Quick question about dice pool games

thedungeondelver · May 10, 2013, 11:35:49 AM

What's the general consensus: is/are Dice Pool games ONLY games that roll dice as "tokens" where one value = success and another failure, then those are weighed against each other to determine the success or is it just ANY game where lots of dice are rolled?

I mean, to people who think of dice pool games would you lump WEG Star Wars and Hero System in with Storyteller? Or are they different?

In Hero System you can heave handfuls of d6s but you've got to add them up to get a value; 6's are +2 and 1s aren't counted for doing body damage (for example), but 2-5 have a value too. WEG SW adds all d6 face values, but IIRC Storyteller just cares how many 10s versus 1s you rolled, do I remember that right?

Spinachcat · May 10, 2013, 11:41:47 AM

For me, the definition of dice pools is "roll a handful, count successes" instead of the WEG / Hero of "roll a handful, count the pips".

thedungeondelver · May 10, 2013, 11:46:26 AM

Quote from: Spinachcat;653531For me, the definition of dice pools is "roll a handful, count successes" instead of the WEG / Hero of "roll a handful, count the pips".

OK. And thanks by the way for summing up what I was trying to ask.

Dice pools: roll and count the pips OR roll and count successes or are both dice pools.

K Peterson · May 10, 2013, 11:51:37 AM

Quote from: thedungeondelver;653529or is it just ANY game where lots of dice are rolled?

This... to me. Specifically for task resolution, not for damage rolls, etc.

jibbajibba · May 10, 2013, 11:53:11 AM

The dice pool mechanic is roll and count the successes.

Rolling 12 d6 for your fireball damage isn't a dice pool.

However there may be a case to be made if you roll the dice and you aren't just adding pips. So all 6s digive you +1 damage , all 3's give you armour penetration etc. Here you are doing a dice pool but are counting different types of sucesses.

I find dice pools easy to use and its a very flexible mechanic. You have to obviously tweak the original Storyteller a 1 is a criitcal failure and dail it back to if you get no sucesses and a 1 its a critical failure but that is a given.

gleichman · May 10, 2013, 11:57:37 AM

I may be wrong, however...

Dice Pools originally referenced systems where you roll a variable number of dice and *either* counted the successes or took the highest. The term 'Pool' came not from that roll, but from the ability to add dice to be rolled from an existing Pool.

Shadowrun is the classic example.

Over time I think it's been simplified to reference any system where you roll a varying number of dice and count the successes.

jhkim · May 10, 2013, 12:01:05 PM

Quote from: thedungeondelver;653532OK. And thanks by the way for summing up what I was trying to ask.

Dice pools: roll and count the pips OR roll and count successes or are both dice pools.

It's not like there's a formal definition, but for my encyclopedia I call the D6 system an "additive dice pool". I tend to use "dice pool" to describe anything where your ability is rated in the number of dice you roll. However, I will qualify and explain - particularly if it is not a target number system like Shadowrun or White Wolf.

This includes at least four common variations:

1) Roll many dice and count the total
2) Roll many dice and count the successes
3) Roll many dice and take the highest die or dice
4) Roll and look for matching dice (as in One Roll Engine)

Not that Wikipedia has any particular authority, but it's worth noting that they define similarly...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dice_pool

jhkim · May 10, 2013, 12:03:21 PM

Oh, here's my article on terminology that I use when discussing dice probabilities:

http://www.darkshire.net/jhkim/rpg/systemdesign/dice-methods.html

Sacrosanct · May 10, 2013, 12:10:14 PM

Quote from: gleichman;653536I may be wrong, however...

Dice Pools originally referenced systems where you roll a variable number of dice and *either* counted the successes or took the highest. The term 'Pool' came not from that roll, but from the ability to add dice to be rolled from an existing Pool..

Yeah, this. Altus Adventum uses dice pools, but you roll your pool (which includes all types of dice, not just the same type) and take the highest result.

Catelf · May 10, 2013, 12:20:46 PM

Quote from: thedungeondelver;653529I mean, to people who think of dice pool games would you lump WEG Star Wars and Hero System in with Storyteller? Or are they different?

Storyteller just cares how many 10s versus 1s you rolled, do I remember that right?

The first:
There doesn't really seem to be any concensus, see both gleichman and jhkim since both is correct as i see it, even though they are different.

The second:
Storyteller counts sucsesses, but each 1 (a Fumble) removes one sucsess.
However, not only 10 is counted as a suscess unless the task is "near impossible".
The normal difficulty in old WoD was 6, meaning 7, 8, 9 & 10 was sucsesses.
I think the normal difficulty in New WoD is 7, though, meaning 8, 9 & 10 being successes.

Phillip · May 10, 2013, 01:40:19 PM

I've mainly encountered it as Gleichman said: the 'pool' bit refers to some business of including or not including dice.

That's from ages ago, though, so no surprise if it's at best formerly hip.

thedungeondelver · May 10, 2013, 02:38:22 PM

Huh. I thought "pool" referred to just having a massive amount of dice to roll, not a specific aspect of that massive amount of dice.

Rincewind1 · May 10, 2013, 03:01:47 PM

Quote from: thedungeondelver;653587Huh. I thought "pool" referred to just having a massive amount of dice to roll, not a specific aspect of that massive amount of dice.

You need to look at the dice like police looks at people.

3's the gathering/dice pool number.

Black Vulmea · May 10, 2013, 03:15:17 PM

Quote from: Spinachcat;653531For me, the definition of dice pools is "roll a handful, count successes" instead of the WEG / Hero of "roll a handful, count the pips".

This.

TristramEvans · May 10, 2013, 05:22:15 PM

A dice pool is any game mechanic where you roll a variable number of dice. There are MANY variations.

Quick question about dice pool games

TristramEvans