.

EDIT: Didn't see Brad had posted too, lol. Any ideas, Brad?

I don't think I can help you get your sanity back, Grog, But I can explain.

One of the things that the trans community takes issue with is anyone bringing up their identity before their transition.  Using their pre-transition name is called dead-naming and drags up trauma from their dealing with being identified wrongly.  This goes so far as to have the trans community call dead-naming bullying and even some suicides have been blamed of persistent dead-naming.

Sure, but what's this Xandering/Jaquaying schism of Heresy? His name was Paul.

Quote from: Grognard GM on February 04, 2024, 08:50:56 PM

Quote from: BadApple on February 04, 2024, 08:46:49 PM

Quote from: Brad on February 04, 2024, 08:21:41 PM

Quote from: Ruprecht on February 04, 2024, 07:13:02 PM

Quote from: Grognard GM on February 04, 2024, 04:25:17 PM
Frankly the thread would be long dead without the shit stirring, because Jaquays was a game design footnote.

The bro-ha-ha over the Alexandrian has been fascinating train wreck to watch.

https://thealexandrian.net/wordpress/50588/site-news/a-second-historical-note-on-xandering-the-dungeon#comments

You mean that crap? I say this without a shred of sarcasm, some of those people need help. Like serious help. Crying because a dude wrote a blog post years ago and used the name Paul? Claiming this somehow injures a group of people is the most sad and narcissistic thing I've ever seen.

Quote from: Grognard GM on February 04, 2024, 08:32:30 PM

Quote from: Ruprecht on February 04, 2024, 07:13:02 PM

Quote from: Grognard GM on February 04, 2024, 04:25:17 PM
Frankly the thread would be long dead without the shit stirring, because Jaquays was a game design footnote.

The bro-ha-ha over the Alexandrian has been fascinating train wreck to watch.

https://thealexandrian.net/wordpress/50588/site-news/a-second-historical-note-on-xandering-the-dungeon#comments

Since your comment made me lose S20 SAN points when I scratched the surface, could you explain the gobbledegook of that comments section? It seems like some kind of mad purity spiral, but I have no idea what they're devouring their ally for.

EDIT: Didn't see Brad had posted too, lol. Any ideas, Brad?

I don't think I can help you get your sanity back, Grog, But I can explain.

One of the things that the trans community takes issue with is anyone bringing up their identity before their transition.  Using their pre-transition name is called dead-naming and drags up trauma from their dealing with being identified wrongly.  This goes so far as to have the trans community call dead-naming bullying and even some suicides have been blamed of persistent dead-naming.

Sure, but what's this Xandering/Jaquaying schism of Heresy? His name was Paul.

Quote from: BadApple on February 04, 2024, 08:46:49 PM
This goes so far as to have the trans community call dead-naming bullying and even some suicides have been blamed of persistent dead-naming.

If you don't go along with every nutty thing any Trans person wants, they experience trauma and will commit suicide, and you'll be directly responsible.

This line of attack has caused me to lose all empathy for the Trans activists. It's been used to justify all kinds of atrocities, like bullying desisters and detransitioners, and causing emotional trauma to parents who question the insane idea that people need to transition their children at a young age with a minimum, if any, critical therapy to determine if they really have gender dysphoria or are simply going through a tough time with puberty.

Jaquays has, predictably,  become another tool for the Trans activists to rally the troops and act like shits.

Quote from: Ratman_tf on February 04, 2024, 09:20:23 PM
Jaquays has, predictably,  become another tool for the Trans activists to rally the troops and act like shits.

Jaquays was a trans activist. She was involved in the campaign to enact Leelah's Law. There is even a section on her Wikipedia article labeled Activism. Whatever it is you don't like about trans activism, I guarantee you don't like it a lot, with respect to Jennell's life. She was not a tool. She was an artist and a warrior.

The true scandal of the blog post was when Alexander claimed the concept of layering was HIS original work.

Quote from: Ratman_tf on February 04, 2024, 09:13:12 PM

So I learned that the Alexandrian is a plagiarist that stole from a member of the wrong cult. I also learned that the creator of the video is a disingenuous idiot, using the AI art Jaquays, obfuscating the past, and (laughably) saying Jaquays belongs on the same pedestal as Gygax and Arneson!

Is the lady in the video Trans, or just unblessed by nature?

Quote from: Grognard GM on February 04, 2024, 11:25:17 PM
Is the lady in the video Trans, or just unblessed by nature?

To my knowledge, they've never said anything about it on video.  I haven't seen the Minis content, but have followed the RPG stuff for about a year now.

Quote from: pawsplay on February 04, 2024, 10:17:54 PM...and a warrior.

Götz von Berlichingen was a warrior. Marshal Ney was a warrior. Jaquays made online posts about subjects that the establishment supports, at no risk or effort.

