Quote from: Big Andy;1037913I'm interested. And, from the fact that some of the questions here that have come from research in the Blue Room and old out of print books and zines, others are too. The key question is how many are willing to do any work, which may not be any physical or mental work but actually just donating some money.

An idea for you to explore locally- have you contacted the local historical society? Don't know how your's are but here they are actually really helpful and useful, doing everything from physical to virtual preservation of things. I've helped my local society on several projects, from preserving barns to preserving papers. I would think that a local professor, world traveler, author of many books, creator of a multi edition multi format game played internationally, with connections to the foundations and founders of the rpg and wargame industries, would be something they would be interested in. Or at the very least something they could help with.

Agreed; I'm pretty happy with what I've developed so far, but I'm at the point where extra hands are needed.

Great idea, but no, they are not. I asked. No funding, not part of the core mission, no people, on interest. They were very nice about it, but there's a huge difference between a donation of a single book or object and the donation of 500 cubic feet of stuff that needs specialist handling.

Well, boo. The problems museums/archives have with space and funding are something I'm very familiar with, having spent my fair share of time interning/volunteering at several of them; I was just hoping that UofM might have the resources and interest for something like Phil's work. Of course, universities are easy targets for budget hawks these days - my own alma mater is about to lay off its museum's curator because of budget cuts. I'd happily donate money to an institution to properly curate it all, but archaeology isn't exactly a lucrative profession.

I wonder if something along the lines of Patreon would work, where people make a small monthly donation to cover costs.

If you catered a reception at the U of MN libraries and got a bunch of people to show up dressed like rich folk and writing big checks, it's amazing how fast the U would change its mind.

Or any other museum.  Money talks, folks.

Quote from: Morandir;1037991Well, boo. The problems museums/archives have with space and funding are something I'm very familiar with, having spent my fair share of time interning/volunteering at several of them; I was just hoping that UofM might have the resources and interest for something like Phil's work. Of course, universities are easy targets for budget hawks these days - my own alma mater is about to lay off its museum's curator because of budget cuts. I'd happily donate money to an institution to properly curate it all, but archaeology isn't exactly a lucrative profession.

I wonder if something along the lines of Patreon would work, where people make a small monthly donation to cover costs.

Understood. I also understood their problems as well; it's all about funding, really.

I looked at this, but under the present regime it's going to be difficult due to the Foundation's policies. It's why Dave Morris is giving his RPG away for free, and I'm doing the same with my book. Unless you have 'favored nation' status, such as being an OSR person that the TF wants attached to the TF for the prestige of their name, you don't get anything like reasonable sub-licensing fees. A number of people have talked to me about projects, gone to the TF, and then walked away from the idea due to the issues of dealing with them.

Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1037994If you catered a reception at the U of MN libraries and got a bunch of people to show up dressed like rich folk and writing big checks, it's amazing how fast the U would change its mind.

Or any other museum.  Money talks, folks.

They'd better be real rich folks, and the checks had better be in the six figures range and had better not bounce. This has been tried on various institutions in recent years, and now some pretty deep background checks get run on the potential donors to make sure that there won't be any issues with the donation down the line.

What you say used to be true, but not any more. We live in a different world, my General.

Quote from: chirine ba kal;1037999They'd better be real rich folks, and the checks had better be in the six figures range and had better not bounce. This has been tried on various institutions in recent years, and now some pretty deep background checks get run on the potential donors to make sure that there won't be any issues with the donation down the line.

What you say used to be true, but not any more. We live in a different world, my General.

I was assuming the checks were good.  Essentially, you need to cough up some serious dough to get them to listen; your estimate of six figures is pretty much spot on.  For instance, the Boston Lyric Opera has a "Golden Circle" of donors contributing $1M or more.  It has six to eight names in it.

Doesn't seem like people are really disagreeing here. Museum space, effort, and of course actually doing something with the collection requires money. Money everyone agrees would be nice to be there, but isn't (and if anyone knows any of these donors willing to donate a million for a Tekumel museum exhibit, please don't hold back).

Quote from: Morandir;1037991Well, boo. The problems museums/archives have with space and funding are something I'm very familiar with, having spent my fair share of time interning/volunteering at several of them; I was just hoping that UofM might have the resources and interest for something like Phil's work.

I think that's the real rub of it. Interest in Phil's work (/belief that others are interested). And I think one has to come at it from the perspective of an outsider. Is this one U of M professor's work a big deal, unlike the other U of M professors whose family or fans insist they are a big deal, but really aren't? I'm sure there is a long list if hopefuls.

Grabbing a few professor-authors at pseudo-random, Aldo Leopold and Leo Buscaglia got foundations who preserve their work, but their alma maters appear not to be involved. One I'm casually watching is to see whether the University of Bolgnia will be making a Umberto Eco chair, foundation, or exhibit (still a little early to have happened, but getting late for nothing to be announced).

Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1038017I was assuming the checks were good.  Essentially, you need to cough up some serious dough to get them to listen; your estimate of six figures is pretty much spot on.  For instance, the Boston Lyric Opera has a "Golden Circle" of donors contributing $1M or more.  It has six to eight names in it.

Agreed. That's my read on the situation as well. Trying to put something like this together for Tekumel is going to be next to impossible, given the current situation, so I'm continuing to assume that anything needed is going to come out of my back pocket, like so much of Tekumel's publishing history has over the decades. Whether or not I have the patience, on the other hand...

Quote from: Willie the Duck;1038035Doesn't seem like people are really disagreeing here. Museum space, effort, and of course actually doing something with the collection requires money. Money everyone agrees would be nice to be there, but isn't (and if anyone knows any of these donors willing to donate a million for a Tekumel museum exhibit, please don't hold back).