Quote from: Brad on February 04, 2024, 08:21:41 PM

Quote from: Ruprecht on February 04, 2024, 07:13:02 PM

Quote from: Grognard GM on February 04, 2024, 04:25:17 PM
Frankly the thread would be long dead without the shit stirring, because Jaquays was a game design footnote.

The bro-ha-ha over the Alexandrian has been fascinating train wreck to watch.

https://thealexandrian.net/wordpress/50588/site-news/a-second-historical-note-on-xandering-the-dungeon#comments

You mean that crap? I say this without a shred of sarcasm, some of those people need help. Like serious help. Crying because a dude wrote a blog post years ago and used the name Paul? Claiming this somehow injures a group of people is the most sad and narcissistic thing I've ever seen.

Naw that is not the primary issue people had. The primary issue was Justin talking to Jacquays before finishing his book, Jacquays saying "name it Jaquaysing the dungeon" and Justin deciding that didn't sound good enough so he decided to name it after himself (Xandering). And then doubling down on that until Jaquays widow finally told him to please kindly knock it off and him suddenly doing a reversal after he already published having named it after himself.

Justin Alexander is a huge dickhead. He doesn't deserve your defense. I think he's even banned here. He's banned from pretty much every single RPG message board...for being a huge dickhead.

Quote from: Mistwell on February 05, 2024, 02:20:24 AM

Quote from: Brad on February 04, 2024, 08:21:41 PM

Quote from: Ruprecht on February 04, 2024, 07:13:02 PM

Quote from: Grognard GM on February 04, 2024, 04:25:17 PM
Frankly the thread would be long dead without the shit stirring, because Jaquays was a game design footnote.

The bro-ha-ha over the Alexandrian has been fascinating train wreck to watch.

https://thealexandrian.net/wordpress/50588/site-news/a-second-historical-note-on-xandering-the-dungeon#comments

You mean that crap? I say this without a shred of sarcasm, some of those people need help. Like serious help. Crying because a dude wrote a blog post years ago and used the name Paul? Claiming this somehow injures a group of people is the most sad and narcissistic thing I've ever seen.

Naw that is not the primary issue people had. The primary issue was Justin talking to Jacquays before finishing his book, Jacquays saying "name it Jaquaysing the dungeon" and Justin deciding that didn't sound good enough so he decided to name it after himself (Xandering).

Justin claims it was a legal question. Is he lying? Do you have proof?

Quote from: Justin1. I reached out to Jennell regarding the use of the term "jaquaying."
2. Jennell reiterated her preference for the term "jaquaysing" (including the final S in her last name), but stressed that it was very important to her that no form of the term featuring her name but missing the final S be used.
3. I let my publisher know that Jaquays wanted the term changed and that we should be careful to make sure no instances of the old term remained.
4. This prompted a legal question about whether or not her name should be used for the term at all.
5. In consultation with others — but, to be clear, not Jennell — it was determined that a new term should be used, and I created the term "xandering."

https://thealexandrian.net/wordpress/50588/site-news/a-second-historical-note-on-xandering-the-dungeon

(For the record, I believe he was wrong to create "Xandering.")

Also:

Quote from: JustinLong story short, this created a legal question. Not an arduous or terrible one. But one that resulted in the conclusion, "There is some risk in using a word based on someone else's name. Let's not do that.

https://thealexandrian.net/wordpress/50123/roleplaying-games/a-historical-note-on-xandering

Quote from: mcbobbo on February 04, 2024, 10:21:54 PM
The true scandal of the blog post was when Alexander claimed the concept of layering was HIS original work.

That is not what I heard in any of the latest videos after the trans side had retracted and admitted they went off the rails misinformed.

Calling it Xandering is not taking credit for the inventing the technique so much as taking credit for recognizing the technique.

The timeline as I recall from the many videos recently. All dates are from memory.
1. The Jaquays made modules in the 70s-80s. Then moved into video games.
2. 2010. Alexander noted the looping nature of many maps and named the technique Jaquaying because Jaquays was a prominent (but not only) example.
3. A year or so later Jaquays transitioned.
4. Five-ish years later Jaquays became aware of the Alexander post and requested the first name be changed and the technique to be changed from Jacquaying to Jacquaysing because if you are going to use the name spell it correctly and the name has an S at the end.
5. Alexander at this time felt using the dead name was more appropriate because that was the name used at the time and the name on the modules.
6. When Alexander started compiling his posts into a book he revisited the topic (or was recontacted by Jacquay and her allies) and agreed he would remove the dead name from his site and change Jaquaying to Jaquaysing before 2024.
* During this time Jaquays' friends attacked/slandered and spread misinformation (unintentionally it appears) because Jaquays was sick and they felt he was taking advantage of that to take credit.
* During this time he had discussions with his publishers who felt using Jaquays name could be problematic legally and he changed the term to Xandering.

7. Jaquays passed away and we are where we are.

My own .02 is the lawyers demanded the name change because of Jaquays' friends over-reaction to misinformation and a desire to get away from the whole thing as much as possible.