I think that's the real rub of it. Interest in Phil's work (/belief that others are interested). And I think one has to come at it from the perspective of an outsider. Is this one U of M professor's work a big deal, unlike the other U of M professors whose family or fans insist they are a big deal, but really aren't? I'm sure there is a long list if hopefuls.

Grabbing a few professor-authors at pseudo-random, Aldo Leopold and Leo Buscaglia got foundations who preserve their work, but their alma maters appear not to be involved. One I'm casually watching is to see whether the University of Bolgnia will be making a Umberto Eco chair, foundation, or exhibit (still a little early to have happened, but getting late for nothing to be announced).

Understood. Phil was a professor in an obscure corner of an obscure linguistic specialty, and there's just wasn't a lot of interest in his work - academic and otherwise.

And I had real hopes for the Foundation, too, but it's a vehicle for a couple - three people's ambitions and not really what it says it is; a vehicle for Phil and his work. So it goes, I guess. I'll keep doing what I can, like I always have.

Quote from: chirine ba kal;1038050Understood. Phil was a professor in an obscure corner of an obscure linguistic specialty, and there's just wasn't a lot of interest in his work - academic and otherwise.

And I had real hopes for the Foundation, too, but it's a vehicle for a couple - three people's ambitions and not really what it says it is; a vehicle for Phil and his work. So it goes, I guess. I'll keep doing what I can, like I always have.

Linguists and students of indigenous history were delighted with Phil's work, but unfortunately, what he did doesn't translate into NYTimes bestsellers.

I honestly believe the Foundation's two biggest problems are lack of organization, and failure to realize the magnitude of the job.

I kind of sympathize with the last one -- after all, we thought that "if you build it, they will come" too.  I only wish our mangled corpses had served better as a cautionary tale pour l'encouragement des autres.

It seems to me that "it's" format and venue might matter as much as doing "it".  If you build what, who will come?  I think Tekumel's biggest obstacle is the shift in age and venue that came as rpgs moved out of hobby shops and into comic shops.  The earlier gamers were readers.  The problem now is that gamers generally haven't read anything, not even Lord of the Rings.  Oh they might have read Harry Potter in English class and saw some of the movies but they really have is a vast knowledge of bubblegum pop culture.  I wonder how EPT would do in India?  Bollywood seems much more related than Hollywood's latest butchering of King Arthur and Robinhood.  If I was trying to expand interest I'd be looking for a really well done comic series with lots of tits.  As much as the world around us is shocked and horrified by them, people like tits.  You need the strong visuals these days.  And the outrage over all the shocking display of nipples would probably boost sales and coverage.

Quote from: David Johansen;1038081It seems to me that "it's" format and venue might matter as much as doing "it".  If you build what, who will come?  I think Tekumel's biggest obstacle is the shift in age and venue that came as rpgs moved out of hobby shops and into comic shops.  The earlier gamers were readers.  The problem now is that gamers generally haven't read anything, not even Lord of the Rings.  Oh they might have read Harry Potter in English class and saw some of the movies but they really have is a vast knowledge of bubblegum pop culture.  I wonder how EPT would do in India?  Bollywood seems much more related than Hollywood's latest butchering of King Arthur and Robinhood.  If I was trying to expand interest I'd be looking for a really well done comic series with lots of tits.  As much as the world around us is shocked and horrified by them, people like tits.  You need the strong visuals these days.  And the outrage over all the shocking display of nipples would probably boost sales and coverage.

If EPT had been released in India about 1980 I bet they'd have been all over it.

Quote from: David Johansen;1038081The problem now is that gamers generally haven't read anything, not even Lord of the Rings.

You mean like the assclown in the Tolkien thread who claimed that horses are a Tolkien trope, despite admitting he'd never actually read Lord of the Rings?

Sometimes, "fatuous" doesn't seem a strong enough word.

Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1038064Linguists and students of indigenous history were delighted with Phil's work, but unfortunately, what he did doesn't translate into NYTimes bestsellers.

I honestly believe the Foundation's two biggest problems are lack of organization, and failure to realize the magnitude of the job.

I kind of sympathize with the last one -- after all, we thought that "if you build it, they will come" too.  I only wish our mangled corpses had served better as a cautionary tale pour l'encouragement des autres.

Agreed.

And, yes, I did warn them over and over again what they were getting into, but they blew me off. Which I wasn't all that surprised by as they'd spent well over a decade telling Phil what schmucks you and I were, and how much better a job they could do if only they we're in charge. Well, now they are, and your summation of their situation is all too accurate.

Quote from: David Johansen;1038081It seems to me that "it's" format and venue might matter as much as doing "it".  If you build what, who will come?  I think Tekumel's biggest obstacle is the shift in age and venue that came as rpgs moved out of hobby shops and into comic shops.  The earlier gamers were readers.  The problem now is that gamers generally haven't read anything, not even Lord of the Rings.  Oh they might have read Harry Potter in English class and saw some of the movies but they really have is a vast knowledge of bubblegum pop culture.  I wonder how EPT would do in India?  Bollywood seems much more related than Hollywood's latest butchering of King Arthur and Robinhood.  If I was trying to expand interest I'd be looking for a really well done comic series with lots of tits.  As much as the world around us is shocked and horrified by them, people like tits.  You need the strong visuals these days.  And the outrage over all the shocking display of nipples would probably boost sales and coverage.

I agree with your analysis. People do not read, as I have found out all too many times in my recent gaming experiences. I have very, very, very little in common with gamers these days and it really shows.